Does "Bottled" Bacteria Really Help Cycling?

[OldFishKeeper]

When I started keeping fish back in the 50s, "Cycling" was not a thing. People knew to age water for 24 hours to get rid of chlorine. I remember chlorine tablet remedies but found the 24 hour routine was good because it took that much time to stabilize the water temperature in a new tank. That time also helped to reduce the cloudiness from new gravel.

Those who added live plants when setting up the new tank probably (and unknowingly) jumped started cycling and being able to successfully add fish sooner.

When I returned to the hobby in the early 2000s, the nitrification cycle was well known. Using disposable fish was still being used by some, while others who knew about using pure ammonia, were gaining awareness.

Products advertising live, bottled good bacteria were introduced but, discounted by many. After all, this good bacteria needed oxygen to survive. How could any survive weeks or months in a sealed bottle?

Even today, some say the beneficial bacteria in your sponge or other filter will last a few hours without moving, oxygenated water.

So, my question is, what has given this bottled bacteria the ability to live in a sealed container for weeks or months and still be viable?

 

[gwand]

Many bacteria form spores which allow them to tolerate hostile environments as deadly as space. This may be the case with cycling bacteria.

 

[OldFishKeeper]

Many bacteria form spores which allow them to tolerate hostile environments as deadly as space. This may be the case with cycling bacteria.

If you ever fine out for sure, please let me know. Of course, if there are some deadly bacteria out there, I hope you will let me know as well .

In the meantime, I will continue to use my beneficial bacteria from sponges in healthy tanks.

Happy Holidays...

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The nitrifying bacteria do not form spores. They reproduce by binary division.

How can bacteria live in a bottle and not die for 6 months or a year?

A common misconception about bacteria in general is that they die if they are not fed. From a human being point of view this sounds perfectly reasonable: if you don’t eat, you die. However, bacteria are not human beings. Bacteria operate much differently than people and have a variety of ways to deal with those times when resources are not available for them to grow and reproduce. Some bacteria when stressed (from say lack of nutrients) form spores and go into a resting stage, waiting for conditions to improve. Nitrifiers do not form spores but have other mechanisms to deal with nutrient deficient periods. For nitrifiers, one way to deal with stressful conditions is to form a protective “shield” called EPS. EPS stands for extracellular polymeric substances and is, in simplistic terms, an organic protective shield that research shows inhibits various organisms from attacking and breaking open the cell wall of nitrifiers. Nitrifiers belong to a very old line of bacteria (millions of years) and they have developed ways to cope with very long periods of “drought.” Because the nitrifiers in DrTim’s One & Only are grown on a substrate, they can form EPS when needed and last 6 to 12 months in a bottle.

from https://www.drtimsaquatics.com/products/one-and-only-live-nitrifying-bacteria/

Then read this:

Joke Geets, Nico Boon, Willy Verstraete, Strategies of aerobic ammonia-oxidizing bacteria for coping with nutrient and oxygen fluctuations, FEMS Microbiology Ecology, Volume 58, Issue 1, October 2006, Pages 1–13, https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1574-6941.2006.00170.x

Abstract​

In most natural environments as well as in engineered environments, such as wastewater treatment plants, ammonia-oxidizing bacteria (AOB) experience fluctuating substrate concentrations. Several physiological traits, such as low maintenance energy demand and decay rate, cell-to-cell communication, cell mobility, stable enzymes and RNAs, could allow AOB to maintain themselves under unfavourable circumstances. This review examines whether AOB possess such traits and how these traits might offer advantages over competing organisms such as heterotrophic bacteria during periods of starvation. In addition, within the AOB groups, differences exist in adaptation to and competitiveness under conditions of high or low ammonia or oxygen concentrations. Because these findings are of importance with regard to the ecology and activity of AOB in natural and engineered environments, concluding remarks are directed towards future research objectives that may clarify unanswered questions, thereby contributing to the general knowledge of the ecology and activity of ammonia oxidizers.

or this

	Bollmann, A., Bär-Gilissen, M.J. and Laanbroek, H.J., 2002. Growth at low ammonium concentrations and starvation response as potential factors involved in niche differentiation among ammonia-oxidizing bacteria. Applied and environmental microbiology, 68(10), pp.4751-4757.

