Brilliant, I never argued that you're better than us over 20 years, I know you were or even over 10 years. But over the most recent 5 years, ie recent history we've been better than you in both league position and trophies won. If you want to go longer, fine, go look up 30 years or 40 years, after all what relevance has 20 years got that 30 hasn't? Even better how about looking since you were born? Since Aug 1981 (according to your profile) Liverpool have won 6 leagues, 5 FA Cups, 6 League cups, 2 European Cups and a Uefa Cup, we also were reigning European champions and holders of the league cup when you were born. Arsenal won 5 leagues, 5 FA Cups, 2 League cups, 0 European Cups, 0 Uefa cups. Now if you want me to include the 7 charity shields (Arsenal 5), 1 super cup (arsenal 0), 2 European super cup (Arsenal 0) then I'm happy to. Or we can do it from when I was born, 10 years before you but then it would just get embarrasing for you because Arsenal won absolutely nothing for that whole 10 years.
Basically over the 5 years Rafa has been at Liverpool we've been better than Arsenal, sadly neither of us matching Chelsea or Manyoo. You're the one who doesn't like Liverpool harping on about history, yet you are quoting 20 year old stats, so if you do want to bring up history you are on a loser as we've won the league, league cup, european cup, eufa cup and charity shield more times than Arsenal, in fact the FA Cup is the only proper trophy you've won more than us.
So contrary to your incorrect declaration, all the stats do not prove Arsenal are better, they prove that in the short term Liverpool are and in the long term Liverpool are
You can tell me how many games Eboue or Fabregas played all you like along with how many minutes they played etc, but
YOUR statement was that "we have
zero players now that played for us in the 2006 champions league final....." when in fact 3 of your players actually played in the final and 3 more were on the bench. You keep accusing me of massive exaggeration, yet there you are massively wrong. You can't claim they weren't there or weren't good enough, they were in the Champions League final squad.
The fact that these players were even in the first team squad back then brings stability, they are established players by virtue of the fact that they have been there that long and for 6 of the current team to have been in the Champions League final squad means they were good enough back then. Compare to Liverpool who have 2 players that were here when Rafa arrived. Whether players were on loan or not doesn't matter they were Arsenal players and are settled there, we have no players that were even on loan back then.
Those players were all at Arsenal that year, playing or not doesn't matter they were there then which means they are now established having been on the books for 5 years as first teamers along with time in the youth squads. By the way Senderos has played in 2 games for you this season including the cup game against us and has been described as a "new start" for him by Wenger. By the way I listed Song as being there in 2004/05 which was wrong, but you didn't sign him in 2006 as you claim in your dull list, he played in the league for you in sept 2005 against Everton and another 4 other appearances in the league and 4 more in the various cups. (that's what you'd call another massive exaggeration
)
You clearly aren't understanding that players that are established now didn't need to be first choice then, they simply needed to be at the club. Regardless of all that, Arsene has been there for much longer so players that have left in the last 5 years were his players too and he presumably chose to let them go. The fact that players came through the youth team further helps them become established, before they got into the first team they were schooled in the way Arsenal want them to play where signings have to get used to that then they get gradually added to the first team.
You asked where Kenny Dalglish is? He came back in the summer to help out with the academy as we've had a poor one for years under the stewardship of Rick Parry and hopefully he'll be able to get it back on track.
I like the lazy striker accusation, current top scorer (3 clear of the allegedly superior RVP) despite his injuries and listed in the world player shortlist as is Gerrard, though I note that Fabregas didn't make it along with the rest of the Arsenal squad
I'm not going to belittle Fabregas, I think he's a fantastic talent, but has he inspired Arsenal to win a trophy? No, but Gerrard has, they even refer to the 2006 FA Cup as the Gerrard final, he also inspired the 2005 champions League win, when Fabregas has done that for Arsenal, then maybe he'll be in the same class. But if you really do think the whole of the rest of our squad is worse than yours, it makes our outperforming you over 5 years even more remarkable
What's the point of listing all the games of the last 9 seasons? Either keep it at the time Rafa has been there or Arsene has been at Arsenal or over all time. So bearing in mind that Rafa has been there since the 2004/05 season it reads quite close (assuming your list is right):
League, played 10, Liverpool 3 - Arsenal 3 - Draw 4
FA Cup, played 1, Arsenal 1
League cup, played 2, Arsenal 2
Champions League, played 2, Liverpool 1 - Draw one
and yet having knocked us out of 3 cups, you've gone on to win NONE of them and in the league it's dead level, but you've still been below us in 3 of the 5 seasons including last year.
As for your last post, as you have 7 players who were at Arsenal in 2004/05 and we have 2 you can't possibly believe that we have more players who are established, quite simply they aren't. In fact of our first team regulars only Carra and Gerrard were here in 2004 and only Reina was here before 2006, all the rest including Torres, Mascherano, Agger, Skrtel, babel, Kuyt, Benayoun, Insua, Aurelio, Riera, Lucas, Ngog, Voronin were all bought in 2006 onwards.
I like how you think that we played an established team against your kids in the carling cup, you do realise you actually fielded six full internationals don't you? Along with Gibbs and Ramsey who've both played in over 20 games. Merida did well to score on his debut and it was a cracking goal too, Aquilani may have scored one on his debut had Senderos (the one you say hasn't played this season) not caught the ball
I suspect if you added the number of first team appearances up between the teams (I'll let you do that because I can't be bothered), there wont be much in it as Aquilani was making his first team debut, and Krygiakos and Degan have 4 appearances each and Spearing and Plessis are hardly ESTABLISHED first team players either with 5 and 8 appearances.
While I can't claim to have OCD and be bipolar, I am cantankerous, intelligent and capable of checking facts and have a memory that lasts longer than 20 years and remembers the last 5 quite well too.
Would you like any more education about my club, your club or football in general?
Arfie
