Colour of Discus Eggs

[98Min]

Our breeding pair had around 4 spawns before with clear eggs. Yesterday they started spawning again, but to my surprise the eggs were orange! Is there something wrong with the discus and the eggs or is it normal for this to happen?
Also the eggs doesn’t seem to stick well to the breeding cone this time, majority of them had slid down to the bottom of the cone and few are scattered near the cone at the bottom of the tank. Please do advise if something might be wrong with the discus fish?

 

[Colin_T]

Hi and welcome to the forum

Orange/ yellow eggs are normal and the colour is from the yolk.

They should not be falling off tho. The female might not be pushing them onto the breeding cone properly or there could be a genetic fault with the female. I am more inclined to think it is a young inexperienced female and if you give them a bit more time they will get it right eventually.

You have to remember that fish don't have books to learn from or others to teach them how to breed and rear up young. So it becomes trial and error with some prs being better than others. Most discus and angelfish prs get it right after 5 or 6 attempts but some can take longer.

Quite often they eat the eggs when first laid, then they start to guard the eggs but eat the babies when they first hatch. This is usually due to the babies wiggling about and the parents think "food". After a few more attempts the adults stop eating the eggs and babies and then everything settles down.

Give them time and they should eventually work things out.

 

[The Lumpfish Guy]

Our breeding pair had around 4 spawns before with clear eggs. Yesterday they started spawning again, but to my surprise the eggs were orange! Is there something wrong with the discus and the eggs or is it normal for this to happen?
Also the eggs doesn’t seem to stick well to the breeding cone this time, majority of them had slid down to the bottom of the cone and few are scattered near the cone at the bottom of the tank. Please do advise if something might be wrong with the discus fish?

Nutrition is a key component in egg quality, so when your fish are laying eggs consider feeding more often and a more varied diet. Eggs require a huge amount of energy and that all has to come from the female, and if the female is not getting enough nutrition, it will come out of here energy reserves.

 

[Cichlid4life]

Our breeding pair had around 4 spawns before with clear eggs. Yesterday they started spawning again, but to my surprise the eggs were orange! Is there something wrong with the discus and the eggs or is it normal for this to happen?
Also the eggs doesn’t seem to stick well to the breeding cone this time, majority of them had slid down to the bottom of the cone and few are scattered near the cone at the bottom of the tank. Please do advise if something might be wrong with the discus fish?

the other times the eggs were not fertile, this time they are, but the female learned how hard she needs to push the eggs against the cone for the eggs to stick, and they have the last three times as your said, but now that they finally properly fertilized the eggs, they are growing heavier as they get ready to hatch, but when the eggs did not fertilized before, they did not gain any weight, therefore your female thought they were and she learned that the make them stick was to do it the she she has done just now when they tried to spawn again, but the eggs are heavier now and that might be why they are falling off, but next time the female should probably know to push the eggs a little bit more next time against the surface of the breeding cone.

 

[98Min]

the other times the eggs were not fertile, this time they are, but the female learned how hard she needs to push the eggs against the cone for the eggs to stick, and they have the last three times as your said, but now that they finally properly fertilized the eggs, they are growing heavier as they get ready to hatch, but when the eggs did not fertilized before, they did not gain any weight, therefore your female thought they were and she learned that the make them stick was to do it the she she has done just now when they tried to spawn again, but the eggs are heavier now and that might be why they are falling off, but next time the female should probably know to push the eggs a little bit more next time against the surface of the breeding cone.

Hi and welcome to the forum

Orange/ yellow eggs are normal and the colour is from the yolk.

They should not be falling off tho. The female might not be pushing them onto the breeding cone properly or there could be a genetic fault with the female. I am more inclined to think it is a young inexperienced female and if you give them a bit more time they will get it right eventually.

You have to remember that fish don't have books to learn from or others to teach them how to breed and rear up young. So it becomes trial and error with some prs being better than others. Most discus and angelfish prs get it right after 5 or 6 attempts but some can take longer.

Quite often they eat the eggs when first laid, then they start to guard the eggs but eat the babies when they first hatch. This is usually due to the babies wiggling about and the parents think "food". After a few more attempts the adults stop eating the eggs and babies and then everything settles down.

Give them time and they should eventually work things out.

