contemplating worm treatment

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

I have 3 fish I am pretty sure have some kind of worm - mollies - 2 out of 3 act sick, the female seems normal and dark poop but how long can mollies go without breeding? Had her since spring. had all 3 of them since spring @GaryE I also had my daughter's really bloated fish in my hex tank for several months last year. I think that fish is still alive at her house, and again I haven't seen a worm, the fish currently in that tank I don't want to risk unnecessarily. The mollies were in with my bronze corydoras, and were in with some of my julii corydoras. Right now I haven't done anything. When unsure I do nothing. Right now I have 6 tanks up. I will have 9 fairly soon, I do not want migrating illness from tank to tank. Have I considered euthanizing the mollies to resolve the issue, yes. Am I going to? No. I will treat with something and see what comes out. So maybe I just treat the mollie tank with the flubenzadole and observe, since I removed the sand, and see what comes out of these poorly fish, before I decide what to do with the rest.

Can you get some photos of the mollies?

The really bloated loach - if it was really bloated and it was worms, that would be a super heavy worm burden... and if it really was worms and it's been bloated since last year, it would have died by now, and your daughter would be losing other fish from worms too. Are you sure the loach wasn't just a chunky female? Adult loaches can get quite chunky, the females especially. What kind of loach is it?

I agree that I wouldn't rush to treat something you might not have. Personally I'd worm livebearers (especially ones from a fish store) while in QT because they do often carry worms, and I've battled camallanus before and never want to again - but you really haven't seen any evidence of worms, that I can tell.

Fish get a weird appearance with worms. I didn't notice bloating - quite the opposite. The guppies I had got skinny, listless, drooping tails, before dying. They can't live for that long once they have a heavy worm burden, since the worms keep multiplying, attaching to the digestive tract and causing internal damage, and sucking up all the nutrition and starving the fish. I've started to recognise when fish have what I think of as that "wormy look" now, but they tend to only look like that once the worm burden has really taken a toll and they're close to passing away.

I was losing fish for months before I finally saw the tell-tale red bristles sticking out of one guppy, and learned what I had. But I lost a good amount of adult fish, and young guppies passed away at about 2 months old. Not older, not younger. I figured that by two months, they'd ingested worm eggs that had hatched and grown, but the fish weren't as developed and grown as the adult fish, so couldn't handle the worm burden for as long as an adult that ingested worm eggs.
I'd QT the mollies you're worried about, perhaps worm them in the bare bottom tank to see if you find anything, but monitor the rest. Look for stringy white poop, that wormy look I described, and red bristles. But I think if you had camallanus worms, you'd know it by now because fish would be dropping like flies after a time.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

If you're setting up new tanks and potentially transferring disease, use separate equipment for the new tanks until you're confident it's safe. Worm eggs can be transferred by buckets, nets, moving tank decor from an infected tank to a new one, etc, not just by transferring fish. So you could go ahead and set up the new ones, but be religious about hand washing if touching tank stuff and have separate buckets/syphons/nets etc. Harder to do if you use a python though.

 

[Alice B]

I have 3 pythons. the one I used on the 29 and 55 got rinsed out with hot water between, I did the 55 first as the mollies were never in it, and then I hung in a tree outfront for some Texas sun sterilization. I have not dosed anyone. The baby mollie is on another thread, she is about 3 months old and not right, not exactly spinning but not right, male mollie is thin and not as strong a swimmer. Female is fine. I am really tired. I'm off tomorrow. I don't do anything complicated when I am this tired. That medicine is going to have to be measured to a very small amount to do a 10 gallon, and if it is not truly water soluble, well normally I dissolve prazi in vodka. Everything dissolves in SOMETHING. But I am not awake enough for science.

I checked with my daughter and the fat loach of February 2021 is still alive and still fat, even fatter according to granddaughter she looks like a poofy toy.... Daughter did lose her albino bristlenose last week with no apparent symptoms, but she had poured water in and may have released something from her 6 year old sand bed. Water changes do not happen often at her house either. The other loach was here much longer, I couldn't catch him until June of this year. He hid when it was time to go home, and was in the hex, then in the 55 when I had a little snail issue. I think they are yoyo loaches I think. The skinny one was very hard to catch and has been home for 3 months now.