Abstract​

In nature, ammonia-oxidizing bacteria have to compete with heterotrophic bacteria and plants for limiting amounts of ammonium. Previous laboratory experiments conducted with Nitrosomonas europaea suggested that ammonia-oxidizing bacteria are weak competitors for ammonium. To obtain a better insight into possible methods of niche differentiation among ammonia-oxidizing bacteria, we carried out a growth experiment at low ammonium concentrations with N. europaea and the ammonia oxidizer G5-7, a close relative of Nitrosomonas oligotropha belonging to Nitrosomonas cluster 6a, enriched from a freshwater sediment. Additionally, we compared the starvation behavior of the newly enriched ammonia oxidizer G5-7 to that of N. europaea. The growth experiment at low ammonium concentrations showed that strain G5-7 was able to outcompete N. europaea at growth-limiting substrate concentrations of about 10 μM ammonium, suggesting better growth abilities of the ammonia oxidizer G5-7 at low ammonium concentrations. However, N. europaea displayed a more favorable starvation response. After 1 to 10 weeks of ammonium deprivation, N. europaea became almost immediately active after the addition of fresh ammonium and converted the added ammonium within 48 to 96 h. In contrast, the regeneration time of the ammonia oxidizer G5-7 increased with increasing starvation time. Taken together, these results provide insight into possible mechanisms of niche differentiation for the ammonia-oxidizing bacteria studied. The Nitrosomonas cluster 6a member, G5-7, is able to grow at ammonium concentrations at which the growth of N. europaea, belonging to Nitrosomonas cluster 7, has already ceased, providing an advantage in habitats with continuously low ammonium concentrations. On the other hand, the ability of N. europaea to become active again after longer periods of starvation for ammonium may allow better exploitation of irregular pulses of ammonium in the environment.

 

[OldFishKeeper]

The nitrifying bacteria do not form spores. They reproduce by binary division.


from https://www.drtimsaquatics.com/products/one-and-only-live-nitrifying-bacteria/

Then read this:

Joke Geets, Nico Boon, Willy Verstraete, Strategies of aerobic ammonia-oxidizing bacteria for coping with nutrient and oxygen fluctuations, FEMS Microbiology Ecology, Volume 58, Issue 1, October 2006, Pages 1–13, https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1574-6941.2006.00170.x

Abstract​

In most natural environments as well as in engineered environments, such as wastewater treatment plants, ammonia-oxidizing bacteria (AOB) experience fluctuating substrate concentrations. Several physiological traits, such as low maintenance energy demand and decay rate, cell-to-cell communication, cell mobility, stable enzymes and RNAs, could allow AOB to maintain themselves under unfavourable circumstances. This review examines whether AOB possess such traits and how these traits might offer advantages over competing organisms such as heterotrophic bacteria during periods of starvation. In addition, within the AOB groups, differences exist in adaptation to and competitiveness under conditions of high or low ammonia or oxygen concentrations. Because these findings are of importance with regard to the ecology and activity of AOB in natural and engineered environments, concluding remarks are directed towards future research objectives that may clarify unanswered questions, thereby contributing to the general knowledge of the ecology and activity of ammonia oxidizers.

or this

	Bollmann, A., Bär-Gilissen, M.J. and Laanbroek, H.J., 2002. Growth at low ammonium concentrations and starvation response as potential factors involved in niche differentiation among ammonia-oxidizing bacteria. Applied and environmental microbiology, 68(10), pp.4751-4757.