Hi, thanks for the reply! They actually had clear eggs for all their previous spawning, but suddenly it became orange this time round which is why i’m concerned.
This pair had actually spawned before and the previous clear egg batches had all hatched into wrigglers, there was even one small successful batch of around 30+ fry that are now around 3 months old. However most of the current orange eggs had turned white with fungus, i’m not really sure how the remaining would turn out but i’m assuming that the parents are going to eat them too.
They were both on medication for a week previously as they fell sick after we transferred both of them into the community tank to let the fry grow, so i’m thinking if that might have affected their reproductive system or something?

 

[98Min]

Nutrition is a key component in egg quality, so when your fish are laying eggs consider feeding more often and a more varied diet. Eggs require a huge amount of energy and that all has to come from the female, and if the female is not getting enough nutrition, it will come out of here energy reserves.

Hi, thanks for your reply! Should i add vitamins to their food to improve their nutrition intake or are there any specific foods that i should feed them during this period of time? As of now i only feed them a variety of dried flakes/pellets, am considering to get frozen food for them but i’m not sure if it would help?
Also they were both on medication for a week previously as they fell sick after we transferred them into the community tank to wean off the fry from mum and have more space to grow. Dad was transferred to the community tank way before as we found out that he’s the one eating all the fry. I’m thinking if the treatment process might have destroyed their reproductive system or something?

 

[The Lumpfish Guy]

Should i add vitamins to their food to improve their nutrition intake or are there any specific foods that i should feed them during this period of time? As of now i only feed them a variety of dried flakes/pellets, am considering to get frozen food for them but i’m not sure if it would help?

The key component in many fishes egg quality is Fatty Acids, so a diet which is rich in good quality fats such as fishmeal and fish oil can really help. (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/raq.12025) this review article covers many aspects of egg quality if you are interested.
A variety of foods is the best way, There is very little information which can tell us exactly what discus need ( all that science is focused on aquaculture food fish). But keeping them well fed, and on a varied diet can allow them to put what they need into the eggs.
The colouration is most likely from Beta Carotene which has been present in the food which they have laid down into the egg. This isn't bad and feeding a varied diet can help to keep these levels up.

I’m thinking if the treatment process might have destroyed their reproductive system or something?

I would doubt it very much, it probably didn't have a good effect on the egg batch, but The reproductive system would be just fine

 

[98Min]

The key component in many fishes egg quality is Fatty Acids, so a diet which is rich in good quality fats such as fishmeal and fish oil can really help. (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/raq.12025) this review article covers many aspects of egg quality if you are interested.
A variety of foods is the best way, There is very little information which can tell us exactly what discus need ( all that science is focused on aquaculture food fish). But keeping them well fed, and on a varied diet can allow them to put what they need into the eggs.
The colouration is most likely from Beta Carotene which has been present in the food which they have laid down into the egg. This isn't bad and feeding a varied diet can help to keep these levels up.
I would doubt it very much, it probably didn't have a good effect on the egg batch, but The reproductive system would be just fine

Thank you, i would look into the link that you had sent. They didn’t had any issues at all from the previous batches, other than dad eating the fry... But many issues cropped up after the medication process which caused growing concern for the pair’s well being. Am glad to know that it didn’t destroy their system, thanks for your help

 

[The Lumpfish Guy]

But many issues cropped up after the medication process

Yeah, the treatment and their recovery would have taken resources away from the eggs. Not serious of a threat to stop them from spawning, but enough to reduce the egg quality by the sound of it.

 

[Cichlid4life]

Hi, thanks for the reply! They actually had clear eggs for all their previous spawning, but suddenly it became orange this time round which is why i’m concerned.
This pair had actually spawned before and the previous clear egg batches had all hatched into wrigglers, there was even one small successful batch of around 30+ fry that are now around 3 months old. However most of the current orange eggs had turned white with fungus, i’m not really sure how the remaining would turn out but i’m assuming that the parents are going to eat them too.
They were both on medication for a week previously as they fell sick after we transferred both of them into the community tank to let the fry grow, so i’m thinking if that might have affected their reproductive system or something?

Do you have any active carbon in the tank or filters? Carbon will remove chemicals from the water including medications, if you have not added any carbon to the filters nor the tank itself, the medication is only going to get removed by weekly water changes, and even then small amounts stay in the water, so to speak, the medication might still be in the water, and it might be affecting the eggs' health, development, or other that can be the reason for the orange eggs. What did you use to treat the discus that you said was about a week ago?