Every tank has its own net. Some don't have a scrubby, but if they have one it is their own. My arms are the biggest risk moving from tank to tank, but I have soap and water. I think I shall sleep on all of this. to see see the baby mollie https://www.fishforums.net/threads/whirling-mollie.483753/#post-4211355 The water quality is fine, has been fine. She could barely control her movements in the 29, I suspected malnutrition from failure to compete when I first moved her to quarantine - that would be a wormy thing, malnutrition. And her father is very thin. Mom is plump and pooping little black lumps so she seems to be fine but is quarantined with the others in a bare 10

if praziquantel would work, I have plenty of it. (I work on ponds, I have a wholesaler for a couple of meds). Sleep is calling me.

 

[jaylach]

I have 3 pythons. the one I used on the 29 and 55 got rinsed out with hot water between, I did the 55 first as the mollies were never in it, and then I hung in a tree outfront for some Texas sun sterilization. I have not dosed anyone. The baby mollie is on another thread, she is about 3 months old and not right, not exactly spinning but not right, male mollie is thin and not as strong a swimmer. Female is fine. I am really tired. I'm off tomorrow. I don't do anything complicated when I am this tired. That medicine is going to have to be measured to a very small amount to do a 10 gallon, and if it is not truly water soluble, well normally I dissolve prazi in vodka. Everything dissolves in SOMETHING. But I am not awake enough for science.

I checked with my daughter and the fat loach of February 2021 is still alive and still fat, even fatter according to granddaughter she looks like a poofy toy.... Daughter did lose her albino bristlenose last week with no apparent symptoms, but she had poured water in and may have released something from her 6 year old sand bed. Water changes do not happen often at her house either. The other loach was her much longer, I couldn't catch him until June of this year. He hid when it was time to go home, and was in the hex, then in the 55 when I had a little snail issue. I think they are yoyo loaches I think. The skinny one was very hard to catch and has been home for 3 months now.

Every tank has its own net. Some don't have a scrubby, but if they have one it is their own. My arms are the biggest risk moving from tank to tank, but I have soap and water. I think I shall sleep on all of this. to see see the baby mollie https://www.fishforums.net/threads/whirling-mollie.483753/#post-4211355 The water quality is fine, has been fine. She could barely control her movements in the 29, I suspected malnutrition from failure to compete when I first moved her to quarantine - that would be a wormy thing, malnutrition. And her father is very thin. Mom is plump and pooping little black lumps so she seems to be fine but is quarantined with the others in a bare 10

if praziquantel would work, I have plenty of it. (I work on ponds, I have a wholesaler for a couple of meds). Sleep is calling me.

Just remember that only you actually sees your tank. While extremely valuable a lot of advice here is generic. In general the advice here is absolutely wonderful but is still largely generic and not specific to your specific situation. Evey tank is different and requires different needs.

Medicate or not... salt or not... One way or the other you have to make a decision and live with it. If your decision fails at least you tried and learned for future reference. That is better than procrastinating and doing nothing.

 

[Alice B]

I am going to treat mollies. Called daughter, her fat loach is still fat and sassy. So hex tank is 100% safe, I've had those fish for years.
I am researching quarantine procedures for tetras.
I am keeping equipment separate for each tank and just using good cleanup on hoses and me if they have to be done on same day. I've found 100 degree weather dry in the garage to be pretty good for draining hoses and avoiding mildew in them, probably kills germs too. I think I am trying praziquantel on the mollies, and if I don't open that $56 package I might still be within amazon return window. I may let the levamisole come in as a quarantine product. So far he's out of stock and ship date looks like October 1st. In a bare tank, if I must buy fish (and I went year without buying fish before, because mine were breeding), but if I must buy in a bare tank I can see what comes out and levamisole might be safer

 

[Alice B]

Mollies treated with praziquantel diluted in a few drops of vodka. With shrimp out, I feel confident that I could treat my 55 and 29 with praziquantel if needed. Will observe... Thank you all

 

[Colin_T]

are you using liquid praziquantel or tablet?
tablets can be ground up and mixed with frozen food, then fed to the fish. Liquid is normally just added to the tank.

praziquantel only treats tapeworm and livebearers usually have thread/ round worms.

