Bleheri, Assam And 3 Reed Fish Dead!
- Thread starter dave_oddballs
- Start date
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
i rang up, she said go to reef and river (the lfs) i said they have nothing good enough. she said she will ring me back?!?!?!??!?
David
David
TigerIssey
Queen TI
Do not go anywhere near Reef and River, that shop has the most infected fish around these here parts. If the shop you talk about opening at 2 is UK Aquatics, they are pretty good.
What vets are you using?? I am local to you, I may be able to find something out, I have my vets home email address. She is also a specialist dermatologist in dogs definately, but I am also sure she would be interested enough to look at the problem.
As Wilder said I am Biomed scientist at Royal Preston, it certainly sounds like a very virulent and resistant strain of bacteria. If I was not off work after an accident, we have an environmental section in the lab that would do some cultures for me. If this is not resolved by the time I am back at work, I will take some samples off you to take in and culture. The vets I use may be able to this anyway.
What vets are you using?? I am local to you, I may be able to find something out, I have my vets home email address. She is also a specialist dermatologist in dogs definately, but I am also sure she would be interested enough to look at the problem.
As Wilder said I am Biomed scientist at Royal Preston, it certainly sounds like a very virulent and resistant strain of bacteria. If I was not off work after an accident, we have an environmental section in the lab that would do some cultures for me. If this is not resolved by the time I am back at work, I will take some samples off you to take in and culture. The vets I use may be able to this anyway.
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
it was reef and river i was on about opening at 2. And was bay vetenary group in morecambe who i use, they never rang back anyway!
I think it would be good to look into the disease further as there seems to be no definative cure. Where is uk aquatics by the way?
David
I think it would be good to look into the disease further as there seems to be no definative cure. Where is uk aquatics by the way?
David
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
vets rang me back this morning, told me to ring Liverpool university as apparently they have a specialist of exotic pets, diseases and treatments. they wouldn't let me speak to him, i had to give them my vets number so he can talk to them. so when a mr lance jepson of Liverpool university has spoken to my veterinary surgeon i may receive a phone call. they said they can get hold of almost any medication but they just don't no what they need. they also said it was an unusual disease so almost nowhere would stock a medication for it! the bleheri left is still going strong, changed his water this morning an gave him todays dose of myxazin and pimafix. it has spread a little but seems to be slower than the others, now i don't know if this is because of the treatment or because he is bigger and stronger than the other two and maybe a stronger immune system?
i have also been advised to call a Louise Andrews who is apparently the best fish vet in the country? we will see!!
David
i have also been advised to call a Louise Andrews who is apparently the best fish vet in the country? we will see!!
David
TigerIssey
Queen TI
UK Aquatics is at Thornton, Cleveleys. I mostly use Mcmillans at Ribbleton or go further south. I was warned away from Reef and River when I first moved up here by the company my other half worked for (he used to make fish tanks and stands for the area).
If you get no joy with your vet, I use Dimples Vets in Lancaster, telephone number is 01524 67777.
It is likely to be highly resistant to most antibiotics but I think your vets are just not interested. My vets would have least done a gram stain and noted whether or not it was gram positive or negative bacteria.
I would then have done the cultures myself with advice from the vet as to which antibiotics to test for.
Keep us informed, as I say if you have no joy and are stil getting problems, I may be able to get some cultures done for you. Am off work after industrial injury else would have done it for you straight away.
It will probably be gram neg I would think, it needs looking at though.
You said you had bought nothing new for the tanks earlier in the post didn't you.
What kind of work do you do (this sounds daft but can be a factor)
Has anybody in the family been ill at all or admitted to hospital recently?
Have you been abroad recently or anything else that could shed some light on where it came from.
If you get no joy with your vet, I use Dimples Vets in Lancaster, telephone number is 01524 67777.
It is likely to be highly resistant to most antibiotics but I think your vets are just not interested. My vets would have least done a gram stain and noted whether or not it was gram positive or negative bacteria.
