Goldfish in 5 gallon??

[Raechal]

I agree that it may be too small for 3 female bettas especially if it is a hex. Unless your female bettas were like my Pea Princess and is only 1 inch and hasn't grown in months. I am seriously thinking she is a miniature. What about a dwarf gourami?

 

[Synirr]

Instinct and Memory are two very different things, it like riding a bike, once you have learnt it, it doesnt leave you, you dont need a great memory span to remember that

[...]

Now the best fish though to stick into a 5 gallon as a pair, are known as the carnival goldfish, reason this being, is because this type of goldfish is mainly won in carnivals and fairs, they are the small goldfish suitable to a 5 gallon tank, we had two veiltail goldfish that was won from a local fair, they live twice the age of a normal goldfish and they only lived in a 5 gallon tank...

Are you comparing learning to ride a bike to instinct? It sounds like you are, and they're quite different things. There are many different types of memory, and while goldfish short-term memory may be extremely short, I'm of the opinion that they do have some form of long-term memory.

"Carnival goldfish" are just the cheapest goldfish you can buy. They are not some magical form of midget goldfish that you can keep in a 5 gallon. They're usually just common goldfish. Goldfish can easily reach 10 years in age, and it's not entirely uncommon for them to live over 20 years, so if your carnival goldfish lived to twice the age of a normal goldfish, all I can say is that they were pretty darn old.

Raechal: I have a tiny little girl like that!! She's my favourite. I bought her small and she has just never gotten any bigger
She has a 5 gallon all to herself and has a wonderful personality.

 

[OohFeeshy]

Yep, 'carnival' goldfish are common goldfish, as they are the cheapest. If they lived in a 5 gallon, well, that doesn't mean they are the miniature species all fish keepers wish for, it means they couldn't grow anymore. But I really think you should go with killies, they are gorgeous..... and you can get ickle baby killies as easily as breathing. Get a cape lopez lyretail pair.

 

[BettaMomma]

So....
after hearing all the good points, I think I've decided to get some cutie little dwarf platies.

Here's my dilemma...
the tank is still set up from when Amos was in it.
He's been out of it now for about a week and a half. I've tossed in a pinch of food, but that was about 1 week ago. It was already cycled when he went into it about 2 weeks ago - I haven't done any water changes to date.

I need some advice here on how to proceed - so I need to dump everything and start a cycle over? Or can I work with what I have?

I dunno what's left over in there from Amos - he got a nasty case of ick in there, and eventually died (as we all know) from a combo of many things, but that was after he was moved back to a 2.5G tank.

Suggestions??

 

[OohFeeshy]

Well, are you going to sterilize the tank? You can keep everything, just boil it all. You'll need to cycle again. Use gravel from your other bettas tanks and find some filter media from a tank that has fish in it (ie. borrow some)

 

[BettaMomma]

I don't have any other betta tanks that are "established".
They all get 100% water changes. I will sterilize the tank and start over with a fishless cycle.

I HATE CYCLING.
uugh
THIS is why I keep bettas.

ooOOoOoh grr

 

[OohFeeshy]

It'll be worth it in the end

 

[BettaMomma]

Yeah, I know.
I am just SOOOOo very impatient, I wanna buy my fish and be looking at them swimming around in their new tank the same day it gets set up. I'm such a little kid trapped in a 30 year old woman's body!

I'm going to go out to the office today and get the 5G tank.
I'll get the sterilization process done today and at least kick off the cycle.

I may be back with questions on that, because I'm STILL not 100% sure that I fully understand how to go about it.

 

[OohFeeshy]

I know how it feels, I wanted to get fish straight away for my 5g. But I gave in, and the 3 guppies kicked the bucket...... Its better to have nice healthy fish in a cycled tank than dead ones...

 

[sylvia]

Even if you do 100% water changes, as long as the water is de-chlorinated (which it should be for the sake of the fish...), there will be some beneficial bacteria in the gravel (provided you have gravel ) so you can still use this to speed up the cycle.


Zenn, no offense but you REALY need to do some research.

'Goldfish' is NOT a general name for all coldwater pond fish! Goldfish (include, common, veiltale, black moore, bubbleeye, celestial, fan-tail, pom pom, ranchu, ryukin, wakin and all other fancy selectively bred varieties) are carassius auratus. They are NOT the same as koi etc... Koi are cyprinnus carpio, darters and those other random coldwater fish you mentioned are NOT goldfish.

You said that larger fish have bigger brains therefor are smarter and also said that fish don't 'remember'. My platies (as an example) come to the surface when I feed flake (obviously). The next day, they will go to the surface again when they see me approaching. However, if I feed them sinking pellets, they have to go to the bottom to eat - the next day when I approach, they go to the bottom - now that isn't just instinct - they actualy remmber what I did the day before. Notice that platies are smaller than goldfish.

