Done with neon tetras, can you recommend other tankmates?

[StevenF]

HVDC was not available when Edison was promoting DC cycctems. DC and AC at the same volt are equally dangerous. There is no real safety advantage. The only difference that maters is that AC power at the time could be transmitted over longer distances with lower losses than was possible with DC at the time.

 

[itiwhetu]

HVDC was not available when Edison was promoting DC cycctems. DC and AC at the same volt are equally dangerous. There is no real safety advantage. The only difference that maters is that AC power at the time could be transmitted over longer distances with lower losses than was possible with DC at the time.

I always understood DC power was more dangerous, because if you encounter it, you can't let go unlike with AC which is pulsating so you can remove yourself from the source. If that makes any sense.

 

[Byron]

Thanks. I can only see the abstract though, or I would have to purchase it. I am interested, but not that interested.

Don't understand this, I see and have downloaded the entire paper. [I have never paid for any scientific papers, most are free though not all certainly.] Maybe try Google Chrome as your browser, load Google Scholar, then search as above.

 

[StevenF]

Cory is doing well, no issues there. The neons look good, but WITHIN THE HOUR 2 die. I saw them starting to break from the others, slow down, and literally in the time I go to the kitchen to grab a drink and I come back, they're both dead. I already am thinking here we effin' go again.

H, 30 ppm, kH, 80 ppm. Same results across all 3 of my tanks.

Note you never provided your measured PH.


Normally in nature the gh and KH in tap water comes from calcium carbonate and magnesium carbonate. The KH test detects carbonate while the GH test detects calcium and magnesium. So you would expect natural water to gh and KH approximately equal. And in fresh water this typically results in a PH of about 7. However during treatment the water is sterilized typically with chlorine. The chlorination process destroys some of the KH. So tap water should have less KH than GH.

Your GH and KH numbers indicate that the utility may've added sodium bicarbonate to increase PH and to reduce corrosion of lead pipes. Reducing lead is good but neon tetras normally live in soft water i=with a little pit of sodium and potassium. However if you add sodium bicarbonate to increase PH you end up having water with a lot of sodium and little potassium. An imbalance. In people a potassium sodium imbalance can cause kidney problems and death. It can cill people in hours. It is the only thing I can think of that would kill your fish quickly. Some speacies would handle it better than others.

I did look at the boston water quality report but unfortunately it didn't have enough information in it to determine if you have a sodium potassium issues.

The only solution to this problem I know of is to mix ro or distilled water with your tap water to reduce the sodium levels. cutting the Gh in half would should cut sodium and potassium levels in half. hopefully that would help. I would recommend keeping your no lower than 10ppm.

 

[dR3ws3r]

I always understood DC power was more dangerous, because if you encounter it, you can't let go unlike with AC which is pulsating so you can remove yourself from the source. If that makes any sense.

It is believed that the AC is usually five times more harmful than the DC. The high frequency of AC is the primary reason for the severe effects on human bodies. It has sixty circles of frequency, which is incredibly damaging. Note that even a small frequency of about twenty-five volts voltage can kill you. This shows how dangerous AC can be if not handle with a lot of care.

AC causes hard contraction of the muscles and sweating, which reduces skin resistance. If you are in a situation where a person is directly exposed to AC, it is advisable to free them from the contact as soon as possible to avoid significant injuries or death. Simply because the longer contact victim has with the AC voltage, the further skin resistance reduces, causing death

Copied that from the interwebs ... because I thought AC was more dangerous but couldn't explain it quite that well. I believe that AC is cheaper/easier to produce. And you can easily rectify AC to DC.

 

[dR3ws3r]

Don't understand this, I see and have downloaded the entire paper. [I have never paid for any scientific papers, most are free though not all certainly.] Maybe try Google Chrome as your browser, load Google Scholar, then search as above.

No change with Chrome. I even registered this time. Seems like the options at the top are to pay, or use my institution. I graduated about 100 years ago, so I doubt I could use my college.

 

[outofwater]

Was the batch at the store just shipped in? Could have just been from all the time in transit. Fish stores should wait a few days at least before selling new fish.

Found out later that indeed, those neons had literally arrived at the store the same day I got them

How heavily planted is your tank? and I'm still interested in knowing the pH.

Answering specifically because I appreciate the great feedback I get here. The quarantine tank has floaters (duckweed and giant duckweed) some short (carpeting) plants which name I forget, 1 ludwigia shoot, and 3 fern shoots.

Note you never provided your measured PH.


Normally in nature the gh and KH in tap water comes from calcium carbonate and magnesium carbonate. The KH test detects carbonate while the GH test detects calcium and magnesium. So you would expect natural water to gh and KH approximately equal. And in fresh water this typically results in a PH of about 7

The answer was buried in another post, thanks for asking. 7 to 7.2, across all 3 of my tanks

No change with Chrome. I even registered this time. Seems like the options at the top are to pay, or use my institution. I graduated about 100 years ago, so I doubt I could use my college.

How did we get to discussing electricity and AC vs DC is a mystery to me. All I have to contribute to this is that Edison's public electrocution of animals to discredit Tesla and AC kind of seals the deal for me in that debate that was an asshole move

 

[itiwhetu]

So, I don't know if any recommendations have been made. But with a pH of just above 7 I would suggest you look at Cherry Barbs or Checkered Barbs as an alternative to neons

 

[outofwater]

So, I don't know if any recommendations have been made. But with a pH of just above 7 I would suggest you look at Cherry Barbs or Checkered Barbs as an alternative to neons

Angels as a centerpiece are out. Adding a school of cherry barbs seems like a great option. I also had looked at harlequin rasboras, and was even contemplating fancy guppies, although I recall reading and have observed in my tank at least that the neons can get a bit nippy on occasion. There's another fish that I saw and really liked, I'll get the name or picture of it in a few days.