I would have gone with flubendazole or levamisole first but see what happens with the praziquantel.

 

[Alice B]

I have praziquantel powder that I dissolve in a couple of drops of alcohol - vodka in this case, and then mix with tank water. I used because it works on gill flukes and the symptoms on the baby molly and to a certain extent the male, are gills. In 7 days I can do a water change and try something else. Levamisole is not available yet, flubendazole is most effective fed, and these fish aren't really eating. I may lose them, but they are in a 10 with good filtration and aeration and no other fish

 

[Alice B]

Male molly video. (is it y or ie)

Today's pictures, after adding praziquantel. Video shows his "breathing"

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Hmm. Well, something is definitely wrong with the adults at least (and the baby, if it's not eating either) but I wouldn't lay money on worms. They don't have that "wormy look" I mentioned before, and usually when any fish or mammal is carrying worms, they're ravenous, because the worms are taking all the nutrients. Only stop eating in the day or two before passing away, and if that were the case here, I'd expect them to have that wormy look. I'm basing that on how my fish looked when they had worms and I began losing them, and when others post photos here of their fish with worms, so you know that it's a personal opinion, you know I'm not an expert!
Examples of fish with what I think of as that wormy look, once the fish has lost a lot of condition;

Notice the bent spine, clamped fins, listless looking.
While searching google images for fish with worms, I saw one that had the look, then went "wait, is that MY fish and photo??" and it was! These are the photos I posted here, when battling a worm infestation in my tanks. So that was a weird moment for me! Note again, bent spine, listless swimming style, and can see white stringy poop (the yellow female guppy; the others were carrying worms too, but she was the one suffering the most - she did recover after treatment):

The male does look very thin though. Hopefully whatever is ailing them is fixed with the prazi... but it's not good once a fish has reached the point of not eating anymore... if any of them do improve after treatment, having seen them now, I would personally go ahead and treat all of the tanks after removing the fish that can't handle the meds.

I think you need @Colin_T and perhaps @emeraldking to see this video and the photos

 

[Alice B]

I haven't seen enteric septicemia in about 10 years. It was everywhere locally in the very early 2000s, then tetracycline feed quit working on it, and I quit buying fish locally. Tough to quarantine for because it was a temperature activated disease, if you quarantined over 82 no sign, move to tank at 78, and it progressed, it also manifested differently on different species. It affected kidney, liver and brain and that spinning baby mollie reminds me of enteric septicemia. I hate to mix meds but I'd rather mix with prazi than with metronidazole. I am considering an antibiotic. It was coming from probably SE Asia fish farms, I figure they eventually lost enough money to tackle at the source.

 

[Alice B]

Dad is looking worse, mom is eating, baby still twirling. I do not know why in the intervening years cephalexin became available as a fish antibiotic, but I am going to give it a try. If it is a brain infection, which I am beginning to suspect, hit it hard and hope for the best.

 

[emeraldking]

Dad is looking worse, mom is eating, baby still twirling. I do not know why in the intervening years cephalexin became available as a fish antibiotic, but I am going to give it a try. If it is a brain infection, which I am beginning to suspect, hit it hard and hope for the best.

If the fish is keeping twirling, it's most likely that there's a brain problem. In that case, there's unfortunately no cure to treat this.

 

[Alice B]

I am treating with antibiotics, it is probably too late but if she has it, both of her parents are carriers and they are in quarantine, she moved to quarantine at the first sign of illness.

 

[Alice B]

Contemplating euthanizing daddy and baby. Water change and continuing to treat female.