Bloated Betta?

[Plecc]

Hi all,
 
My betta is not looking too well,
his fins, scales etc are all in pristine condition but he has a very swollen abdomen.
He is tending to lay on the substrate and wedge himself against various objects, the swollen belly and lack of buoyency are the only two visible problems.
 
He is over 2 years old.
 
I have a bad feeling its a swim-bladder issue or even worse dropsy. 
 
Any ideas what the problem is?
 
Six weeks ago i started feeding all my tanks a cocktail of frozen food every other day, could this be related?
 
 

 

[Wildbetta]

Are their any other fish in the tank with him?  What is the size of the tank and the temperature?  
 
The new food could have caused the bloating but primarily because he may have been getting too much when you started feeding the frozen.  Do you have a picture?  One that is a good side view and one from directly above the fish would be the best.
 
First thing I recommend even without any answers is to start fasting the betta for at least 3 days to see if the bloating goes down.

 

[Alm0stAwesome]

Maybe he's just had too much to eat, an overly full bell can look pretty scary. 

 

[WILDER]

Have you been over feeding bloodworms?
Don't feed the fish anything but peas.
Epson salt baths help draw the fluids out.

 

[Plecc]

The tanks a 50L running a fluval 205 external, temp is 24-25C only other fish are some bronze cory's and a rly big bamboo shrimp.
 
That was my first conclusion too, he has been fasted for three days.
this is more than just too much food, he is defiantly having buoyancy issues.

 

[WILDER]

Some information for you.
 

Swim Bladder Disorder

 

 

The Swim bladder is a gas-filled sac located inside the fish�s body cavity just above most of the other internal organs. This sac is what gives the fish buoyancy and controls equilibrium. The amount of gas in this sac changes as the fish rises and sinks in the water, enabling it to swim, hover and move in the water. Without the use of the Swim-bladder organ a fish is unable to control it's own movements. 
 


 

Symptoms:

Fish with a swim bladder disorder appear to have an abnormal swimming pattern, usually with their tail end up. They also appear to have difficulty maintaining equilibrium. They may even float upside down or appear to be stuck at the surface of the water, being unable to swim down, or they may lie on the bottom, unable to rise. Fish with a swim bladder disorder will continue to try and feed, showing a normal appetite.
 


 

Cause: 

The most common cause of swim bladder disorders is improper diet. An improper diet can lead to intestinal gas or intestinal blockages. Intestinal blockages can irritate the bowel, giving bacteria or other parasites an entry point where they can then cause damage to the swim bladder. Swim bladder disorders are most common in the larger, deep-bodied varieties of Goldfish. Fish also fed a lot of dried foods, especially pellets, are most susceptible. This condition is frequently observed in the later stages of Malawi Bloat, which is primarily due to an improper diet as well and intestinal irritation.
 


 

Treatment: 

Because this disorder is due principally to an improper diet, a change in their feeding needs to be made. Dried foods with lots of protein should be kept to a minimum. Pellets and other dense foods should be soaked prior to feeding or completely eliminated from their diet. Foods with lots of fiber should be introduced, such as zucchini, squash, spinach, romaine lettuce, peas, and grated carrots. If you suspect that the fish is victim to a bacterial infection, treat the fish with a medicated food.
 
 
Fish Disease Net

 

[livelifelow]

I have a critter that has horrible swim bladder problems (re deep-bodied goldfish).  Personally I've found that when I get to the point that you're at I generally add epsom salts (check to make sure no fragrances, just 100% magnesium sulfate) to the water.  You'll want to start at 1 tsp/10 gal and slowly work up to 3 tsp/10 gal over a couple days (I usually do 1 per, then 2 per the next day, and 3 per the day after that).  If mine is really bad he will take a couple days after we get to 3 per to float properly, but if its just a slight problem he gets there at 1 per.
 
Ideally I catch him early though and starve a day then feed a pea the next day and generally we don't need more salt in the tank.

 

[Plecc]

Thanks so much all,
 
very informative, that's what i needed.
I will try to feed him a pea tonight.
Am I to blanch and skin the pea before feeding?
 
