nortonmad213
Fishaholic
i have amazon frogbit in my tank, floats around lovely and easy to remove
Ch4Rlies First High Tech Planted Tank Atttempt!
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OP
OP
Lovely, thanks guys.
Have decided will go for silvania natans, I have had this before and i liked it immensely. One thing though, with this tank being such small tank, the lights are only about 2 or 3 inches above the water, will this burn silvania?
Now just gotta find where i can buy it at a reasonable price.
Previously when had silvania in a different larger tank I had T8's and these lights were set a little higher and the silvania flourished.
And also with a small tank like this, the lesser amount of light going through due to silvania will not affect the high light carpet plants?
WIll do a large water change today, and restart dosing EI ferts at 5 ml as well as reducing the flow from spacebar slightly, hoping for slightly better results by end of this week or next week.
Have decided will go for silvania natans, I have had this before and i liked it immensely. One thing though, with this tank being such small tank, the lights are only about 2 or 3 inches above the water, will this burn silvania?
Now just gotta find where i can buy it at a reasonable price.
Previously when had silvania in a different larger tank I had T8's and these lights were set a little higher and the silvania flourished.
And also with a small tank like this, the lesser amount of light going through due to silvania will not affect the high light carpet plants?
WIll do a large water change today, and restart dosing EI ferts at 5 ml as well as reducing the flow from spacebar slightly, hoping for slightly better results by end of this week or next week.
OP
OP
Mamashack said:
The LEDs are 3w leds, and there is 6 leds, making this at 18w of light, but bear in mind LED are more intense than normal tube bulbs so the real levels would be measured with PAR, but alas i do not have light par meter and these are particularly expensive to purchase. So I am actually a little unsure just how powerful my lights are.
The lights are on for 6 hours per day, from 2.30pm to 8.30pm.
Is there any way to physically raise the lights?
This might be too far afield for you, but I got my salvinia from MA Binfield (Bracknell) a week or two ago! I've yet to find out whether it can cope directly under the lights.
This might be too far afield for you, but I got my salvinia from MA Binfield (Bracknell) a week or two ago! I've yet to find out whether it can cope directly under the lights.
OP
OP
Update time yet again.
This time, big changes.
First off, i moved the tank to a different corner of the room, i think this position may be better as there is less indirect sunlight reaching this corner.
It's on the stand where the 90litre tank was.
Then I set up the Fire Extinguisher co2 with solenoid, this will give far more reliable dosing at right times and at exact dosing as well.
Also, you may notice the spray bar is at back of tank this time, with powerhead at minim setting, plants swaying a little so hoping the flow is good this time round.
Took out, yet again a shed load of hair algae and a general clean of the tank of algae
So it looks a bit better (from a distance anyway
)
Next stage is to change the dry powder mix a little, ws given some advice by Zik and he has suggested the EI ferts i had made up may be better with a different fert mix and higher daily dosages too.
Have found a decent recommended online ei fert mixer guide calculator. But gotta wait for the measuring spoons as the mix has fairly exact and small quantities needed.
Have ordered these bad boys
http
/www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360639309312?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2648
Not cheap but they have spoons that go down to 1/64 which is good for EI fert mix or dry dosings.
And will just be for the ferts only
(GF take note, this is NOT for COOKING
)
This time, big changes.
First off, i moved the tank to a different corner of the room, i think this position may be better as there is less indirect sunlight reaching this corner.
It's on the stand where the 90litre tank was.
Then I set up the Fire Extinguisher co2 with solenoid, this will give far more reliable dosing at right times and at exact dosing as well.
Also, you may notice the spray bar is at back of tank this time, with powerhead at minim setting, plants swaying a little so hoping the flow is good this time round.
Took out, yet again a shed load of hair algae and a general clean of the tank of algae
So it looks a bit better (from a distance anyway
Next stage is to change the dry powder mix a little, ws given some advice by Zik and he has suggested the EI ferts i had made up may be better with a different fert mix and higher daily dosages too.
Have found a decent recommended online ei fert mixer guide calculator. But gotta wait for the measuring spoons as the mix has fairly exact and small quantities needed.
Have ordered these bad boys
http
/www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360639309312?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2648Not cheap but they have spoons that go down to 1/64 which is good for EI fert mix or dry dosings.
And will just be for the ferts only
(GF take note, this is NOT for COOKING
As an eBay Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
OP
OP
Righto!! Got my measuring spoons today
Looks the job and goes from 2 tsp al the way down to 1/64 tsp! A little pricey but a one off and will last forever!
For those of you who wants to know, my dosing methods for EI ferts according to this site http/blog.fluidsensoronline.com/calculators/estimative-index/
Have decided to go straight dry dosings rather than pre made stock solution.
These have been calculated for 20 litre tank volume, I subtracted 10% for substrate and decor from 22 litres, got a feeling may be more like 18 litres of water as the substrate is quite deep all round, 2.5 to 3 inch. So for now have calculated for 20 litres.
