Cycle Process Going Fast?

[Jollyroger2]

Longtime tank owner here but have been on a 9 year hiatus once my twins were born. Had a 60 gallon tank but sold it. Recently got a 20 gallon starter tank so the kids could have something to take care of. I set it up this past Saturday 5/2, washed the gravel and decorations, filled it, started the filter and air pump/bubbles, etc. Added a few drops of de-chlorinator per the instructions and also some drops of pure ammonia to start the cycle. No fish yet of course.

On Sunday I tested the water. PH was 8.2 so I added a little "PH downer", and I tested the ammonia which read between 0-0.25 ppm. The Nitrites were 0, and the Nitrates were between 0-5 ppm.

Late Monday the tank started getting cloudy which I attributed to the normal bacteria growth. Tuesday we tested the water again and the PH was still high, around 8.2 so I added more PH downer (I didn't add the required dose the first time), the ammonia was still between 0-0.25 and the Nitries and Nitrates were basically 0.

I plan on checking everything again on Thursday, the kids would like to get fish this weekend and the numbers other than the PH seem ok, but is that too early still? Everything I've read on the test kit or online says if the ammonia and nitrites are around 0 it's good to add fish. Any thoughts? Thank you.

 

[seangee]

Yes it is still to early. Read this link which explains the whole process.

Your pH is fine and trying to change it will do more harm than good. What is the pH of your tap water after standing in a clean glass for 24 hours? I would expect it to be similar but it is worth confirming that nothing in your substrate is affecting it.

A more important parameter is GH or general hardness. This is not likely to change over time and will determine what types of fish are suitable for your water. The info may be available on your water supplier's website. We will need both the number and the unit because there are several different units in common use. It is important to know what this is before choosing fish as some fish are better suited to hard water and others to soft water. Choosing the right fish for your water means less health issues down the road.

 

[Essjay]

The first thing to say is stop adding the pH down. The fact that the pH has gone back up, together with the pH level, suggests that you have hard water. If you do, adding chemicals to reduce the pH won't do anything - it will lower the pH initially then as you have found it will bounce back. This yoyo-ing is bad for fish. it is much better to keep fish that come from water similar to yours.
The first thing to do is find out how hard your water is. Look on your water provider's website to see if they give your hardness - you need a number and the unit of measurement rather than some vague words - the unit is important as there are several they could use.
GH is more important to fish than pH. If you find you do have hard water, fish that need hard water also need high pH.


To your cycle.
You need to add more than a few drops of ammonia - you need to add enough to get a reading of 3 ppm for fishless cycling. This will grow more than enough bacteria to support a sensibly stocked tank of fish. Less than 3 ppm runs the risk of there not being enough bacteria at the end of the cycle.
The fact that your ammonia is still at the level you added and nitrite is still zero shows the cycle has not yet started. it took 3 weeks for my ammonia to drop, and 7 weeks for the cycle to complete.
I strongly recommend that you add more ammonia and follow the method in this link https://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first.421488/ You'll see that this method says to only add ammonia when certain targets have been reached.

I'm afraid it will be a lot longer than Thursday before the tank is ready for fish. If you add Tetra Safe Start in addition to following that method, you should be able to get fish sooner. In the meantime, find out your hardness (or GH) then you and your children can spend some time researching which fish would be suitable for your water.



EDIT: Seangee posted at the same time as me

 

[Essjay]

I should have mentioned plants.

Instead of adding ammonia, you can use plants to do a silent cycle. Plants take up ammonia as fertiliser and they do not convert it into nitrite or nitrate. Provided there are enough fast growing plants, fish can be added to a tank a few at a time as soon as the plants are actively growing. Floating plants and fast growing stem plants are ideal for this. Ammonia and nitrite should be monitored after each addition of fish, and water changes done if either of them show a reading above zero.

 

[seangee]

EDIT: Seangee posted at the same time as me

Ha - and we even agreed

 

[Essjay]

Great minds........

 

[Jollyroger2]

Thanks for the responses. Our water is in the 3.5-7 grains per gallon range for this part of Texas so yes it's on the hard side. As for fish, we were looking to get no more than 10 (again 20 gal tank) and typically small ones, a combination of some tetras, mollies, guppies, platys, cory cats, etc. Not all of them, just 2-3 small groups combined, they seem to all be ok with ph in the 7.5 to 8 range.

The cloudiness in the water is slightly less today. So I should add more ammonia? I don't know if I can get out today/tomorrow to get live plants.

 

[Essjay]

The two units used in fishkeeping are dH (or German degrees) and ppm.

3.5 grains per gallon = 3.4 dH and 60 ppm
7 grains per gallon = 6.8 dH and 120 ppm.
So yours is somewhere between those two levels.

This is soft water not hard water. It will be fine for tetras and cories but is far too soft for guppies, platies and mollies, I'm afraid; guppies and platies need over 200 ppm while mollies need over 250 ppm. (And 20 gallons is too small for mollies, which are big fish)

Tetras and corys are shoaling fish which need to be in a group of at least 6 of the same species.


You have plenty time to decide which fish as your tank has not started cycling yet. If you get fish now you will find yourself doing a fish-in cycle, with the large daily water changes that will entail.