I plan on a redo of my 29g in the coming weeks, I want to organize the plants a bit more, I honestly am not sure if it's well planted or not enough, and on top of it the look just isn't doing it for me. As part of the redo I plan on changing the background to just a matte black. This is what it looks like right now, minus the triceratops head, which I removed recently

 

[itiwhetu]

As a center piece fish think about something like a Pearl Gourami. Without the neon's a couple of Angels would work in this tank as well.

 

[davros]

Read this thread a few times, still don't see how we segued to AC DC. The convenience of the AC transformer could not be beat allowing step up for transmission and thus reduced I2R losses, and step down at the user end. Mechanical inverters and rectifier were ugly. Silicon semiconductors saved us

Looking back eons ago I would buy the "feeder" sized neons and about half would survive any length of time. I recently bought about 30 White clouds of similar size and a month later they have all grown and are still health.

 

[Byron]

Angels as a centerpiece are out. Adding a school of cherry barbs seems like a great option. I also had looked at harlequin rasboras, and was even contemplating fancy guppies, although I recall reading and have observed in my tank at least that the neons can get a bit nippy on occasion. There's another fish that I saw and really liked, I'll get the name or picture of it in a few days.

I plan on a redo of my 29g in the coming weeks, I want to organize the plants a bit more, I honestly am not sure if it's well planted or not enough, and on top of it the look just isn't doing it for me. As part of the redo I plan on changing the background to just a matte black. This is what it looks like right now, minus the triceratops head, which I removed recently

There appear to be floating plants, that is very good. Lower plants are fine (numbers) though is algae an issue? That's another factor.

As for fish, we have very soft water (GH is 30 ppm), pH is 7.2, and KH is 80 ppm which in my expectation will allow the pH to lower. No problems here, just stay with very soft water fish. There are so many options, I would not crowd the tank with "commoners."

 

[outofwater]

There appear to be floating plants, that is very good. Lower plants are fine (numbers) though is algae an issue? That's another factor.

Yep, have duckweed and "giant" duckweed. Ahs had algae issues that by now are almost done with (this picture was from a month ago) I tweaked light intensity and duration and the algae went away, it was growing on all the plants and starting to be a problem on the glass too.

As for fish, we have very soft water (GH is 30 ppm), pH is 7.2, and KH is 80 ppm which in my expectation will allow the pH to lower. No problems here, just stay with very soft water fish. There are so many options, I would not crowd the tank with "commoners."

Lol, the commoners. The tank looks naked/crowded, if that makes sense. The background makes it look as if there are more plants than there actually are there, and the lack of any large "centerpiece" big fish or large shoal just makes it look sparse and like an afterthought.

There's one amazon sword, one java fern, an unruly moss ball, three wisterias that have grown back after that demented gourami nearly ate them all while he was there, and 4 ludwigias, 1 red and 3 "regular" ones if memory serves right, which I've already trimmed once to get shoots for the gourami tank and the quarantine one.

There's one more plant that the gourami also decimated, two or 3 very small and nearly entirely eaten stalks survived and have made a comeback, although very slow and don't seem to grow tall. The leaves look a lot like wide parsley and remain very close to the bottom.

My plan is to change the background as I mentioned earlier, and put the plants in a more organized way (try to keep the same types together instead of randomly, as they are now)

Oh, almost forgot, there are 2 bamboo stalks there too, all the way in the back.

I took the bubbler off, although the tiki heads and air line remain. Thinking of swapping that for driftwood as part of the redo and take the air line out completely.

Back to the stock question... I think once there is more contrast, a school of cherry barbs or some of the other fish mentioned (pearl gourami, guppies, harlequin rasboras or the other one that I still have to identify) will do, so long as they are compatible with the tank parameters and current inhabitants of course. And of course add a few more ottos do that lone survivor has some buddies to hang with.

Just listing it and thinking about it makes me tired and giddy at the same time.

 

[outofwater]

There appear to be floating plants, that is very good. Lower plants are fine (numbers) though is algae an issue? That's another factor.

As for fish, we have very soft water (GH is 30 ppm), pH is 7.2, and KH is 80 ppm which in my expectation will allow the pH to lower. No problems here, just stay with very soft water fish. There are so many options, I would not crowd the tank with "commoners."

Pictures of the small plant, I have no idea what it is, of someone can help identify it, I'd appreciate it

 

[itiwhetu]

It is believed that the AC is usually five times more harmful than the DC. The high frequency of AC is the primary reason for the severe effects on human bodies. It has sixty circles of frequency, which is incredibly damaging. Note that even a small frequency of about twenty-five volts voltage can kill you. This shows how dangerous AC can be if not handle with a lot of care.

AC causes hard contraction of the muscles and sweating, which reduces skin resistance. If you are in a situation where a person is directly exposed to AC, it is advisable to free them from the contact as soon as possible to avoid significant injuries or death. Simply because the longer contact victim has with the AC voltage, the further skin resistance reduces, causing death

Copied that from the interwebs ... because I thought AC was more dangerous but couldn't explain it quite that well. I believe that AC is cheaper/easier to produce. And you can easily rectify AC to DC.

Interesting, I used to test fire alarms in remote locations. Those that were set up on DC power there were warnings everywhere. Those not so remote on AC power no warnings.