As for size - ALL goldfish grow to AT LEAST 6". True, some of the more selectively bred VARIETIES of carassius auratus are smaller but NONE of them remain at 2". Only a pair of 2" goldfish could be kept in a 5 gallon - and those simply do NOT exist! Even then, this would apply to tropicals. Goldfish are MUCH messier and produce a lot more waste so require a larger tank to dilute the ammonia.

The 'carnival' goldfish you mentioned are typically commons. Sometimes they are commets or sarassa comets and occasionaly you'll get a nice shubunkin - these all grow to 12". Fantails also get to at least 8" and veiltails typicaly to 10".

NO goldfish is suited to a 5 gallon tank! SOME varieties can be kept in a 10 gallon but most need at least a 20 gallon with 10 gallons for each additional goldfish.

The fact that they are very messy and social as well means they require a bigger tank still if they are to thrive.

Now I know this discussion is over but you realy need to get your facts straight - I suggest you do a google search on goldfish and try to find some good sites - I suggest this for a start: http/www.bristol-aquarists.org.uk/

 

[BettaMomma]

Hey hey hey...
let's get off the goldfish topic - I'm not getting them anymore.

I AM however thinking of a different plan.
And I'm not telling anyone until it's done.

I just need to get a tad bit more info and then I'm set.

And when I do 100% water changes, I rinse all my gravel in scalding hot water and shake it up so i'm pretty sure all the beneficial bacteria goes down the drain with the water. Doesn't it?

 

[BettaMomma]

OH...
one thing I thought I'd throw in here about "goldfish"...

my grandmother, against my kicking, screaming and ranting and raving fits, has 2 goldfish - about 2" each - in a 2.5 minibow. AND she does 100% water changes, right out of the tap - and I am pretty sure she doesn't dechlorinate. I've tried sneaking them out of the house with me, but I have a 7 hour drive home after I leave her house, and i'm pretty sure she'd scratch her head, wonder where her fishes went, and go out and buy more just like them.

Dont ANY of you start going off on my grandma or there'll be some problems. lol

I have told her she is wrong in doing this, ranted and raved and pitched fits EVERY time I go over there, but she will not listen. And, since I live so far away from her there's not much I can do about it.
I just go off on her (very respectfully, of course!) every time I see them.

They've lived that way for almost a year. They seem perfectly happy and swim all over the place. Odd, I know.
Something must be going right.

 

[OohFeeshy]

And when I do 100% water changes, I rinse all my gravel in scalding hot water and shake it up so i'm pretty sure all the beneficial bacteria goes down the drain with the water. Doesn't it?

Yep, but if you get a filter ('OMG! A filter!' I hear you cry ) you don't need to do 100% water changes. And if you just rinse it in old tank water, you won't loose many. And if you get paranoid about disease, you could add a bit of salt to your tanks.

Oh, yeah, about your grandma. Since she does water changes, and 100% ones, the ammonia build up won't be quite as much. And she might not have much chlorine in her tap water. And well, a years not really that long for a goldfish. Not when they are meant to live at least 10 years. I've had my mum pointing out the same kind of examples.... 'Oh, my friend has seven goldfish in a foot long tank (which I assume to be about 10g). They're 4 inches long and as happy as larry'.
Oh, did the fish tell her that? Ah well, never mind. Its not like I can do much, and I did manage to pursuade mum that goldfish of any king don't grow to the size of the tank by pointing at the adult sizes of goldfish in pets at home. I said that the smallest was only a centimetre smaller than the width of my tank. And why would pets at home lie about the sizes? Well, they would, but she didn't know that...

 

[sylvia]

Goldfish can live to be over 30 years old and are incredibly hardy. One year alive is nothing.

And yes, you are right about the hot water killing the bacteria Oh well... You could borrow some gravel from an LFS maybe? Or some filter media even?

Can't wait to here your plan...

 

[BettaMomma]

OKAY kids...
I wasn't trying to prove any of you wrong by telling you my grandma had kept a fish in such ridiculous conditions for a WHOLE year. JUST wanted to tell you that these amazing fish have managed to stay alive that way. That's all, nothing else.

I'm hereby officially closing the discussion on goldfish cuz, quite frankly, I don't really care about it anymore and it's starting to irritate me. (Can ya tell?) lol

I have decided that what I'll do with my dilemma is this:
I'm going tank shopping today, going to pick up a nice new 12G eclipse, a couple more betta girlies, and some more plants of course.... and more pebble rocks too i guess... then donate my 5G to my grama so her fish can at least have a few more inches to swim around in. Whattya think?
Win win situation for everyone, I think...

Be back later w/pics.