 

[seangee]

Please confirm the pH after standing in a glass for 24 hours. Such a high pH with that hardness is not common (although not impossible). It is worth confirming that nothing in the tank is affecting your pH just in case.

Based on that hardness I agree - tetras and corys will work but live bearers will have health issues and ultimately shortened lifespans.

 

[Jollyroger2]

The two units used in fishkeeping are dH (or German degrees) and ppm.

3.5 grains per gallon = 3.4 dH and 60 ppm
7 grains per gallon = 6.8 dH and 120 ppm.
So yours is somewhere between those two levels.

This is soft water not hard water. It will be fine for tetras and cories but is far too soft for guppies, platies and mollies, I'm afraid; guppies and platies need over 200 ppm while mollies need over 250 ppm. (And 20 gallons is too small for mollies, which are big fish)

Tetras and corys are shoaling fish which need to be in a group of at least 6 of the same species.


You have plenty time to decide which fish as your tank has not started cycling yet. If you get fish now you will find yourself doing a fish-in cycle, with the large daily water changes that will entail.

Weird, our water (Houston area) is usually called hard because of the magnesium and calcium in it. I just had the valves on my water heaters replaced due to calcium buildup.

The local aquarium store (not a chain like Petco or Petsmart) told me most of those fish should do fine but may not breed (which is ok) or may not reach full lifespans.

I checked again this morning, the PH is about 8 and the ammonia is still about 0.25-0.50 ppm. I've had those fish before, again not a rookie here just trying to remember the process. I didn't have issues before and had some fish live a very long time. I'll keep plugging away at it though. Probably will tell the kids wait til next weekend to be sure.

 

[FishGuest5123]

Weird, our water (Houston area) is usually called hard because of the magnesium and calcium in it. I just had the valves on my water heaters replaced due to calcium buildup.

The local aquarium store (not a chain like Petco or Petsmart) told me most of those fish should do fine but may not breed (which is ok) or may not reach full lifespans.

I checked again this morning, the PH is about 8 and the ammonia is still about 0.25-0.50 ppm. I've had those fish before, again not a rookie here just trying to remember the process. I didn't have issues before and had some fish live a very long time. I'll keep plugging away at it though. Probably will tell the kids wait til next weekend to be sure.

Hi to a fellow Houstinian! I actually live in Pearland. My PH is always about 7.5. You may want to pick up a bottle of Safe Start+ to add to your filter. It’s a bottled bacteria and really does speed up the cycling process. Just don’t use Seachem Prime as your dechlorinator for 24 hours after adding Safe Start or it will kill the new bacteria. After 24 hours it’s fine to use.

 

[Jollyroger2]

Hi to a fellow Houstinian! I actually live in Pearland. My PH is always about 7.5. You may want to pick up a bottle of Safe Start+ to add to your filter. It’s a bottled bacteria and really does speed up the cycling process. Just don’t use Seachem Prime as your dechlorinator for 24 hours after adding Safe Start or it will kill the new bacteria. After 24 hours it’s fine to use.

Ok, maybe I'll test everything in daylight, I've read the colors look odd under indoor light but I can't imagine it would be that much different. I'll look into the Safe Start + as well. I have only used the Seachem Prime one time, that was right after adding the water this past weekend. I added that and then six small drops of pure ammonia. I'll get some Safe Start and add that. Thanks for the help! I'm further north up by Conroe...

 

[Tez_20]

The cloudiness in the water is slightly less today

When you start cycling a tanking you always get a bloom happen in the water and it lasts for several days before it clears

 

[Jollyroger2]

When you start cycling a tanking you always get a bloom happen in the water and it lasts for several days before it clears

Yeah that part I was ready for. The kids were funny, freaked out yesterday morning..."what happened to the tank!!!!" lol. Told them it was normal and bacteria was growing. "ewwwwwwwwwwww".

Hey going back to my Pearland friend, that Safestart +, the directions say put the whole bottle in for tanks up to 200 gallons? Is that right?

 

[Jan Cavalieri]

Since your tank will work with Tetras - have your kids take a look at the Glofish Tetras - wild colors.

The story behind this is that companies used fish that change color as part of a way to detect certain chemicals in spill-ways so it has a scientific basis (good learning point) - then somebody decided to commercialize it and make fish that are permanently colored purple, green, hot pink, hot red, blue, orange - you get the idea. I suspect these appeal primarily to kids but I'm a big kid and I like them too - they are still tetras, just genetically modified to be that color - not dyed or injected with dye - it's part of their genetics and its part of the fun. Supposedly they pass their colors on to any offspring - I have no idea what two different colors of tetra's do if they mate - maybe they don't mate, it would be interesting to find out. But it's just the kind of fish kids (and some adults) will appreciate. Compared to saltwater fish, to me, fresh water fish are so bland in color - these guys really brighten up your tank. Generally available at nearly every fish store and fish stores online. You could still get a small group of cory's - they don't occupy the same part of the tank as tetra's so you should be able to get 5 of those at the very most - I usually buy at least 3 and they are pretty cool to watch and ugly enough to be adorable.