Dry Dose Method :
(Note! You may not need Magnesium Sulphate if you are in a hard water area)
Day 1 50% Water Change and
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 2
1/32 tsp TNC Trace
Day 3
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 4
1/32 tsp TNC Trace
Day 5
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 6
Rest
Day 7
Rest
Main changes being dry dosing, and 2 rest days, whereas before was just one rest day with the stock solution from the original dosing guide that came with the dry powders.
Really hope this will help towards in getting rid of the hair algae, am going to physically remove as much hair algae as i can and may cut plant tops that has hair algae if necessary.
Will also scrub the rocks and wood, they're covered in algae too!
Wish me luck!
Looks the job and goes from 2 tsp al the way down to 1/64 tsp! A little pricey but a one off and will last forever!
For those of you who wants to know, my dosing methods for EI ferts according to this site http
/blog.fluidsensoronline.com/calculators/estimative-index/Have decided to go straight dry dosings rather than pre made stock solution.
These have been calculated for 20 litre tank volume, I subtracted 10% for substrate and decor from 22 litres, got a feeling may be more like 18 litres of water as the substrate is quite deep all round, 2.5 to 3 inch. So for now have calculated for 20 litres.
Dry Dose Method :
(Note! You may not need Magnesium Sulphate if you are in a hard water area)
Day 1 50% Water Change and
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 2
1/32 tsp TNC Trace
Day 3
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 4
1/32 tsp TNC Trace
Day 5
1/16 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
1/32 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2PO4)
1/8 tsp Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4)
Day 6
Rest
Day 7
Rest
Main changes being dry dosing, and 2 rest days, whereas before was just one rest day with the stock solution from the original dosing guide that came with the dry powders.
Really hope this will help towards in getting rid of the hair algae, am going to physically remove as much hair algae as i can and may cut plant tops that has hair algae if necessary.
Will also scrub the rocks and wood, they're covered in algae too!
Wish me luck!
What are your reasons for choosing dry dosing?
As a very rough calculation, I figure you are adding each week, (figures in brackets are EI targets):
Nitrate 42ppm (20)
Potassium 36ppm (30)
Magnesium 10ppm (10)
Phosphate 22ppm (3)
That's based on my observations of 1tsp weighs about 7g for most salts and about 5g for crystalline salts like MgSO4.
Personally I prefer making up solutions as its much easier to weigh the amounts and less chance of overdosing/wastage.
As a very rough calculation, I figure you are adding each week, (figures in brackets are EI targets):
Nitrate 42ppm (20)
Potassium 36ppm (30)
Magnesium 10ppm (10)
Phosphate 22ppm (3)
That's based on my observations of 1tsp weighs about 7g for most salts and about 5g for crystalline salts like MgSO4.
Personally I prefer making up solutions as its much easier to weigh the amounts and less chance of overdosing/wastage.
OP
OP
daizeUK said:
Main reason is I have heard these can give better results than pre made solution, was recommended by 2 other members of this forum who are fairly well known for their plants.
I can say, i did my first dry dosing today, there was a lot more pearling happening with my plants than with the previous pre made solution i made before, so think its seems a good way to go from what I've seen so far.
Time will tell
daizeUK said:
I am not sure how to calculate things like that
Still got a lot to learn, am going by recommended dosages and from that site i posted earlier.
How do you calculate what is the target to aim for?
I'd like to learn this for myself so i have at least an idea if am going in right direction.
Can you tell me who recommended dry dosing? I'm just interested to find out why they think it's better.
I work out concentrations based on molecular weights. I use my own spreadsheet for calculating such things, because I found a lot of conflicting information between different calculators available on the web and I didn't trust a lot of them
So I made my own and I use my own recipe. Call me anal, or a geek or whatever, it makes me happy! Most people will tell you that exact measurements are not necessary and that it's better just to chuck teaspoon measurements in, but when I see figures like 22 ppm phosphate it makes me worried.
The EI targets are not calculated but constants based on Tom Barr's experimental research into the maximum uptake of nutrients in a planted tank.
The problem is that you cannot get enough potassium using EI targets of potassium nitrate and potassium phosphate alone. You have to bump up the amounts of NO3 and PO4 in order to get enough K. That's why I'm a believer in using potassium sulphate. This way you can add enough potassium without overdosing on nitrate and phosphate.
However many people will tell you that it doesn't matter and I've never tried chucking in that much nitrate and phosphate, so who am I to argue
I work out concentrations based on molecular weights. I use my own spreadsheet for calculating such things, because I found a lot of conflicting information between different calculators available on the web and I didn't trust a lot of them
So I made my own and I use my own recipe. Call me anal, or a geek or whatever, it makes me happy! Most people will tell you that exact measurements are not necessary and that it's better just to chuck teaspoon measurements in, but when I see figures like 22 ppm phosphate it makes me worried.The EI targets are not calculated but constants based on Tom Barr's experimental research into the maximum uptake of nutrients in a planted tank.