Abstract​

In nature, ammonia-oxidizing bacteria have to compete with heterotrophic bacteria and plants for limiting amounts of ammonium. Previous laboratory experiments conducted with Nitrosomonas europaea suggested that ammonia-oxidizing bacteria are weak competitors for ammonium. To obtain a better insight into possible methods of niche differentiation among ammonia-oxidizing bacteria, we carried out a growth experiment at low ammonium concentrations with N. europaea and the ammonia oxidizer G5-7, a close relative of Nitrosomonas oligotropha belonging to Nitrosomonas cluster 6a, enriched from a freshwater sediment. Additionally, we compared the starvation behavior of the newly enriched ammonia oxidizer G5-7 to that of N. europaea. The growth experiment at low ammonium concentrations showed that strain G5-7 was able to outcompete N. europaea at growth-limiting substrate concentrations of about 10 μM ammonium, suggesting better growth abilities of the ammonia oxidizer G5-7 at low ammonium concentrations. However, N. europaea displayed a more favorable starvation response. After 1 to 10 weeks of ammonium deprivation, N. europaea became almost immediately active after the addition of fresh ammonium and converted the added ammonium within 48 to 96 h. In contrast, the regeneration time of the ammonia oxidizer G5-7 increased with increasing starvation time. Taken together, these results provide insight into possible mechanisms of niche differentiation for the ammonia-oxidizing bacteria studied. The Nitrosomonas cluster 6a member, G5-7, is able to grow at ammonium concentrations at which the growth of N. europaea, belonging to Nitrosomonas cluster 7, has already ceased, providing an advantage in habitats with continuously low ammonium concentrations. On the other hand, the ability of N. europaea to become active again after longer periods of starvation for ammonium may allow better exploitation of irregular pulses of ammonium in the environment.

Interesting stuff here! In the new year, I will set up a totally new tank and document what I have found, using this info.

Thanks for the response.

 

[MaloK]

From the last weeks experience, I can tell that without any bacterial enhancer, the tank in question would have taken an eternity to cycle and required a lot of water changes, from testing and doing water changes and testing.

I used Fluval biological enhancer. Not really by choice, but my favourite LFS has noting else... And "you will thank me !" they said. "Feed in filter input"... Already knew that.

Yayaya my eye... placebo effect... But it was available in cheap 2 ounces... So why not try...

I know the amount of ammonia produced in a well fed betta tank is negligible, But after 8 days, it was rising too much for sanity.

The stuff cut the ammonia rise under the foot and racked nitrites in under a week. with one water change.

For 4.99$. I'm really pleased with the results.

This stuff is not bacteria, Nitrifying bacterias are everywhere. It only enhances their condition and helps them thriving. "was also mentionned".

I mean... It says on the bottle "immediate fish introduction".. My test is a drop in the ocean.

But I would suggest to try. Because the way it was going, I feel I have saved a lots of water changes there.

 

[OnlyGenusCaps]

Welcome back to the hobby, @OldFishKeeper ! I sure would love to hear your experiences from the days in the 50's! I had the great privilege of hearing a presentation by Rosario LaCorte just a couple years ago. He's in his 90's now and in his facility is no longer allowed any aquariums (which seems a shame to me!), and he was absolutely the best speaker I have ever heard on aquariums! 70+ years of experience, and every day of it was evident! Folks with experience from further back are invaluable in my estimation.

But I digress. Standard wisdom currently, is that there are bottled bacteria that work and that adding contents from an established (disease free) aquarium is also valuable. But, I'll tell you there is about to be a revolution in "cycling" that will allow you to add fish day one with no stress. I've seen the preliminary data on this, and it seems unreal! But until that product rolls out in the next year or two, some of the products on the market will help speed the process. How? It's propitiatory.

 

[OldFishKeeper]

From the last weeks experience, I can tell that without any bacterial enhancer, the tank in question would have taken an eternity to cycle and required a lot of water changes, from testing and doing water changes and testing.

I used Fluval biological enhancer. Not really by choice, but my favourite LFS has noting else... And "you will thank me !" they said. "Feed in filter input"... Already knew that.

Yayaya my eye... placebo effect... But it was available in cheap 2 ounces... So why not try...

I know the amount of ammonia produced in a well fed betta tank is negligible, But after 8 days, it was rising too much for sanity.

The stuff cut the ammonia rise under the foot and racked nitrites in under a week. with one water change.

For 4.99$. I'm really pleased with the results.

This stuff is not bacteria, Nitrifying bacterias are everywhere. It only enhances their condition and helps them thriving. "was also mentionned".

I mean... It says on the bottle "immediate fish introduction".. My test is a drop in the ocean.

But I would suggest to try. Because the way it was going, I feel I have saved a lots of water changes there.

I will give it a shot in the New Year...Happy Holidays.