I would then have done the cultures myself with advice from the vet as to which antibiotics to test for.
Keep us informed, as I say if you have no joy and are stil getting problems, I may be able to get some cultures done for you. Am off work after industrial injury else would have done it for you straight away.
It will probably be gram neg I would think, it needs looking at though.
You said you had bought nothing new for the tanks earlier in the post didn't you.
What kind of work do you do (this sounds daft but can be a factor)
Has anybody in the family been ill at all or admitted to hospital recently?
Have you been abroad recently or anything else that could shed some light on where it came from.
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
no i havent added anything to the tank for well over a month, fish, plants or anything! all food fed is frozen and catfish pellets, stats are fine as stated in an earlier post. the vets haven't been too bad, just don't think they are used to dealing with fish. i work as a debt collector so i can't think of anything i bring home that could be cause of contamination! they told me to get hold of that louise andrews so i emailed her and all i got was 'the charge for my consulting service is £23 you can pay by debit card and so on and so on' so she can sod off.
i sometimes go to maidenhead aquatics in thornton cleveleys, is uk aquatics anywhere near there? do they deal with fish and equipment or just one or the other?
how would i get samples to someone? would the fish have to be dead to take samples? because the 2 dead fish are gone and i'm hopeing the last one won't die!
is there no kind of aquatic anti-biotics you can just buy or is it all prescription type stuff?
thanks alot for your help
David
i sometimes go to maidenhead aquatics in thornton cleveleys, is uk aquatics anywhere near there? do they deal with fish and equipment or just one or the other?
how would i get samples to someone? would the fish have to be dead to take samples? because the 2 dead fish are gone and i'm hopeing the last one won't die!
is there no kind of aquatic anti-biotics you can just buy or is it all prescription type stuff?
thanks alot for your help
David
saz326
Fish Herder
Im wondering if there is any topical preparation that you could buy from the local pharmacy. It would be trial and error in that no-one would know the dosage, but creams could be an option. I once had "bactroban" for a cut that simply kept going nasty. It was like a vasaline type preparation that was waterproof and so could possibly be used on a fish. I only know basics of meds (work in the phys props lab at a medical manufacturers) but I cant see any harm in trying.
So the infection started on the top fin, then progressed down to the body and then mainly around the abdomen...
The bit I dont get is why it would initially start so far up the body and not be present on the other fins.
Once the disease/bacteria is known it may well be worth looking at how the bacteria got into the poor monsters. They all seem to have had the illness progress through them in the same way. Im wondering if there could have been a simple route of infection that we simply havent thought about.
How is the skin on the top fin dirrerent to the skin on the other fins of these fish. Could the bacteria be something that is carried by one of the possible bully fish?
Man, this is a nasty bug.
So the infection started on the top fin, then progressed down to the body and then mainly around the abdomen...
The bit I dont get is why it would initially start so far up the body and not be present on the other fins.
Once the disease/bacteria is known it may well be worth looking at how the bacteria got into the poor monsters. They all seem to have had the illness progress through them in the same way. Im wondering if there could have been a simple route of infection that we simply havent thought about.
How is the skin on the top fin dirrerent to the skin on the other fins of these fish. Could the bacteria be something that is carried by one of the possible bully fish?
Man, this is a nasty bug.
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
i don't no what you mean by bully fish? these fish never got bullied by anything, there was the 2 bleheri that got on fine and the Assam that just followed them about. they never got chased, nipped or bullied by any of the other fish.
i don't see how the dorsal fin is any different to the other fins. on the Assam it started as a patch on its abdomen, on the 2 bleheris it started in the dorsal fin, but i assume it is the same disease that killed the reed fish, and that was really sudden, went from perfect to dead in 20 hours, seemed to attack there gills though, it paralyzed one side of their head and fin and just looked as though there heads were just falling apart! the medication i am using seems to have slowed down the progression of the disease on my last bleheri but has in no way stopped it. i personally think it will take some serious medication to save this fella, but i will do all i can.
someone said to me yesterday i was stupid because I've spent well more on medication already than the fish cost me, but its not about that at all!
i want my fish to live whatever the cost and whatever it takes! i already feel guilty for the deaths of the others but i really can't think of anything i have done wrong and am constantly checking and thinking of causes and what might of gone wrong. i really don't know, it would be great to find a medication and save my fish but in reality i need to know what caused it and it seems like an endless task even trying to think of what it could be!
