Cory Tankmates

[Byron]

Yeah, it definitely uses salt. Just added a bunch. I'm assuming the level of hardness I have is incompatible with fish life??

 
Not at all.  Some fish prefer harder water.  Some others will manage, and some will not have an easy time of it by any means.  Livebearers (any of them) will be fine.  African rift lake cichlids too (not together of course).  And there are some fish among the cyprinids and characins.
 
Another option is to dilute the well water with "pure" water like RO, distilled or even rainwater.  The latter is ideal (unless you live in an industrial area).  Other members have more experience in this; I have the opposite water, very soft, so I don't keep harder water fish.
 
Just off the top of my head, one option would be Central American livebearers and possibly one of the peaceful CA cichlids.  A 55g tank as was mentioned in your initial post could become a very beautiful CA stream aquascape.  This is one of my favourite areas actually, but I stay away from it as I have very soft water; while I could take steps to harden the water (I have in the past for mollies and even rift lake cichlids) I've contented myself with a 90g River Habitat which is something along the lines of a CA stream, except with SE Asian fish.
 
Byron.

 

[jag51186]

Not to be a pain or come off lazy, but can you point me in the right direction for sources of info on CA streamscapes??

 

[Byron]

Not to be a pain or come off lazy, but can you point me in the right direction for sources of info on CA streamscapes??

 
I wish I could.  This is easier for me to describe than it is to find examples.  I just did a Google search, thinking I'd likely find a few, but most of the photos were any place but Central America.  So much for Google, again.
 
Pea gravel is a nice substrate, and you can get it in a basic brownish colour or a basic blackish colour.  I've had the former from a fish store, and the latter from a landscape/quarry supplier.  Pea gravel is about as large as you want to get with substrates, as any larger grain size and you can have issues with chunks of food and waste getting stuck.  But it makes a nice aquascape for a stream tank.  Another substrate is play sand, which might be better with certain cichlids and of course if corys are intended.  We don't have to be exactly tied to Central America with fish, provided they can manage with the water parameters.
 
Then, bits of river rock, which is the rounded mix-sized pebbles of rock you can get from landscape and quarry suppliers.  And some chunks of Malaysian Driftwood, the very dark brown almost black heavy wood that is ideal in most any aquascape as it can replicate roots, tree trunks, and/or fallen branches.
 
For plants, Vallisneria is ideal in harder water and would thrive.  An Amazon swordplant as a specimen plant, or a group of three, for a contrast to the Vallisneria.  And floating, some Pennywort or Water Lettuce.  Notice I'm avoiding stem plants (except for the pennywort) as they tend to require brighter light.  I have the plants mentioned, or have had, and they are easy.
 
I'm going to dig a bit and see if I can find photos or videos to illustrate.  Might take me a bit of time. 

 

[jag51186]

I'm thinking of using sand, I like the look a lot! You mentioning Cory's gives me hope! I'd really like a decent school of them, but I don't want to kill them off with hard water. =[ would the plants help even things out?? Btw thank you soooo much, you are a lifesaver!

I tried google as well, got about as far as you lol

 

[Byron]

The two most common species of cory, namely Corydoras aeneus and C. paleatus, should have better luck than the others.  We will still need to confirm those test results though.
 
OK, I found a couple of photos that are not bad for ideas, the sort of thing I have in my mind.  First one is actually one I just took of my present 90g which is a River Habitat; much of the rounded river rock is invisible thanks to the plant growth, but it may give the idea.  And the others are "Central American" aquascapes from the net.  Not saying I would follow them exactly, but I think they too convey the sort of impression.

 

[jag51186]

Got a new general hardness test kit tonite. Still reading at about 200 ppm. Yours is the closest to what I want honestly. I like the more heavily planted look with some driftwood and nice rounded river rock. I could be fine with a nice school of paleatus, even if I wanted habrosus or pygmies hehe. Going to hunt down what live bearers I can put in. From the sounds of it, most guppies, mollies, swordtails, or plates would be fine. Might mix and match some. Study, study, study lol

 

[Byron]

Got a new general hardness test kit tonite. Still reading at about 200 ppm. Yours is the closest to what I want honestly. I like the more heavily planted look with some driftwood and nice rounded river rock. I could be fine with a nice school of paleatus, even if I wanted habrosus or pygmies hehe. Going to hunt down what live bearers I can put in. From the sounds of it, most guppies, mollies, swordtails, or plates would be fine. Might mix and match some. Study, study, study lol

 
GH at 200 ppm is about 11 dGH, and that is not at all bad.  Some people have what is comically referred to as "liquid rock," it is so hard.  You have a fair amount of options here.  The livebearers is still a good one, but there is much more.
 
On the livebearer question, yes you can combine most of them, as you will have 4 feet of length.  One thing though, do not get any females, only males.  One female (with males of the same species) will not only mean a highly stressed female but regular and large batches of fry, and these are not easy to get rid of.  Some cross-species spawning may occur, or be attempted, too, depending which species, so it is best to avoid any females.
 
My 90g in that photo has evolved quite a bit in the five years it has been set up.  I have some earlier photos which may help to illustrate the river rock and wood placement aspect, as these are easier to see before the plants took off.  You will also see the Vallisneria I had originally in the front left half of this tank; it was more my very soft water than light that eventually killed it.  I would likely have better luck with Vallisneria today, as I am now supplementing this tank and two others with Equilibrium to raise the GH to around 6 dGH solely for the other plants; the swords develop serious calcium deficieny without this [see, we have problems too, lol].  Next time I see Vallisneria I may get a bunch.
 
Byron.

