Cycling With Danios

[walt8880]

I am planning the setup of my first tank. 29 gal freshwater and normal beginner community tank.

I am going to cycle the tank using Zebra Danios, but have a question about how many to put in for the cycle period. I plan to end up with an 8-10 Danio school but that sounds like a lot to put into a tank for cycling.

Should I just put a couple in until the cycle is complete and then add the rest afterward?

thanks

 

[howard_hopkinson]

If I were you, I would consider doing a fishless cycle as it's much easier and a lot kinder.

Check out this thread HERE.

I did a fish in cycle myself and though I didn't lose a single fish, the amount of work involved in doing lots and lots of water changes was mind numbing.

If and when I ever decide to get another aquarium, I will definitely be doing a fishless cycle.

 

[drobbyb]

Fishless cycle is a far better option. All those waterchanges will get old very fast.

 

[waterdrop]

When fish take oxygen from the water with their gills, they give off both CO2 and Ammonia. Waste from fish, excess fishfood and plant debris are all processed by heterotrophic bacteria to produce ammonia. Ammonia, even in tiny amounts, causes permanent gill damage, resulting in shortened fish lives or death.

When we cycle a filter, the first species of bacteria that grow will process ammonia into nitrite(NO2). Each 1ppm of nitrite will be processed into 2.7ppm of nitrite and nitrite will be produced in abundant excess for a long period before the slower growing second bacterial species that processes nitrite can grow. Nitrite, even in tiny amounts, attaches to the hemoglobin protein on fish red blood cells, just as if it were oxygen, and breaks the red blood cells down, leading to permanent nerve damage which results in either shortened fish lives or the death of the fish.

It takes the first month or two, out of all the years you will run the tank and be responsible for the fish, to cycle the filter, regardless of whether its done with fish in or fishlessly. Why put yourself through the hundreds of water changes and the unknown of whether you are harming or killing your fish? Please don't do a fish-in cycle when you don't have to. Its an old technology that started on its way out back in 1980. One of the main things this beginner forum is about is to help with the process of fishless cycling.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[sfromsf]

I'm in the middle of a fish-in cycle. I started out with 3 barbs...

heed the advice given and go fishless. I have been testing the water and doing water changes almost daily, sometimes multiple times a day during the first three weeks. It's been getting better this week and last but man, If I could do it over I would go fishless instead of adding the barbs which my LFS said was the only way start the cycle...

 

[Tolak]

To answer your question, the standard stocking for a traditional cycle is one inch of hardy slim bodied fish that grows no larger than 3" per 5 gallons of water. That would mean 3 of the fish you mentioned for a traditional cycle.

You have been given alternatives as well, which are good advise. If you look here there are members willing to donate mature media, which will help with either cycling method. You can also try posting in the Tropical Discussion section requesting media. Media can be shipped, a few days in transit causes minimal die back.

 

[walt8880]

You have convinced me. If I can find some plaim ammonia here in Thailand, I will do fishless cycle.

thanks

 

[waterdrop]

Great Walt! First order of business: finding the right ammonia. The members often consider it a potential bit of adventure, the finding of the right ammonia and enjoy hearing stories of trials and success! In the UK and US we start by looking in the mop and broom sections of stores. There are "big box" stores here that have lots of cleaning products and sometimes plain bottles of ammonia are included as an inexpensive alternative to more commercial products. Also, hardware stores sometimes have it. Beyond that you have to get creative: pharmacy? chemistry lab? Note that you have to both "actually look" (because some helpers will tell you its not there) and also "ask" after that (because there might be some places that put it in a back room or under the counter.

What you're looking for is plain pure clear ammonia. Technically its "aqueous ammonia" which means its distilled water with ammonia (ammonia is a gas in its pure state) at about 3 to 10 percent concentration. Its often hard to find it -without- additives like dyes, fragrances, soaps or surfactants. If you can see in the bottle and shake it, you should only see bubbles for 2 or 3 seconds, like water, and not foam (which would mean soaps or surfactants.) Good Luck!

Another first order of business is finding a good liquid-reagent-based test kit. This is often called a "master kit" and has bottled tests and testtubes for testing for the concentration of ammonia, nitrite(NO2), pH and nitrate(NO3). Many of us like and use the API Freshwater Master Test Kit or the individual tests from a company named Saliferts. There are also kits from Nutrafin and Hagen-TetraTest. Read through our working article on fishless cycling by rdd1952 a couple times so you will have more baseline info for any questions here in your thread.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[JD Huskey]

It took me an hour or two and 8 different places to find some good ammonia. If it has an ingredient list, check it and see that is only contains ammonium hydroxide (no surfuctants, perfumes, dyes, etc). If it doesn't, shake it and see if it foams. The stuff without other stuff added is typically referred too as clear or pure ammonia. Be careful though, one place I found had a bottle called Pure Ammonia (was the brand name, not the type of ammonia it was) with no ingredient list, but when I shook it it foamed up really nicely. Ammonia won't do that unless it has something added to it. There are other ways to add ammonia to your tank but you should try to find a bottle, it's the easiest way.

Not sure where you live but I found my Ammonia under a store brand at Food City, "Food Club Supreme Clean Ammonia". I'd never been so happy to see a bottle of cleaning supplies in my life.

 

[waterdrop]

Walt's written that he's in Thailand. Should be very interesting to hear how his search goes (unless he just finds it on the first go, lol!)

~~waterdrop~~

 

[walt8880]

Right you are. The problem is that on any bottle here, all of the ingredient lists are written in Thai, and unfortunately, I can't read Thai ( my bad).

So, I will look at the list. If only a couple ingredients, I will shake it and hope.

I will do the best I can keep everyone informed as to how the saga unfolds.

 

[waterdrop]

Wow, can you find a Thai friend that's an english speaker? It would be great fun if you could find someone like that who would either consider it fun to go around with you or would help as your interpreter for a small fee or something...

 

[darenshan54]

i got z danios to start cycling, but once u get your real fish u realize they take up a lot of space... i would fishless cycle trust me i learned the hard way... if u must cycle with them, and after give them back to the store or friend.

 

[waterdrop]

i got z danios to start cycling, but once u get your real fish u realize they take up a lot of space... i would fishless cycle trust me i learned the hard way... if u must cycle with them, and after give them back to the store or friend.

I think Walt just had a -plan- to use danios but has now changed his mind and is planning to fishless cycle. We are waiting to see how the heck he is going to find pure aqueous ammonia in Thailand. Ammonia is pretty universal, so there's not much doubt it'll be there somewhere. Its just a question of communication!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[ZoddyZod]

You have convinced me. If I can find some plaim ammonia here in Thailand, I will do fishless cycle.

thanks

Smart move, I put Danios in two days after filling the tank (didnt know about 'fish-less') and it took EIGHTY DAYS to cycle. I was doing 25%-33% water changes almost every day.......save yourself the bother!