The problem is that you cannot get enough potassium using EI targets of potassium nitrate and potassium phosphate alone. You have to bump up the amounts of NO3 and PO4 in order to get enough K. That's why I'm a believer in using potassium sulphate. This way you can add enough potassium without overdosing on nitrate and phosphate.
However many people will tell you that it doesn't matter and I've never tried chucking in that much nitrate and phosphate, so who am I to argue
OP
OP
Techen was one of the people who recommended dry dosing, he said that adding dry dosages made his plants grow really well compared to pre made solution, he has tried both methods and found better all round results results with dry dosing.
Spreadsheets for this sort of thing is beyond me tbh at at the moment as i am not of a scientific deposition at all.
And you are absolutely correct that there is a lot of conflicting information on the internet about this and its kind of bewildering, so am trying got keep to known sites and i find it confusing tbh.
its hard to know which ones to trust and which to avoid if you're a newbie like me to high tech tanks and EI dosing.
I must look up Tom Barr's site, i have heard this name mentioned many times on this forum. Thanks Daize.
Spreadsheets for this sort of thing is beyond me tbh at at the moment as i am not of a scientific deposition at all.
And you are absolutely correct that there is a lot of conflicting information on the internet about this and its kind of bewildering, so am trying got keep to known sites and i find it confusing tbh.
its hard to know which ones to trust and which to avoid if you're a newbie like me to high tech tanks and EI dosing.
I must look up Tom Barr's site, i have heard this name mentioned many times on this forum. Thanks Daize.
Tom Barr's site is one of the hardest to understand, for me at least. The man is brilliant but I need a translator to work out what he is trying to say!
I recommend this site instead, http/www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/ei-dosing-using-dry-salts.1211/. The author of that article is a devoted disciple of Tom's although I feel he tends to be very liberal with his teaspoons as well. He's definitely one of the 'just chuck it in and don't worry!' brigade!
Anyway I just thought you might like to know exactly what you are putting in the tank. My preference would be to dose more K-sulphate and less K-nitrate and K-phosphate.
I recommend this site instead, http
/www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/ei-dosing-using-dry-salts.1211/. The author of that article is a devoted disciple of Tom's although I feel he tends to be very liberal with his teaspoons as well. He's definitely one of the 'just chuck it in and don't worry!' brigade! Anyway I just thought you might like to know exactly what you are putting in the tank. My preference would be to dose more K-sulphate and less K-nitrate and K-phosphate.
Altho I'm not doing EI I have been researching it in case I decide to do it in the future.
I've got a premixed version as my first step into adding ferts from Aquarium Plant Food. The guy's name is John and he's been very helpful by email.
They also do EI kits and replacement nutrients separately.
This is the link to his EI kit page: http/www.aquariumplantfood.co.uk/fertilisers/dry-chemicals/starter-kits/ei-starter-kit.html?options=cart
His downloadable EI article is written by Clive Green for UKAPS and available free from APF
I've got a premixed version as my first step into adding ferts from Aquarium Plant Food. The guy's name is John and he's been very helpful by email.
They also do EI kits and replacement nutrients separately.
This is the link to his EI kit page: http
/www.aquariumplantfood.co.uk/fertilisers/dry-chemicals/starter-kits/ei-starter-kit.html?options=cartHis downloadable EI article is written by Clive Green for UKAPS and available free from APF
That's a good kit Mamashack. I've bought ferts from APF and they are very good.
Just one suggestion - check your local pharmacy for magnesium sulphate first. I've found it's not worth buying it online as it's so widely available at local chemists and MUCH cheaper. My pharmacy two minutes walk away had up to 3kg bags of it for just a few quid. You'll tend to burn through it faster than any other salt so it's worth buying a bigger bag.
That article is the same I linked above, Clive is the author - although I did not know his surname was Green
Just one suggestion - check your local pharmacy for magnesium sulphate first. I've found it's not worth buying it online as it's so widely available at local chemists and MUCH cheaper. My pharmacy two minutes walk away had up to 3kg bags of it for just a few quid. You'll tend to burn through it faster than any other salt so it's worth buying a bigger bag.
That article is the same I linked above, Clive is the author - although I did not know his surname was Green
That's worth knowing altho where I'd store a 3kg bag I'm not sure! loldaizeUK said:That's a good kit Mamashack. I've bought ferts from APF and they are very good.
Just one suggestion - check your local pharmacy for magnesium sulphate first. I've found it's not worth buying it online as it's so widely available at local chemists and MUCH cheaper. My pharmacy two minutes walk away had up to 3kg bags of it for just a few quid. You'll tend to burn through it faster than any other salt so it's worth buying a bigger bag.
That article is the same I linked above, Clive is the author - although I did not know his surname was Green
Are all sources of MagSulph powder the same strength? Not being chemistry-inclined I haven't a clue. If you are using Mag Sulph AND KSulph too, is the sulphate part of the equation a problem or will it just smell like sulphur?
I didn't realise his name til I got to the end then discovered it was written for UKAPS and thought I'd mention it since you had.
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