 

[jag51186]

Ah, you give me so much hope for a great tank!! I'm going to try to get the tank and equipment for it soon. I want to do a nice external filter to put lots of flow in the tank, as well as whatever extra I need to make enough flow for the plants. I really want some gentle motion in the plants! Need to start researching lights and good filters and thermometers!

 

[Byron]

Ah, you give me so much hope for a great tank!! I'm going to try to get the tank and equipment for it soon. I want to do a nice external filter to put lots of flow in the tank, as well as whatever extra I need to make enough flow for the plants. I really want some gentle motion in the plants! Need to start researching lights and good filters and thermometers!

 
Since you raise the question of water flow, I'll make a couple observations.
 
First on the plants.  Water flow is actually important, by which I mean that it not be too strong.  The water carries nutrients to plant leaves (some nutrients are primarily taken up by leaves, some exclusively, and many by leaves and roots) but too fast a flow can prohibit the plant from having sufficient time to assimilate the nutrients.  It takes four times longer for plants to take up CO2 from water than air, which I toss in just to show there is a difference.  Water flow does also help to keep the leaves free of sediment, which would block nutrient uptake.  So one want the happy medium.
 
Second on the fish, which is probably the more critical.  Some fish require (or at any rate appreciate) more water current, they are designed for it.  But many are the opposite.  I have observed this over several years in tanks long enough to provide both a current and still water, and it has been interesting to learn that given the option, most fish will remain in the quieter sections.  This is even more significant an observatin when you consider that fish know food floats in the current, yet they deliberately remain out of it.
 
Remember too that a filter is running 24/7, so there is no respite for fish, they are forced to remain in the current if we provide it.  And this wears down a fish, because considerable energy is being used just to swim into the current.  As soon as this happens, some important aspects of the fish's physiology lose out, and one of these is the immune system.  Stress weakens this as well, so it is a double whammy of sorts.
 
We haven't considered any specific species yet, other than general livebearers as one option, but these should be considered before the filter so you will be able to provide whatever current the fish need.  In most cases a happy medium is a canister rated for the tank size.  These usually come with a detachable spray bar, so you can vary the current accordingly.
 
Byron.

 

[jag51186]

I was planning on a canister rated for the tank or even slightly higher. Was just looking into them via this forum. I was under the impression that plants needed a good amount of flow, so thank you for that update. I will look for the happy medium!

What are the general rules of thumb for flow and filtration?? Like the 1 inch of fish per gallon rule, isn't it five times tank size for filtration??

 

[Byron]

I was planning on a canister rated for the tank or even slightly higher. Was just looking into them via this forum. I was under the impression that plants needed a good amount of flow, so thank you for that update. I will look for the happy medium!

What are the general rules of thumb for flow and filtration?? Like the 1 inch of fish per gallon rule, isn't it five times tank size for filtration??

 
You will find differing views on filtration among aquarists but there is a mix of fact and myth among them.
 
Live plants make a real difference.  It is possible to have a planted tank with no filter at all; I've done this, and both plants and fish were thriving.  A gentle water flow will benefit not only as I mentioned previously re the nutrients, but also circulating water will be more uniform in temperature and conditions.  However, you don't want to be driving out the much-needed CO2.  Plants are biological filters, and this reduces the need for such filtration.  The mechanical side (running the tank water through fine media to remove suspended particulate matter) is pretty much all you really need with plants.  Obviously I'm being very general here, and assuming a balanced fish/plant/water volume.
 
Something else to keep in mind is that more is not usually better when it comes to filtration, provided you have adequate to begin with.  We are not talking about overloaded or overcrowded tanks where another filter might be of some benefit, but even this has its limits.  The flow is related to this; it is possible to have too fast a flow through the filter that is detrimental because the bacteria can't do what they are there to do.
 
Rules can sometimes guide, but the factors involved are many and one has to consider the individual aquarium.  The species of fish as well as their numbers, the number and species of plants, and sometimes the water parameters all factor in to the equation.  In my 25+ years of keeping fish in tanks with live plants I have found that a good filter rated for the tank is all you need.  But we must realize that this can't be pushed over the edge.
 
Byron.

 

[jag51186]

I think you may have exhausted my current supply of questions! Most impressive! Now it's down to picking out all the specifics of what I want, ie fish, plants, which filter, lighting, etc

 

[Byron]

I think you may have exhausted my current supply of questions! Most impressive! Now it's down to picking out all the specifics of what I want, ie fish, plants, which filter, lighting, etc

 
You'll have plenty more questions.  None of us ever stops learning, at least not if we are honest.
 
Think of the fish first.  Once you know the likely species and the sort of tank you want to suit the fish (replicating a stream, a lake, a lagoon, a swamp...) selecting the hardware will be easier.
 
Byron.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Sorry I am late to the party, but these might help re CA biotopes:
http/fish.mongabay.com/biotope_central_america_river.htm
http/ttp/fish.mongabay.com/biotope_central_america_lake.htm
http/fish.mongabay.com/biotope_cen_america_estuary.htm

 

[jag51186]

Welcome to the party! Appreciate the info. So far, I'm thinking that I like rainbow fish a lot, but it seems like they like a lot of space to swim, which may not jive with a heavier planted tank...if I end up planting heavily lol. Also, I'm finding conflicting opinions on how they handle hard water.

My main debate currently is if I want groups of smaller fish darting around amongst plants, or more open space for open swimming. So many decisions.

Another question I have is, since plants require what fish produce (nitrogen products) to live. Can I just have a planted tank for awhile, while I'm making sure it is properly cycled for fish?? Or will they not do well until I add in fish??