 

[OldFishKeeper]

Welcome back to the hobby, @OldFishKeeper ! I sure would love to hear your experiences from the days in the 50's! I had the great privilege of hearing a presentation by Rosario LaCorte just a couple years ago. He's in his 90's now and in his facility is no longer allowed any aquariums (which seems a shame to me!), and he was absolutely the best speaker I have ever heard on aquariums! 70+ years of experience, and every day of it was evident! Folks with experience from further back are invaluable in my estimation.

But I digress. Standard wisdom currently, is that there are bottled bacteria that work and that adding contents from an established (disease free) aquarium is also valuable. But, I'll tell you there is about to be a revolution in "cycling" that will allow you to add fish day one with no stress. I've seen the preliminary data on this, and it seems unreal! But until that product rolls out in the next year or two, some of the products on the market will help speed the process. How? It's propitiatory.

All very interesting. As far as my experience is concerned, check out some of my recent posts. I will add more as topics come up. I wish I had kept up with things over the years but, work and other things got in the way.

 

[Lcc86]

Purely anecdotal but I recently set up a new tank and bought a small bottle of API quick Start. I just wanted to see what happened, I've never used a bottled bacteria before and it cost about £2 for the smallest bottle so I thought why not. It definitely kick started my cycle way quicker than I expected. I was only cycling a 6 gallon, so the amount needed was tiny. I don't think I would've bought it if I'd had to spend much more, it was just an interesting experiment (although I now seem to have a bit of new tank syndrome, whether that's related to the quick cycling I don't know).

 

[OldFishKeeper]

Purely anecdotal but I recently set up a new tank and bought a small bottle of API quick Start. I just wanted to see what happened, I've never used a bottled bacteria before and it cost about £2 for the smallest bottle so I thought why not. It definitely kick started my cycle way quicker than I expected. I was only cycling a 6 gallon, so the amount needed was tiny. I don't think I would've bought it if I'd had to spend much more, it was just an interesting experiment (although I now seem to have a bit of new tank syndrome, whether that's related to the quick cycling I don't know).

How much did it kick start by?

 

[Lcc86]

How much did it kick start by?

I got rid of my notes now but it was showing cycled in about 3 weeks. I didn't follow scientific method for adding ammonia, I just added fish food. Funnily enough I added a few more drops with a water change yesterday as I've had some nitrite readings again in the past few days, and no nitrite showing today, I'm a novice so I don't know if that's just coincidence. I wouldn't swear by it but it does appear to do *something*

 

[OldFishKeeper]

I got rid of my notes now but it was showing cycled in about 3 weeks. I didn't follow scientific method for adding ammonia, I just added fish food. Funnily enough I added a few more drops with a water change yesterday as I've had some nitrite readings again in the past few days, and no nitrite showing today, I'm a novice so I don't know if that's just coincidence. I wouldn't swear by it but it does appear to do *something*

Thank you for the detail. Cutting the normal 6 week process in half is a positive sign and worthy of consideration, especially when just starting out with a first tank.

I do, however, believe the promotional information of these products could lead to inadvertent fish-in cycling. Those new to the hobby may expect an immediate cycle. Some may not have test kits or know how to properly read them. To those people, I would recommend adding live plants and allow them to get established before adding fish.

I would try these products but continue to keep spare sponge filters in cycled tanks in order to inoculate new ones.

 

[Lcc86]

Thank you for the detail. Cutting the normal 6 week process in half is a positive sign and worthy of consideration, especially when just starting out with a first tank.

I do, however, believe the promotional information of these products could lead to inadvertent fish-in cycling. Those new to the hobby may expect an immediate cycle. Some may not have test kits or know how to properly read them. To those people, I would recommend adding live plants and allow them to get established before adding fish.

I would try these products but continue to keep spare sponge filters in cycled tanks in order to inoculate new ones.

Yes I was just re-reading my post and realised that clearly me adding the bacteria wasn't completely successful as I've got the nitrite readings in the past few days, and have had the betta in there for 2 weeks now. It was an interesting experiment and something I'd consider again as a booster for helping to start a tank, but I wouldn't solely rely on it (nice contradiction in my post there lol).

 

[MaloK]

One old trick is to smell the filter sponges.

If they have a strong fresh earthy smell.

Everything is working. Any other kind of foul smelling is not good.