Does anyone have know about the Angelfish called Blue California?

[BobbyZee]

I’ve been hearing this name here and there and got in contact with a breeder. Here is what he had to say. He provided additional information on the California green, another variety to me.

I quote from him below.
California Blue is a cultivar that was once developed the Philippines and the disappeared from the hobby (as many others have, like for instance, the Naja Gold, etc.). I saw a vintage picture that made me want to bring it back. I do not know what the genetics of the original stock were but I worked on what I guessed and produced my own. In my case the fish are +/+ s/+ or s/s or s/Z +/bg pb/pb. I started with a CA Green and a Bulgarian Seal Point, the progeny was selected for desirable traits and then crossed to Philippine Blue Smokeys; the progeny of these, selected again and then crossed with CA Greens with a single pb gene. Three lines were established and from these crosses among fish with the same genetics were carried out. You get California Blues. I don’t think there is any other name for them.



The green color in some angelfish comes from certain wild angels with yellow and blue base colors present, like the Amapa and Caroni, among others. However, as you point out, there doesn’t seem to be a wild fish with actual green coloration. There is supposedly a “green” leopoldi but I have never seen one or even a picture of it. Just rumors.

 

[Magnum Man]

I've been looking at these... not sure if they are similar or not???

https://www.dansfish.com/product.detail/4774/Blue-Diamond-Angelfish-(Pterophyllum-scalare)

lots of blue angels listed here...

The Allure Of Blue Angelfish Freshwater: How To Keep Them. - Pet Fish Guide

With their stunning sapphire hues, Blue angelfish freshwater, create an angelic presence in home aquariums. Their vibrant blue tones mesmerize fish keepers

petfishguides.com

but nothing listed as Blue California's

 

[BobbyZee]

Nice fish, but other variety, Magnum. I will try to attach a photo.

 

[BobbyZee]

I've been looking at these... not sure if they are similar or not???

https://www.dansfish.com/product.detail/4774/Blue-Diamond-Angelfish-(Pterophyllum-scalare)

lots of blue angels listed here...

The Allure Of Blue Angelfish Freshwater: How To Keep Them. - Pet Fish Guide

With their stunning sapphire hues, Blue angelfish freshwater, create an angelic presence in home aquariums. Their vibrant blue tones mesmerize fish keepers

petfishguides.com

but nothing listed as Blue California's

Thanks for the link. A well respected breeder of many decades tells me that spirulina brings out the blue. I am feeding bug bites spirulina every day, along with other foods to my blues. Hope I spelled that word right, too lazy to look now, but I’m close enough so that you should know what I mean.

 

[GaryE]

I'm waiting for Mississippi Blues.

Is there any kind of breed standard group for angels, or is it just call the linebreds what you want for marketing? I know the Betta and Guppy breeders have set types, but is there an angel show circuit with breed types?

 

[BobbyZee]

I'm waiting for Mississippi Blues.

Is there any kind of breed standard group for angels, or is it just call the linebreds what you want for marketing? I know the Betta and Guppy breeders have set types, but is there an angel show circuit with breed types?

I never market ANYTHING. I am looking at buying these fish and an in search of info.
I found the Mississippi Blues years ago, thanks to the first husband.
Mississippi John Hurt, Lightnin Hopkins, Howling Wolf to name a few.
And oh yeah, start with Robert Johnson.

 

[GaryE]

I never market ANYTHING. I am looking at buying these fish and an in search of info

I never thought you were selling them, but I was curious about what the seller was offering to you. There is such an explosion of domestic angel names, and I still wonder if there are standards, or if it's a free for all. That doesn't take away from the fish, but they have become really hard to categorize for those looking for them.
California Blue sounds like a smooth drink mix from the 1970s. Mississippi Blues sound like a tough one, even if you aren't Robert Johnson.

 

[BobbyZee]

I'm waiting for Mississippi Blues.

Is there any kind of breed standard group for angels, or is it just call the linebreds what you want for marketing? I know the Betta and Guppy breeders have set types, but is there an angel show circuit with breed types?

I never thought you were selling them, but I was curious about what the seller was offering to you. There is such an explosion of domestic angel names, and I still wonder if there are standards, or if it's a free for all. That doesn't take away from the fish, but they have become really hard to categorize for those looking for them.
California Blue sounds like a smooth drink mix from the 1970s. Mississippi Blues sound like a tough one, even if you aren't Robert Johnson.

