Debate

[KiddyKat]

I currently have 2 Bettas, one in a 5 Gal hex one in a divided 7 Gal Bowfront. Harri (in the Hex) is a very happy active lil dude, he used to live in a small community tank (10 Gal with 2 Cories and 4 baby Glowlight Tetra) and was quite happy there until I had a pH crash - in my n00b state I dropped a piece of mopani bogwood in without pre soaking it and pH went from 7.6-7.8 down to 6.0 literally overnight, his fins shredded and sore I moved him to his 5 gallon hex to treat him and let him rest, in the community he used to curl up at night with the Corys and they slept in a fishy pile but after his isolation treatment he decided he liked his own space and wouldn't accept he company

Bozzy has half a 7 Gal tank and is happy and active... he is waiting for a neighbor, I just need to locate and quarentine another lil dude as a tankmate. Obv they cannot get at each other, there is even a 'jump-guard' to prevent it

My Betta QT tank is 3 gallons... I would never keep a fish in a smaller one out of personal preference but this is because both of my fish use every inch of their tanksif I had an agoraphobic fishy then I would give is a small tank with lots of hiding places... ie the 3 gal with loads of small plants

but hey, this is just me... they are fish, not mini people... yet also we keep them 'trapped' so to speak, we should at least make them comfortable, whether 2 gallons or 10, it depends on the fish as to what makes him happy, not us

 

[Tolak]

If you think a betta needs 10 gallons to himself, you would need to give an angelfish around 25 gallons just for it's self.

Angelfish grow big and need a lot more than 25 gallons. Bad comparison.

If you want to know the people who agree with me, they are on petshub. com. If you tell them you think 1 gallon is minimum you will get yelled at....a lot. They present a lot more facts about this topic.

I don't have a single betta, never have. Nonetheless, you seem to be a very opinionated person, which doesn't bother me. I'm sure you know, being one of strong opinions; if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

I breed angels, your bad comparison is wrong. Pairs of standard fin angels do fine in a 20 tall, veils do better in a 29 with the height. Many breeders will divide a 30-gallon for 2 pairs. These fish do just fine, fish that are breeding are happy with their conditions. Angel breeders in the area, as well as myself, are not large commercial breeders, just hobbyists with a love of fish, and a disgust for the mass produced garbage offered by your corporate owned shops. We pride ourselves on producing a superior product, not for the money, but for the joy of producing a beautiful fish. You don’t obtain that with overstocked, cramped conditions.

You are wrong about breeders being in it for the money. Most breeders aren't in it for the money. If I were after the money, I would shut down most of my tanks, and work on Saturday. Every breeder I know, if they aren't retired, would do the same. One 8-hour day of overtime makes me more than a month's worth of working with my tanks and selling fish. I easily spend 8 hours weekly with aquatics related things, either my tanks, with my club, or online.

If you have been into aquatics for any amount of time, you will realize that there are no definites. What works for one person won't work for every person, or even that individual every time. Your opinion is valued, but you have to remember there is quite a bit of art, as well as gut instinct involved with aquatics, along with science.

 

[Jonz]

I got started on bettas when my G/F got me one for Xmas about 5 years ago. She gave him to me in a bowl with a small plastic plant and some gravel. I didnt know anything about Bettas at the time, but looking at him I thought he might want more room,so I upgraded him to a 2.5 gallon. No filtration but with a light. That dude was happy.

But I think theyre happier and healthier with more space.

I have a few different tank but right now am operating just one 10 gallon. I has a good tempered Betta with 3 cory catfish and 3 zebra danios. My drawf frog died (I dont think it was the Betta though). They all get along fine. The Betta and catfish often rest together and recently when waiting for food the danios and Betta will wait side by side - no fighting.

I also have 2 3 gallon eclipse system 3's. I chose these for the light and filtration. It was also a way for me to save 2 more Bettas without having to wory about large tanks. I just dont have the room.

With the smaller tanks I just put more in to keep them happy - caves, tunnels, long plants for them to park and hang out on and such.

These guys are very happy. I think this is the minimum for a Betta.

(BTW, in case your wondering why those large rocks are like that., I thought the filtration was a bit too strong for the Bettas. I was worried about it. I messed around all day - adding pieces of sponges to the filter, a few different things to figure out a way to slow it down a bit and this was the best thing I could come up without messing with the mechanism or worrying about breaking something. The large rocks are in front of the exhaust and slow down the current a bit there. Simple solution and actually didnt think it would work but it worked pretty well. Theyre now relaxing in areas where they had to keep their fins moving before.)

 

[catsmakemebark]

Sorry, I have been on petshub. Some people are keeping betta's in .5 gallons. If you want to get better responses ask on petshub or read some of the posts. They will have very logical and factual answers to everything.

Betta's are definatly healthier with space. In a bowl or a one gallon tank a betta has nowhere to go. It see's places around it but none of it is tangible. When you get a new fish and let it get accustom to the water in the tank in a see threw plastic bag the fish gets stressed because it see's other places to move but it can't it is refrained from doing so. Please dont refrain your betta from getting the amount of space it wants. Even if it dosnt use the space at first, you should still have it there incase.

 

[Synirr]

Thank you to the one person who agree's with me.

That should tell you something...