 

[98Min]

Do you have any active carbon in the tank or filters? Carbon will remove chemicals from the water including medications, if you have not added any carbon to the filters nor the tank itself, the medication is only going to get removed by weekly water changes, and even then small amounts stay in the water, so to speak, the medication might still be in the water, and it might be affecting the eggs' health, development, or other that can be the reason for the orange eggs. What did you use to treat the discus that you said was about a week ago?

Nope there isn’t any carbon. Ohh maybe i should consider changing the whole tank of water and cleaning the filter while i’m at it... I used something called “Power Live P-Fix” which according to the shop owner i got it from, said it was to treat fin rot, fungus and bacterial infection? Also i treated them one month ago for a duration of one week.

 

[Cichlid4life]

i googled it and i found nothing but cigarette lighters, pills, and i am not familiar with anything called Power Live P-fix, and i don't think it is a real product.

 

[Colin_T]

What are the ingredients in the medication you used?

What were the symptoms on the fish when they were "sick" and had to be moved?

If discus are breeding they won't be sick. For the most part, fish breed when healthy, not when they are sick and not when they are recovering from an ailment.

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What are you feeding the fish?
Do not feed discus or other fishes mammal meat (beef heart, liver, etc) because they don't digest it well. They should get raw or cooked marine/ aquatic organisms like prawn, fish, squid, mussel, brineshrimp, daphnia, mysis shrimp, and insects and insect larvae. Small earthworms and other types of worm (gindal, micro, white) used for fish food are also fine.

If you want to add vitamins you can use a fish vitamin. If you can't find that then look for a reptile or bird vitamin supplement. Try to get a dry powder form and check the expiry date before you buy it. If you get fish vitamins you can use it every day as directed on the packet. If you use a bird of reptile vitamin supplement, use it once a day for 6 days then have 1 day without it. Then use it for another 6 days and 1 day without.

The best way to add vitamins is to sprinkle a small amount on some frozen (but defrosted) food, mix it in or if using a liquid supplement, let it soak for about 30 seconds and then feed it to the fish.

Fish need to be fed well for at least 2 weeks prior to spawning to produce healthy gametes. I use to feed my fish 3-4 times per day with dry, live and frozen foods for a month before breeding. I did 75% water changes & gravel cleans every day or every couple of days to compensate for the extra waste in the water.

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If you have concerns about chemicals in the water after treatment, do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate each day for a week. Make sure any new water is free of chlorine/ chloramine before it is added to the tank.

Wipe the inside of the glass down and clean the filter if it hasn't been done in the last 2 weeks. Filters should be cleaned at least once a month and preferably more often. Filter materials should be cleaned in a bucket of tank water.

 

[The Lumpfish Guy]

If discus are breeding they won't be sick. For the most part, fish breed when healthy, not when they are sick and not when they are recovering from an ailment.

Not true, If the fish has begun to commit to vitellogenesis when exposed to a stressor, those eggs will either be re-absorbed or will continue to spawn but be of poor "quality". But re-absorption only really happens in extreme stressors, and I have encountered many fish which have spawned with half their side rotted away from an infection. Or on post-mortem they have been covered in granulomas, cycts and other "fun" things. where they have a clear infection and still have gone through spawning.

 

[Colin_T]

If they are exposed to a stress factor like poor water quality then yes they might continue to breed, but sick discus don't breed. That is to say if the fish has a disease that is adversely affecting its health (not including TB), it won't come into breeding condition. The fish were producing eggs quite regularly, which would suggest they weren't sick.

Fish infected with Mycobacterium (TB) will continue to breed and act normally while the bacteria slowly grows on organs. Due to the TB's slower growth rate, a fish can continue breeding for months whilst granulomas slowly intrude into the organs before the organ eventually fails and the fish dies. It's a bit like cancer in animals. When in its early stages animals can still breed, but once the diseases goes past the critical point, then there won't be more offspring from that animal.

I know some fish breed when they are about to die. Melanotaenia rainbowfish will have a spawning frenzy when in very shallow warm water (caused by a pool drying out). The fish breed and die and a week later the eggs hatch if there is any water left. I have seen a similar thing with pygmy perch (Edelia vitatta and Nanatherina balstoni) in the south-west of WA where the adults all up and die over night and a week later the pool of water is full of newly hatched fry. This has been put down to a survival instinct where the adult fish put the last of their reserves into eggs & sperm in a last ditch effort to keep the species alive.

Killifish do a similar thing when the water level gets too low. They spawn like mad and then die and the eggs sit in the mud until it rains.