Boneheaded Newbie Mistakes

[trista]

I've done a lot of reading here the last few days and I do know now I should have fishless cycled.... but I didn't, and I've had my tank set up about 1 1/2 months now with fish. I started w/ a few zebra danios (LFS said to get a few of these, let them swim a week and then come back for more fish, so that's what I did).

20 gallon tank with 2 real plants, the rest are fake. Here's what's swimming around:

2 zebra danios
5 neon tetras
3 mickey platys
1 sunburst platy
1 swordtail
1 male betta
1 guppy

Everyone gets a long really well although the betta will nip the guppy if he tries to steal his food.

3 fish died last week (2 zebras, 1 neon), the rest seem healthy.

Once I realized my mistakes I got a test kit (Jungle brand, but I just ordered the ones recommended here .... AFI I think)

Nitrites were testing at least 10 ppm when i first tested. This was probably 2 weeks ago. So I started 20% water changes every other day but was still getting high nitrites after the water changes... levels were getting down to about 5 but not dropping down from there.

Starting yesterday I'm doing 50% water changes twice a day. Nitrates and ammonia are both testing 0.

Tests before and after the 50% WC: Nitrites are 5-10 ppm before, about 2 ppm after.

I think a better test kit will yield more accurate results - my post-change test color is between the 1 and the 3 ppm.

So my questions are, first, any opinions on what I'm doing to resolve my problem? is it underkill, overkill, just right? I realize I'll have to do this for quite sometime. I don't mind doing it, I just feel bad for the fishies I seem to be torturing . And, at what point can I slow down on the WC's? I mean, at what test result can I stop doing twice-per-day WCs, at what test result can I drop back to weekly... ???

Thank you so much for your help

 

[Aphotic Phoenix]

I know it's really frustrating to do multiple water changes per day, but once the cycle is finished you can go down to 25% per week. Finished means Ammonia 0, Nitrites 0, and Nitrates showing up (although the goal is to keep Nitrates as low as possible).

 

[orange shark]

its API btw lol

 

[trista]

its API btw lol

LOL! Well I was close, hehe. That's what I ordered from Ebay -
API Freshwater test kit Master test.

Thanks Phoenix! So I should just continue w/ twice a day water changes till everything is zero then. It's not so bad... just takes a few minutes. It'll be nice when I don't have to do it anymore. I wonder how long it will take.

I'm assuming then, that I only need to change enough to get the levels acceptable.... i.e., I am hoping I won't always be doing 50% each time. Right now I have to though... it's the only way to get it down.

anyone know about water softness? My water is super soft and I'm wondering if that has any factor on cycling. I have a water softener that's probably turned up too high - the water is off the scale on softness.

 

[Lynda B]

You may find that you have a problem keeping your male betta in there. They will snap at anything that has bright colors or long flowing fins. I'd move him to his own little tank (2 gallons or more). I have zebra danios (aren't they fun!) and have 6 of them. I believe they like to be in groups of 6. Your tetras are okay. Not sure what numbers the platies or guppies like to be in, but I thought they liked groups, as well.

Good for you being persistent with your water changes and applying your new-found knowledge so that your fish remain as healthy as possible.

Knowing what you know now, I'm sure you can teach your fish store a thing or two.

 

[Fish2u]

Your tank is a perfect candidate for "Bio-Spira" (Bio-Spira is a cycle aid) effectiveness test ... let me know if you want to spend $17.50 bucks for this experiment and post your results ...

 

[trista]

B)-->QUOTE(Lynda B @ Jul 20 2007, 02:49 PM) [snapback]1699073[/snapback]
You may find that you have a problem keeping your male betta in there. They will snap at anything that has bright colors or long flowing fins. I'd move him to his own little tank (2 gallons or more). I have zebra danios (aren't they fun!) and have 6 of them. I believe they like to be in groups of 6. Your tetras are okay. Not sure what numbers the platies or guppies like to be in, but I thought they liked groups, as well.