One wonders, if such large tanks are prefered, why most breeders advocate keeping them in 10 gallons or less, not out of necessaity due to lack of space, but as the preferable housing? These are people who know these fish best. Fact of the matter is, bettas are domesticated animals, the evidence of that is clear when you compare one to its wild counterpart. I wouldn't dream of keeping one of the wild species in anything less than 10 gallons, but a regular ol' domestic splendens? Absolutely. Especially with the long-finned varieties, when you get over 10 gallons or so, you run the risk of the fish stressing itself out. It varies by individual fish of course, but these fish were historically bred for their aggressive and territorial nature, which most retain to one degree or another to this day. Most are hyper-territorial and feel the need to patrol their territory constantly -- which can include the entire tank -- and when the fish has massive, heavy finnage, this can be a problem.

 

[happyannie]

I'm just coming in at the tail-end of this discussion....but maybe I should rethink relocating my boy to a 20 gallon long plant tank. I thought he'd hang out at the end where there's not as much current and as many plants. ..?? I dunno...?? (She asked, hijacking the thread)

 

[jollysue]

I'm with Wuv: this thread has gone remarkably well. Everyone gets a chance to exchange experiences and ideas. People get to know each other and even learn new things and challenge their concepts. As a matter of fact, I think the tone has generally improved along the way.

Thanks, Catsmakemebark, for making the effort.

We are good!

On the community housing thing. I have done quite a lot of community housing--as much because of space needs as anything else. I was warned that Betta can do fine and then suddenly get temperamental. I found that to be true in every case. Betta that slept with the cories for months, suddenly began to harrass them. Perhaps, like my old Yorkie, they get cranky with age. I also think Synirr may be right. Waldo in the 100 usg patrolled the whole length of the tank. He used up lots of energy.

Like Jonz, I have used objects to deflect the filter. I will usually use a plastic plant hanging off of and in front of the filter to deflect the current.

 

[bUcky]

DERKA DERKA

-edit- sorry i didnt have anything smart to say....

 

[fishluva06]

Congratulations to all who have debated in a manner with the best welfare of the fish in mind .

 

[pica_nuttalli]

Sorry, I have been on petshub. Some people are keeping betta's in .5 gallons. If you want to get better responses ask on petshub or read some of the posts. They will have very logical and factual answers to everything.

Betta's are definatly healthier with space. In a bowl or a one gallon tank a betta has nowhere to go. It see's places around it but none of it is tangible. When you get a new fish and let it get accustom to the water in the tank in a see threw plastic bag the fish gets stressed because it see's other places to move but it can't; it is restrained from doing so. Please dont restrain your betta from getting the amount of space it wants. Even if it dosnt use the space at first, you should still have it there in case.

sorry, this is just the debate teacher living in my soul, but i couldn't "refrain" myself. don't use words if you can't use them properly. it weakens the effectiveness of your argument.

i can see part of what you're saying, but i think that 85% of us on here would upgrade a betta if it was continually struggling to escape its bowl. but what about those bettas who spend the first two weeks in their ten gallons hiding under a plant? those bettas (and they aren't uncommon) are terrified by all that extra space. is it really a kindness to keep them in such big, scary places when they obviously don't like it?

i'd also like to point out that the best solution to "can't swim through the glass, omg what's going on" reaction in any fish is... don't keep it in a transparent container. just because the container is bigger doesn't mean that the fish will suddenly understand why it can't reach places on the other side of the glass.

 

[jollysue]

Brilliant, pica_nutalli (whatever that is?)

I never would have thought of using a background around a betta tank. It would be very effective on one of those 3 usg bowfronts--just on the three sides.

You are making a valiant effort to keep the debate going.

 

[Jonz]

"but maybe I should rethink relocating my boy to a 20 gallon long plant tank"

I think a 10 gallon is perfect for a Betta. Larger is too much for the reasons Synirr said. Also if you look at the pics I have, you see those long plants. Bettas love those(I cant remember the name of them). They park and rest on and in them all the time.


"Betta that slept with the cories for months, suddenly began to harrass them."

Absolutely depends on the Betta. About 2 years ago until a few months ago I was working on a house I bought - alot. Practically gutted and rebuilt it so I was very busy and the house was a mess. I wanted to only have 1 tank up and running, so I got a seperater for my 10 gallon with a Betta and a Cory on each side. It was then I realized how well they can go along with Bettas. Ive seen the Bettas in a pissy mood nudge them and even try to scare the catfish but Ive never seen them nip or hurt the corys. They were housed together for almost 2 years. Danios are VERY iffy. I think I might have gotten lucky with the Danios becuase I have such a mellow Betta in that tank.

One thing about putting tank mates in with Bettas I dont see mentioned often is to watch them with the lights off. A friend of mine who has a Betta saw my tank and decided he wanted to add more fish. I cautioned him and offered to help. He started off with Danios. Everything seemed ok - until I told him to watch them after turning off the light in the tank (and watch with a distant light source).

As soon as the lights went out, the predator in the Betta came out and he became a terror to the other fish. He ended up getting a seperate 5 gallon for the Betta and his 10 gallon is now a community tank.

 

[_cRaCkEr_]

I use .5 gal for my fighter plakats, 1 gal for my female bettas, 1.5 gal for HMPKS and 2.5 gal for my CTs and HMs.

Absolutely no tank mates.

 

[jollysue]

No tank mates for the fighters, huh?

 

[_cRaCkEr_]

No tank mates for the fighters, huh?

lol I don't mix my bettas with other fish.