Help With Poorly Tetras

tess_774

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Hi, I'm new to the whole tropical fish thing, I decided to start out with something I thought would be easy to look after, Cardinal Tetra. I'm not sure what to do, I noticed they have bits of fin and tail missing so I treated the water for fin and tail rot, I haven't seen them eat and when I do a partial water change they sort of go dead, when I'm done they start swimming again



I bought a water testing kit, I dont have a clue what I'm doing and I dont know what this means or if it will make any sense to you, getting pictures of them is impossible.

Ph is 8
KH 10d
Nitrates no3 25
GH 10d
 
Hi Tess

Don't panic (well not yet anyway) tetras are quite delicate fish. We need to know lots of stuff before any of us can help.

What are your complete water stats

Nitrite
Nitrate
Ammonia
PH
KH
GH

How long has the tank been running?

Is it cycled?

How long have the fish been in for?

Are there faint white marks on the sides of the fish?

Any chance of piccys?

I'm going to be teaching for the rest of the day - but this info will help someone else who may be able to get to you sooner.

Good luck
 
Hi Tess

Don't panic (well not yet anyway) tetras are quite delicate fish. We need to know lots of stuff before any of us can help.

What are your complete water stats

Nitrite
Nitrate
Ammonia
PH
KH
GH

How long has the tank been running?

Is it cycled?

How long have the fish been in for?

Are there faint white marks on the sides of the fish?

Any chance of piccys?

I'm going to be teaching for the rest of the day - but this info will help someone else who may be able to get to you sooner.

Good luck





Hello, the tank has been running about a month now, I have done 1 water change so far as the instructions for the water treatment for fin and tail rot said not to do it until the course of treatment finished, I left the tank for a few weeks before putting fish in it, they havent got any white marks on them

Nitrate 25
Nitrite 10
General Hardness 10
Carbonate Hardness 3
pH 8.0
Chlorine 0

Thanks
 
Hi Tess

Don't panic (well not yet anyway) tetras are quite delicate fish. We need to know lots of stuff before any of us can help.

What are your complete water stats

Nitrite
Nitrate
Ammonia
PH
KH
GH

How long has the tank been running?

Is it cycled?

How long have the fish been in for?

Are there faint white marks on the sides of the fish?

Any chance of piccys?

I'm going to be teaching for the rest of the day - but this info will help someone else who may be able to get to you sooner.

Good luck





Hello, the tank has been running about a month now, I have done 1 water change so far as the instructions for the water treatment for fin and tail rot said not to do it until the course of treatment finished, I left the tank for a few weeks before putting fish in it, they havent got any white marks on them

Nitrate 25
Nitrite 10
General Hardness 10
Carbonate Hardness 3
pH 8.0
Chlorine 0

Thanks




I have pictures just dont know how to upload them :rolleyes:
 
Nitrite is high - it really needs to be as close to 0 as possible. Have you cycled your tank - if you're not sure what this means, look at the fish in cycling link at the bottom of my signature.

I think from what you've said that you are in a 'fish in' cycle. Get ready for plenty of water changes!To attach pictures, you need to upload them to photobucket or some other hosting site and use the insert image icon to link to that pictures web address. I use facebook to host my piccys - pure laziness!
 
Hello, thanks for all your help so far, can I get something from a pet shop to get the nitrites down? If I'm in a fish cycle how often do I do a water change now, the last one was sunday, from the looks of things I haven't cycled my tank and I'm still unsure what it means, Ive used facebook to add pictures If I've done it right!
 
Hello, thanks for all your help so far, can I get something from a pet shop to get the nitrites down? If I'm in a fish cycle how often do I do a water change now, the last one was sunday, from the looks of things I haven't cycled my tank and I'm still unsure what it means, Ive used facebook to add pictures If I've done it right!

Tank cycling is a long process that involves slowly growing bacteria to live in your filter. These bacteria process the natural waste produced by the fish and eventually (when you have enough bacteria of the correct species) will convert all the toxic waste into a relatively harmless substance.

There are two ways to do this - a fishless cycle and a fish-in cycle.

A fishless cycle involves the owner mannually adding waste to a fishless tank and building the bacteria before the fish are added, so that they will always have clean water. There is a very good link here.

A fish-in cycle uses the waste the fish produce to grow the bacteria. Here is a link.

Now, with a cycle the owner doesn't have to do much. The bacteria will naturally grow and it isn't something horrible and technical to be scared og. However, what you do need to be aware of is that in an un-cycled, cycling or unhealthy tank, there are not enough bacteria and so the fish get subjected to the toxic chemicals in their waste. It is the responsibility of the owner to test the water using a good quality test kit and ensure that there are no detectable levels of the waste products in the tank by doing large water changes. The bacteria will eventually take care of the tank but until then, you are responsible for keeping the fish in a poison free environment.

When I have cycled a tank with fish, I tested the water twice a day to make sure no waste had built up and did 75% water changes every time the waste was high enough to show on the test.

