Discus are an endless money pit!

[itiwhetu]

Chances are they won't last more than two years. With Discus too? You get the pecking order and in small groups in home aquariums? that is lethal to the slower growers. It's why breeder go to only one pair per aquarium. If two pair or more were better? Then they would do that! Money is the bottom line in best care. Breeders don't waste money buying conditions that will kill their fish. No other fish,no plants and rocks and substrates or stressing the fish cleaning aquariums with dirty gravels. Co2 and Discus? Truly bad. I've seen those fish sucking badly in planted tanks with CO2. I knew they weren't long for this world in there.
Virtually every single video by "Mr. Fish" of large Discus in sometimes huge aquariums? Were all just added already full grown. Probably a year later one was left judging by what I saw.

It is funny your statement about breeders, because that is how they keep all their fish. No plants no substrate no rocks bare tanks, just maybe you have discovered the future of our hobby, completely bare tanks. I really think you are onto something

 

[itiwhetu]

I believe, Discus are generally a fish that gets to 6-7 inches, and therefore not a large Cichlid by any means. Two fish that size requiring 100 gallons doesn't add up.

 

[itiwhetu]

What the aquarium world has done to Discus over the years is what gives organizations like PETA power to destroy the hobby. These fish have been genetically manipulated to such an extent that now they can't even live in a normal furnished aquarium. As far as I'm concerned it is a disgrace and shame on those people trying to make huge profits from these fish. I'm pleased I live in NZ where we still have people with some moral back bone.

 

[Colin_T]

Discus can live in planted tanks with gravel. We had a 12 foot tank in one of the shops and it had 5 inches of gravel, loads of plants, heaps of different fishes including discus. They are fed together, got a huge (90%) water change each week, and lived for a long time. Not sure exactly how long because the shop closed down and I don't know what happened to the fish after that. But they were breeding and living happily in a planted tank with gravel and lots of other fish. We never had a problem with them.

Back in high school (yes there was cave painting and hunting/ gathering classes to attend back then) a friend's mum had a lovely discus tank that was fully planted with gravel and all types of fish. Their fish used to breed all the time.

I have seen other people with planted discus tanks and their fish do fine as well. We had a small planted tank (2ft cube) on the counter in one shop and the discus used to breed in that all the time. A shop in Mandurah had a number of planted discus tanks and they always had baby discus.

The big issue with discus is the commercial breeders who take the eggs from the parents and rear the fry artificially. This stops the baby fish learning from the parents, puts the babies into a sterile environment, and prevents them getting the mucous from the parents.

Female mammals produce colostrum for the first few days after they give birth. This is a special type of milk that contains all sorts of goodies that help kick start the baby animal's immune system. Without the colostrum, the baby animal (including people) don't do as well and often struggle to get through the first few years of life. Even if they survive, they are more likely to have health issues later on.

The same thing happens with birds and there is something in the parent bird's food that helps boost newly hatched bird's immune systems.

And the same thing happens with discus and Uaru. There is bacteria and other microscopic organisms in the mucous on the adult fish and the babies ingest it. I also think there could be a slight change in chemical composition of the mucous coating on the adults when they have babies, compared to when they don't.

This would explain why discus reared in bare glass tanks in commercial hatcheries always have health issues, in particular with digestive issues, but fish bred and reared in tanks with their parents don't have the same health issues.

Commercial discus farms have major problems with the babies getting sick and dying when around one month old. They use chemicals to stop this from happening. The chemicals are highly toxic and no baby animal, bird or fish should be exposed to chemicals. These baby fish are trying to grow and develop and they need their immune system working normally to do this. If the breeders are pumping toxic chemicals into the rearing tanks, they are damaging the baby fish.

I have never used any chemicals in tanks with baby fish because they don't normally get sick. But the discus fish farms add chemicals at various stages of the fry's life. This is a major problem that needs to stop. It's just pure greed from the commercial farms, get as many babies out of the parents as you can.

sorry for the rant.

 

[itiwhetu]

Discus can live in planted tanks with gravel. We had a 12 foot tank in one of the shops and it had 5 inches of gravel, loads of plants, heaps of different fishes including discus. They are fed together, got a huge (90%) water change each week, and lived for a long time. Not sure exactly how long because the shop closed down and I don't know what happened to the fish after that. But they were breeding and living happily in a planted tank with gravel and lots of other fish. We never had a problem with them.

Back in high school (yes there was cave painting and hunting/ gathering classes to attend back then) a friend's mum had a lovely discus tank that was fully planted with gravel and all types of fish. Their fish used to breed all the time.

I have seen other people with planted discus tanks and their fish do fine as well. We had a small planted tank (2ft cube) on the counter in one shop and the discus used to breed in that all the time. A shop in Mandurah had a number of planted discus tanks and they always had baby discus.

The big issue with discus is the commercial breeders who take the eggs from the parents and rear the fry artificially. This stops the baby fish learning from the parents, puts the babies into a sterile environment, and prevents them getting the mucous from the parents.

Female mammals produce colostrum for the first few days after they give birth. This is a special type of milk that contains all sorts of goodies that help kick start the baby animal's immune system. Without the colostrum, the baby animal (including people) don't do as well and often struggle to get through the first few years of life. Even if they survive, they are more likely to have health issues later on.

The same thing happens with birds and there is something in the parent bird's food that helps boost newly hatched bird's immune systems.

And the same thing happens with discus and Uaru. There is bacteria and other microscopic organisms in the mucous on the adult fish and the babies ingest it. I also think there could be a slight change in chemical composition of the mucous coating on the adults when they have babies, compared to when they don't.

This would explain why discus reared in bare glass tanks in commercial hatcheries always have health issues, in particular with digestive issues, but fish bred and reared in tanks with their parents don't have the same health issues.

Commercial discus farms have major problems with the babies getting sick and dying when around one month old. They use chemicals to stop this from happening. The chemicals are highly toxic and no baby animal, bird or fish should be exposed to chemicals. These baby fish are trying to grow and develop and they need their immune system working normally to do this. If the breeders are pumping toxic chemicals into the rearing tanks, they are damaging the baby fish.

I have never used any chemicals in tanks with baby fish because they don't normally get sick. But the discus fish farms add chemicals at various stages of the fry's life. This is a major problem that needs to stop. It's just pure greed from the commercial farms, get as many babies out of the parents as you can.

sorry for the rant.

Thank you for the rant, Cheers @Colin_T when we catch up, I'll buy you a beer.

 

[itiwhetu]