I have a treatment called "Supa tonic salts" that I have used before for brine shrimp.
I think this is pure epsom salt, but there is no ingredients listed, I will try and find out if it's the same stuff.
 
Livelifelow, sorry i'm a bit confused, am I to dose 3 tsp/10 gal every day?
wouldn't this just keep increasing the level of salt in the tank?
 

 

[Wildbetta]

I have found that bettas do not always take to the "pea" method.  I keep frozen daphnia around just for that reason.  It works as a natural laxative and the bettas like it a lot better than peas.  Without a picture it is really hard to tell whether your fish is suffering from just a bout of overeating and constipation or something more concerning like dropsy or a cyst.  Along with fasting/feeding the pea/daphnia, I recommend upping the temperature to at least 82F to help the betta's metabolism if it is indeed something like constipation or bloating.

 

[Plecc]

Here are some pic's sorry there not the greatest,
 
http/s684.photobucket.com/user/DanBrooks83/media/WP_20140326_015.jpg.html
 
http/s684.photobucket.com/user/DanBrooks83/media/WP_20140326_013.jpg.html
 
http/s684.photobucket.com/user/DanBrooks83/media/WP_20140326_006.jpg.html
 
http/s684.photobucket.com/user/DanBrooks83/media/WP_20140326_004.jpg.html
 
I have tried feeding him a cut up pea with no success, so i tried a few grains of his regular food just to see if he would go for it, unfortunately he didn't.
He doesn't appear to have any appetite at all.
It has now been at least a week since he has eaten anything.
I have some daphnia, but its in a tropical quartet pack and i'm not to sure which ones exactly are daphnia.
I can pick some up tomorrow.
 
whats my best move now?

 

[WILDER]

If there been no improvement I would isolate and go in with an internal bacteria medication.
What is your location please?

 

[Wildbetta]

From the pictures he is bloated looking but it doesn't appear to be anything extremely bad which is a good thing.  I would agree with Wilder and go ahead and treat for an internal bacteria issue.  A broad spectrum antibiotic should work just fine for this.  Have you seen him poop at all?  If so what did it look like?  He might be affected by parasites so it would be good to pick up some parasite medication as well in case you need it.

 

[livelifelow]

 
Livelifelow, sorry i'm a bit confused, am I to dose 3 tsp/10 gal every day?
wouldn't this just keep increasing the level of salt in the tank?
 

 
Definitely don't do 3 tsp/10 gal every day as that would increase the salt level beyond what your fish can handle.  You want to have in total 1 tsp/10 gal the first day, 2 tsp/10 gal the second day, and 3 tsp/ gal the third day.  So if you're just adding it as a top-off you'd want to put in 1 tsp/10 gal of tank volume with each top-off for those two days. Or if you're doing daily changes you would want to put in the full amount for that day.  I also make sure to spread the new salted water around throughout the tank so I'm less likely to have heavily salted areas that the fish swim through before it disperses.  That being said, my fish swim through the water as I'm putting it in despite my efforts to avoid them when I'm adding salt and they're doing just fine.

 

[WILDER]

Hows the fish?

 

[Plecc]

Thanks all for the help,
 
My location is East Midlands UK.
 
Two days ago I moved him to a bare 10L aquarium with just an air stone, no filter or heater.
The room maintains temp's in the low 20's (celsius) and I'm doing daily 100% water changes from the original tank.
For med's I am using "Interpet No9 Anti Internal Bacteria"  dosed at 1ml for 10L, In the instructions it says the antibiotics work best with tonic salts, so I am also adding 2g per liter (1g per liter on day 1) of the "Supa Tonic Salts".
I add both to a 1/2L of aquarium water and let it all dissolve before adding it to the freshly changed aquarium water, give it a mix and then put him back in the tank, to continue his treatment.
 
As for poop, I think about a week back he had white stringy feces, but nothing since then. 
 
Thanks livelifelow, I thought that was the case, just had to be sure.
 
He seams a little livelier and appears to be having slightly less buoyancy issues, but has lossed quite a bit of coloration on a small patch between his belly, chin and the bottom of his gill plates.
 
Am I ok to start trying to feed him his old food again?
Its "Ocean Nutrition - Atison's Betta Pro"