The waste chemicals you need to test for are ammonia and nitrite. Nitrate is the harmless end product. At low levels it is safe for fish and we just keep it in check with weekly or fortnightly water changes in the typical fish tank. Some tanks require more water changes and some can be maintained with less. For a beginner, I would recommend 25% a week once your tank is cycled. It is also good to have a test for pH and hardness, as these affect which fish you can keep and may affect how the bacteria grow. They will also indicate a real problem in the tank as they should be stable and if you notice the pH or hardness changing, that means there is a problem in the tank.

Now, you already have test kits. However, I did not see you post a result for ammonia and you posted a lot of other results which makes me think you have a strip test kit, with the results all on one stick? These are very inaccurate and also often give very poor advice as to which results are bad and what you should do about them. We always recommend getting a liquid master test kit, especially with a delicate species like cardinal tetras. It is very important to get accurate results from the tank as even very low levels of ammonia and nitrite do permanent damage to the fish.

What I advise is this:

Go out and get a liquid master test kit. I use the API one but Sera, Nutrafin and Salifert sell good test kits. Salifert are supposed to be really excellent but only sell the tests as indivduals, not a master kit. Make sure you have at least got liquid tests for ammonia and nitrite, even if you keep the strips for pH, nitrate and hardness.

Until you get a test kit, start doing 75% water changes every day. Once you have your kit, test the water 12 hours after your last water change and post the results here. If you see nitrite or ammonia at anything above 0 (even 0.25) do a large water change.

When you change the water, make sure you add a 2x dose of water conditioner. Use a good quality water conditioner like Seachem Prime or Stress Coat +. These water conditioners are much more effective at removing all the nasties from the water and Stress Coat even adds Aloe Vera to the water and helps replace the slime coat on the fish, which is a natural barrier to disease and gets depleated when the fish are stressed. Cheaper water conditioners often only remove chlorine and you need one that removes chlorine, chloramine and heavy metals.

Make sure you turn the filter and heater off and leave to cool for 15 minutes.

To remove the water, use a syphon or gravel cleaner. This allows you to carefully remove the water in a controlled way while also cleaning the gravel. This is essential as lots of fish poo and uneaten food fester in the gravel and make the water more toxic. Be careful of the fish :)

Have some new water prepared. You can use a mix of hot and cold water to get it to a similar temperature to the tank. Add the water conditioner, mix it in and then use a clean jug with no detergent residues to gently add the water back into the tank. It's best to have a bucket and jug specifically for the fish!

Using this method will put minimal stress on the fish and help keep their environment toxin free.

Here is a link to our Resource Centre. This covers all the foundation material that is essential for fishkeeping.
 
Great advice from Assaye there :good: I did fish in cycling and it worked for me... I did kick off with some hardy fish 'tho. I did 50% water changes every day for a couple of weeks and tested twice a day. After that I changed water every time I saw a 'spike' - maybe I got lucky?

Read the articles and good luck. Keep us posted with your progress. Don't despair, it's worth it in the end
 
I will do a water change once a day and add the water conditioner, I'll try and post my water testing kit results, I work long hours so Its hard to find the time, yes it is a strip one but I wont be able to purchase the one you recommend till next week.

Hopefully I'll get there in the end, thanks :shout:
 
How's them fishies doing Tess?


Hello

Water results for today are:

Nitrate 50
Nitrite 5
General Hardness 16
Carbonated Hardness 10
pH 8.0
Chlorine 0.8

They seem a lot more active than a few days ago, I've been doing daily 50% water changes but I still haven't seen them eat anything, I only have 5 of them and they are in a 20l tank, were you able to see the pictures I tried to upload?
 
One thing I noticed is I keep getting see through jelly stuff on the suckers on the heater, do you know what this is?
 
Nirite is still really, really bad. Anything above zero is bad but even "small numbers" like 4 or 5 are highly dangerous. The fish won't necessarily show the effects now - they might suddenly get sick in a few weeks or die out of the blue at some point.

I would do larger wahter changes - try a few 80% ones - and see if you can do them twice a day or more. 20 litres is a tiny tank and the water changes don't need to take very long at all.

You're doing a great job so far but your fish are producing soooo much waste and the filter just can't keep up. Stop feeding them for 2-3 days and keep up with some bigger water changes.

Just to check - is it 5 rather than 0.5, right?
 
Hi, I'd say It's about a 3 after I've done another water change, Isn't it getting rid of all the good bacteria though by keep changing the water?
 
Hi, I'd say It's about a 3 after I've done another water change, Isn't it getting rid of all the good bacteria though by keep changing the water?

No. Some pet shops will tell you this and it's false.

The good bacteria live in the filter - they can't survive very well anywhere else in a filtered tank. Changing the water removes the waste products that are hurting the fish and that the bacteria cannot yet feed on. Basically, you're doing the equivalent of throwing left-overs in the bin after dinner.

You need to get the nitrites down some more. even 3 is far too high. Anything detectable is very, very dangerous. Levels like 0.25 and 0.5 are a bit less worrying and can be managed in other ways (although water changes are always best). Levels above 0.5 are really, really dangerous so 3 is a catastrophe.

If you're only getting them down to 3 from 5, that implies you're not doing large enough water changes. A 50% water change should halve the number, so it should be 2.5 down from 5. This still isn't enough - you need to do more than one water change a day and take about 80% of the water out. Make sure you clean the gravel with a gravel vacuum when you do.
 

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