Well, I have more pieces of the puzzle right now. The breeder went to the crossroads and sold his soul to the devil in exchange for this fantastic specimen.

 

[GaryE]

Satanoperca daemon is found with wild angels. Maybe there's something to that.

I just happen to be listening to Little Walter (A Chicago Blues angel) and I hope when you find them, they're blues with a feeling. Don't keep them in muddy waters though.

 

[anewbie]

the pinoy gene causes blue; some foods will enhance certain colours like carotene will enhance orange/red (which is not a natural colour for angelfishes); The problem with trade names is they are largely made up for marketing. I have some nice blue angelfishes from a dealer who was easy to work with but do be aware that the pinoy gene has some negativities and the angels with the gene is not as robust for various reasons (hence probably why pinoy+pinoy is not so common in the wild.

 

[ghyti]

Blue Diamond, California Blue, etc. Are all made up names to try to sell fish to unsuspecting buyers. Blue is blue (pb/pb) developed by Keneddy in the Phillipines and called Phillipine Blue. There is no Pinoy gene. A Pinoy is a Phillipine blue fish with a dark gene. (D/+,pb/pb) or (D/D,pb.pb). There used to be an Angelfish Society that tried to keep track of such things but it went by the wayside.

 

[anewbie]

Blue Diamond, California Blue, etc. Are all made up names to try to sell fish to unsuspecting buyers. Blue is blue (pb/pb) developed by Keneddy in the Phillipines and called Phillipine Blue. There is no Pinoy gene. A Pinoy is a Phillipine blue fish with a dark gene. (D/+,pb/pb) or (D/D,pb.pb). There used to be an Angelfish Society that tried to keep track of such things but it went by the wayside.

What do you mean by developed; did he invent the gene or did he just selectively breed to induce more fishes with pb/pb. I also thought the name of pb was pinoy but you seem to imply that pb is called blue. i could be mistaken there of course or more precisely someone said it wrong and i copied them but does the gene pb not have a common name ?

 

[ghyti]

The Philippine Blue gene is noted as pb. Mr Keneddy (I probably mis-spelled it) Discovered the pb gene in some platinums he was working with. He line bred them and cross bred them to prove the gene. That is what I meant by developed. No one "invents" genes, they exist naturally. A Pinoy is a Philippine Blue (pb/pb, the pb is a recessive gene) with a Dark Gene or two. Pinoy -pb/pb, D/+ or D/D. A Philippine Blue with two Sripeless genes (S/S) is called a Pairiba. Other phenotypes exist with the Philippine Blue as well, Blue Smokies, Blue Marbles, Blue Zebras, etc. Any Blue fish has a double dose of Philippine Blue, except German Blue Blushers, but that is another discussion.

 

[anewbie]

The Philippine Blue gene is noted as pb. Mr Keneddy (I probably mis-spelled it) Discovered the pb gene in some platinums he was working with. He line bred them and cross bred them to prove the gene. That is what I meant by developed. No one "invents" genes, they exist naturally. A Pinoy is a Philippine Blue (pb/pb, the pb is a recessive gene) with a Dark Gene or two. Pinoy -pb/pb, D/+ or D/D. A Philippine Blue with two Sripeless genes (S/S) is called a Pairiba. Other phenotypes exist with the Philippine Blue as well, Blue Smokies, Blue Marbles, Blue Zebras, etc. Any Blue fish has a double dose of Philippine Blue, except German Blue Blushers, but that is another discussion.

Ok so the source i looked up which said pinoy was pb/pb should have said philppine instead of pinoy. Thanks.
--
The other stuff i know I have some pinoy clown and sadly one pinoy pearl scale. For others the problem with pinoy gene is it seem to carry a lot of defects and produces weaker fishes - at least that has been my understanding. Certainly every pb/pb fish I have owned has had other defects; some minor some more significant. But still some have absolutely lovely fins - the clowns in particular seem to have very nice fins. IMHO pearl scale does not go well with pinoy.

 

[GaryE]

Pinoy just mean Philippino in informal language. The blue varieties seem to have radiated out of that country, a bit like German Blue Rams were fixed as a type in Germany before being bred all over the world. I don't think it's sensible to talk about Philippino genes in angels, but Philippino varieties make sense. California Blue may be distinct, but sounds like the old Singapore German Rams, Israeli German Rams, Malaysian...