David
i don't see how the dorsal fin is any different to the other fins. on the Assam it started as a patch on its abdomen, on the 2 bleheris it started in the dorsal fin, but i assume it is the same disease that killed the reed fish, and that was really sudden, went from perfect to dead in 20 hours, seemed to attack there gills though, it paralyzed one side of their head and fin and just looked as though there heads were just falling apart! the medication i am using seems to have slowed down the progression of the disease on my last bleheri but has in no way stopped it. i personally think it will take some serious medication to save this fella, but i will do all i can.
someone said to me yesterday i was stupid because I've spent well more on medication already than the fish cost me, but its not about that at all!
i want my fish to live whatever the cost and whatever it takes! i already feel guilty for the deaths of the others but i really can't think of anything i have done wrong and am constantly checking and thinking of causes and what might of gone wrong. i really don't know, it would be great to find a medication and save my fish but in reality i need to know what caused it and it seems like an endless task even trying to think of what it could be!
David
Saddleback columnaris starts I think at the dorsal fin and goes along the body to form a saddle shape.
There a jbl med but most lfs don't stock ektol.
Scroll down to ektol.
[URL="http
/www.jbl.de/dl_documents/uk/uk_WWW4.pdf"]http/www.jbl.de/dl_documents/uk/uk_WWW4.pdf[/URL]
There a jbl med but most lfs don't stock ektol.
Scroll down to ektol.
[URL="http
/www.jbl.de/dl_documents/uk/uk_WWW4.pdf"]http/www.jbl.de/dl_documents/uk/uk_WWW4.pdf[/URL]
TigerIssey
Queen TI
Do me a favour, if you still have a body frozen or you get another, freeze it. Bacteria can be frozen for a few months + and still be viable for culture. I will try and get hold of some swabs (need to be transport swabs with media in the bottom that bacteria feed on in transport) from someone at work. If I get hold of these I can post them to you and give you instructions on how to swab the fish or if any are alive you can swab them. I may be able to get a friend at work to culture them for me.
When you do your job do you go into peoples houses at all?? Has anyone you have seen recently had any type of wound or been in hospital?? I am just trying to cover all angles here as this sounds far too virulent to be a normal fish bacterial infection. There may have been a small area on one of the fish that allowed the bacteria in but may have spread from there to other fish.
Unfortunately this sounds like it will not clear up with an over the counter medicine, problem is your vets have not offered anything other than a referral that will cost. I will also email my vet if you would like me to, she may do a gram stain for you and may be a little more helpfull especially if I have emailed her first. If we know whether it is gram positive or gram negative, we may be able to advise on an antibiotic you could use as an antibiotic bath or in tank treatment. Some are likely to be ones you may have left over from treatment courses that you SHOULD have finished but I know alot of people do not take the full course of antibiotics prescribed.
UK Aquatics is not that far from maidenhead but you turn off towards Thornton before going that far towards fleetwood. The address is
UK Aquatics
Unit 2, Crofts Court
Butts Close
Thornton
Lancs
FY5 4HT
01253 866011
Opening Times:
Weekdays: 2pm - 8pm
Weekends: 10am - 5pm
They sell both fish and equipment.
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
the bleheri is dead now. What should i do with it? Save it for someone to test or send it to be with his friends at the sewerage plant?
David
David
OP
OP
dave_oddballs
ray and oddball keeper !!
nope never heard off the vets, was out all day yesterday so mabe they did ring but no message, never mind. Would just feel a bit better if i could find out exactly what it war, at least then i could treat the water to give me peace of mind that nothing dangerous is left in the water!
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