Good for you being persistent with your water changes and applying your new-found knowledge so that your fish remain as healthy as possible.

Knowing what you know now, I'm sure you can teach your fish store a thing or two. [/quote]

Well, i started with a group of 5 but 1 died on the way home (didn't return it - 18 mo. old and a 3 year old to tote around, no thanks ) and 2 died last week.... I will replace the group but I can't justify adding fish till I fix the water. They seem to be teaming up w/ the guppy now....

I *hope* the male betta doesn't become a problem, so far he's done very well. The only problem I have seen was with the guppy. He seems not to care about the other fish, really keeps to himself. He's my favorite guy in the tank - just goes about his business. I'll move him if he has trouble tho!

 

[Meds081603]

I'd investigage your water softener a little more. many of them use salt to soften the water. this could potentially be very bad for your fish.

 

[orange shark]

Male bettas have different personalities, some will get along with guppys and fish like that and some wont. Just hope youve got one that will get along with your guppy!

 

[trista]

I'd investigage your water softener a little more. many of them use salt to soften the water. this could potentially be very bad for your fish.

Oh it definitely uses salt to soften - I refill it every month. I hope it's not too bad for them . We can't not use the softener... I can turn it down but not using it is killer on my household. The water here is just so hard. Poo.

 

[trista]

Ok, so after the two 50% WC's yesterday, nitrite was .5 when I went to bed and the same when I got up this morning, so I skipped the morning change. This evening it is still .5, so I didn't change this evening either. I'll change it before I go to bed tonight, regardless, but I'm hoping maybe my tank is making some progress! It's been running for almost 2 months now so it's got to be close to cycled..... right? Also I had been overfeeding - I realized that a day or 2 ago, so I'm sure that helped keep nitrites from rising. Oh and I had some live plants that were dying or dead, took those out yesterday, I'm sure that helped. I just didn't realize they were dead . Maybe I didn't water them enough. (just kidding)

You were right about the Betta. My long-tailed zebra danio was missing a tail this morning . So, big blue is getting evicted to a 2 gallon tank tomorrow. He'll be happier alone anyway, I'm sure.

thanks again for all the help on these forums!

 

[Aphotic Phoenix]

Do you know exactly what kind of live plants they were? It's not uncommon for pet shops to sell plants as aquatics that really aren't aquatic. Could also be the amount of lighting, as some plants need more light than others...or it could even be the salts from the water softener but I don't know how much water softeners affect plants.

 

[trista]

Do you know exactly what kind of live plants they were? It's not uncommon for pet shops to sell plants as aquatics that really aren't aquatic. Could also be the amount of lighting, as some plants need more light than others...or it could even be the salts from the water softener but I don't know how much water softeners affect plants.

All but 2 of my plants were purchased in dried bulb form from WalMart (ugh, sorry). Some came up like long grass, some just long leaves. They came up right away but didn't survive past about 3 inches. Another one was a fern looking plant that died. There is one doing very well, it's a tall plant with big leaves that I bought live at the LPS. I almost never turn on my light.... i like it without it I guess, so i bet that is why they died. I get a lot of natural light in one side of the tank and that's where the big leaf plant is sitting. I never planned to have live plants, but the LPS said it would reduce my nitrites so I bought them..... probably not if they are dying though, I suppose

I can take a picture of my tank in the morning

 

[trista]

I got the betta in his own tank yesterday but not before he went on a killing spree and killed two fish . He's much happier alone now I think. The fish in the main tank are happy too, they can finally go to the forbidden side of the tank . We restocked the tank to replace the ones he killed. It's upsetting ... not much i can do now tho.

Stinkin LPS with their horrible advice and plus 1 fish I bought yesterday was dead by the time we got home. It's petsmart. Guess i need to find a better pet store.

Nitrites are still at 0 from last water change over 24 hours ago so maybe my tank is making good progress