Fishless Cycling

[Dunkal]

I have been doing fishless cycle for about 5 weeks now and Ammonia levels are not coming down quick but the Nitrite levels have come down to zero. Any One know why that could be??

 

[Underwurlde]

Well, the 1st set of bacteria grow on ammonia.
The 2nd set grow on the nitrite levels produced by the first set.

Therefore high levels of ammonia does not necessarily go hand in hand with high levels of nitrite.

Looks to me like the levels of ammonia munching bacteria have hit a certain level and the nitirite munching bunch have risen to a level to match the nitrite produced by the ammonia munching crew.

So, the question is why havn't the levels of ammonia munching bacteria grown to match the levels of ammonia in the tank?

Therefore:
Q) how many litres is your tank?
Q) what kind of filter & What media in it?
Q) how much ammonia are you putting into the tank?

Andy

 

[Amunet]

What are the ammonia readings? How quickly do the nitrite lvls get to 0? How much ammonia are you putting in?
What sort of tester are you using? Liquid? Test strip?
What are your pH lvls at? Nitrate lvls?

 

[Tommy Gun]

Therefore high levels of ammonia does not necessarily go hand in hand with high levels of nitrite.

Can you clarify that a little bit for us? I am not sure what you mean...if the production of nitrites is the result of ammonia being 'eaten' or oxidized by Good Bacteria Type A, then the levels would each would be dependant on each other, at least in my mind.

Any One know why that could be??

Could be a significant decline in the bacteria which 'eats' or oxidizes ammonia into nitrites for one reason or another. Have you done anything differently lately and/or noticed anything different? What are you using as your source of ammonia? If pure ammonia, are you sure that it is a pure form and not one which might contain other chemicals that would harm the bacteria? If using some sort of organic matter to provide an eventual source of ammonia, have you had any lags in adding more?

I am also interested to know how much ammonia you are adding to the tank since there is a such a thing as too much ammonia.

Also, have you checked the ammonia and nitrite levels of your tap water (or whatever water source you are using)? It is possible that your water contains chloramines, which is a bonded molecule of ammonia and chlorine (as I understand it), hence, perhaps when you are using a chlorine remover, there is an over abundance of ammonia.

 

[Underwurlde]

Can you clarify that a little bit for us? I am not sure what you mean...if the production of nitrites is the result of ammonia being 'eaten' or oxidized by Good Bacteria Type A, then the levels would each would be dependant on each other, at least in my mind.

Yes, but you've missed a bit, it is also dependant on the the levels (amount) of type A bacteria present, that can only do a certain amount of chomping.

So, you might have say 100% ammonia, all ready to be chomped. But only 50% of the levels of type A bacteria which would only chomp 50% of the ammonia into nitrite. You then could have 100% type B bacteria (matching the resultant 50% nitrite evels) that would then chomp 100% of the 50% of the chomped ammonia.

I'm not making sense, am I?

Andy

 

[Dunkal]

Can you clarify that a little bit for us? I am not sure what you mean...if the production of nitrites is the result of ammonia being 'eaten' or oxidized by Good Bacteria Type A, then the levels would each would be dependant on each other, at least in my mind.

Yes, but you've missed a bit, it is also dependant on the the levels (amount) of type A bacteria present, that can only do a certain amount of chomping.

So, you might have say 100% ammonia, all ready to be chomped. But only 50% of the levels of type A bacteria which would only chomp 50% of the ammonia into nitrite. You then could have 100% type B bacteria (matching the resultant 50% nitrite evels) that would then chomp 100% of the 50% of the chomped ammonia.

I'm not making sense, am I?

Andy

 

[Dunkal]

I have 70 litre juwel tank and use pure ammonia, adding about 2 ml every night.
Nitrites is still zero and ammonia comes down about 1.5 ppm over 24 hrs.
I am using api liquid test kit and tap water has no ammonia.
What do i do next??

 

[Tommy Gun]

Are you also testing for nitrates? Sounds as if you might be skipping any visual sign of nitrites completely...perhaps because you have enough bacteria 'b' to deal with the amount of nitrites being produced by bacteria 'a'...but not yet enough bacteria 'a' to deal with all of the ammonia you are supplying to the tank. Obviously this is just one scenario and I am not trying to imply that it is exactly what is happening.

I'm not making sense, am I?

Some....you are saying something close to what I explained above, right? I didn't mean to imply you were wrong or anything, the way you explained it just didn't 'click' in my normally jumbled mind right away.

 

[Dunkal]

Nitrates have been very low, I have a nitrate media in my filter.
Nitrites have have spiked a lot for about 20 days and then all of a sudden one day they just went down and stayed down where as Ammonia levels have never came down. I have added a few ml of Stress zyme to see if this helps.
This is my first attempt of fishless cycling, not going to well.
I feel like giving up...lol

 

[Underwurlde]

Some....you are saying something close to what I explained above, right? I didn't mean to imply you were wrong or anything, the way you explained it just didn't 'click' in my normally jumbled mind right away.

Yes, we are singing from the same hymn sheet - just not in tune (well, I'm not anyway, esp after re-reading my drivel above - it's late, I'm tired).

LOL

Andy

PS regularly add a couple of pinches of Bicarbonate of Soda - this is the 'other' type of food that bacteria need.

 

[littlest]

are you sure your nitrite is zero? the reason I asked is that the API test kits, when nitrite gets really high, the test kit can't measure it and the test goes clear or greeny coloured. I know that myself and others have been confused by this so thought I'd mention it.
If nitrite is zero the drops should be pale blue as they go in, and the test should stay pale blue for the five minutes. If it is so high it can't be read the drops will be purpley coloured as they go in and the test will then turn clear or greyish or pale green.

 

[LynnJ]

I just finish cycle my tank. I went through a lot but once I managed to control the level I was well okay.

1. I didn't have a nitrate test so I never checked that before.....
2. Check the PH. If is below 7 everything will stop and you will just get the same results. Just add one teaspoon of bicarbonate of soda and make sure the temp is around 89F. If is too hot you will kill the bacteria.
3. Take 2ml of tank water and dilute with 6ml of tap water and check your nitrite. The API test is very complicated.

The first time apart from using the wrog ammonia but it took me forever. Once I started again only 3 weeks for my 30G that is about 112 L

I hope this will help you.

 

[Dunkal]

The colour of nitrite test is pale blue. It never changes colour when i add the drops.
My ph is around about 6. Does this mean I am always going to get the same results??
If i add bicarbonate soda will this change the test results??

 

[Amunet]

Actually.. pH of 6.0+ is ok. When it starts getting below 6 is when you might want to think about raising it some. That's the problem we have with our water. Once the water sits in the tank the pH drops so much that it stops the bacteria causing the ammonia to build up and such which is why I have to add baking soda into the tanks whenever I do a water change.

You could add some baking soda to your tank and see if it helps. Since there aren't any fish it's not gonna hurt to raise the pH some to see if it causes something to happen.
Add in a little bit at a time, maybe a teaspoon or so and then test after a few hours to see what the pH is at. Baking soda only has a pH of around 8.0 so even if you do add alot of baking soda you don't have to worry about pH skyrocketing or anything.

 

[Dunkal]

Thanks for the replies guys. I have added a teaspoon of bicarbonate soda and checked ph and its gone pretty high. I have been doing this fishless cycle for 5 weeks now...lol and am wondering if its ever gonna happen!!