Better Late Than Never

[Blue Guppy]

Hi all,

first just want to say thanks for all the people that have taken the time to post their experience's, solutions and do's and don'ts.

Like many I found this forum and others to late... though no doubt I will not be the last..

I bought a Biorb 30l Flow with a heater 2 weeks ago (Yes I know).

Had it running as per Biorbs instructions for 10 days, then took a sample of water to my LFS yesterday for them to test...
"Great" they said no problems here.....

So I then went for their advice on what I could put in.
I wanted Guppies,

So They said it would be fine to start with 2 Male guppies and..... 6 Cardinal Tetras.. then in 2 weeks or so another 2 male Guppies..


Great I thought, of I popped pleased as punch and put the fish in the tank, not straight in obviously..

Then started searching the web about what I had just bought..

Then found this forum and started to worry... allot

So went out first thing this morning and bought an API Master test kit.....

Came home and did the tests twice just to make sure...

The results were

pH 7.6
Ammonia close to .50ppm
Nitrite 0 ppm
Nitrate 40 ppm

So I took 30% of the water out and replaced it with fresh treated water to roughly the same temp, left it for a few hours and retested..

All was about the same except the Ammonia which had dropped to 0.25 ppm.
I will test again everyday for the next few weeks

So the questions are..

If tomorrow the ammonia is the same level shall I change 20 - 30 % of the water or wait a couple of days

Should I take the Cardinals back to the LFS

Would having another 2 male guppies be to many fish for the tank if I keep the cardinals..

Thanks,

Mike

 

[onidrase]

You want to keep your ammonia as close to 0 as possible with your fish in cycle. .25 is still pretty high, do another water change.

You'll need to do water changes every day until the tank is cycled. Or if it's not to late to bring the fish back, there are plenty of guides on fishless cycling which is a better option.

The water tested "great" because there were no fish or anything. tap water is safe for fish as soon as you dechlorinate it. Running the filter for a week on a new tank and having it safe for fish afterwords is just an old school myth which I fell into myself. The fish survived, but I guess I was just lucky.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Agree with everything above.


If I were you, I would just be prepared for a LOT of water changes and LARGE ones. For me, I would aim to bring my ammonia down to 0.05ppm or as close as possible. That means that if your ammonia was at 0.50ppm, you will need to do a 90% water change to lower to that level. There will still be plenty available for your bacteria to survive on and even multiply. The common misperception of "shouldn't I leave some behind so that my bacteria don't starve" is just a case of not truly understanding the process. Ammonia is being produced on an almost constant basis by the fish and put into the water through their GILLS. So, even if you removed ALL of the ammonia (which you can't do by water changes) in a few minutes there would again be ammonia present for the bacteria to feed on.

Second, refill with temp-matched dechlorinated water.

Then, to reduce the amount of ammonia produced by the fish, limit the amount of food you are feeding. The fish will also produce more ammonia when stressed, which ironically can be caused by excess ammonia in the water. By keeping the ammonia levels as low as possible will actually help to limit the amount that they can produce and limit your need for water changes. Even with all that though, you are going to need to do daily water changes for a while.



Finally the stocking level - That tank would be able to sustain no more than 4 guppies. You are actually overstocked already, in my opinion. I'd say no more than that, especially during a cycle. I'd return the cardinals now, and then leave it with just the guppies until you go a full week without needing to do a water change. Then, you can get two more guppies, but expect a few blips of ammonia or nitrite for a few days afterward. If you limit your feeding after adding the extra guppies, you may not get a spike.

 

[Aqua Tom]

You need to change that water asap. Its only a 30 litre tank so a 90% dailey water change is very doable.

Tom

 

[Blue Guppy]

Thanks for the replies..

Have just given it another water change, probably about 80%.

Will check levels before I go to bed and do another change in the morning

Thanks again



Just to add.

The fish are now a lot more active..
Which I hope is good..

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Have you ever had ammonia in your lungs? If you had, you'd know why the fish would be more lethargic. It burns like nothing else I've experienced. More active fish is always a good sign! Keep up with the WC. Don't lose patience though. This can take months before you are fully cycled (means you have a week before you need to go for a water change).

 

[Blue Guppy]

Just tested again..
and I am strugerling to see any green tinge.

but will do another change in the morning

 

[eaglesaquarium]

If you see the tinge now, you will see it more in the morning. A change will be needed. (Please look into returning your cardinals. There is too much bioload on that little tank.)

 

[Blue Guppy]

Just an update,

Have moved 2 cardinals to a mates tank which is well established, so that leaves 4, and I won't get a chance to take them back till Saturday.

Did a 90% water change this morning and will do another a little later.

I will continue to do two a day until it settles.

Is it worth adding a bit of stress zyme whilst I continue to do the water changes (not to replace water changes) ?

Thanks,

 

[betta989]

I recomend doing 2 every week. Say all the guppies you got had ich from the store, and you got 4 over a two day span not suspecting anything. Next morning all 4 are dead due to ich, 2 every week: If 2 of your fish have ich then 2 will die. then you get more the next week, last weeks stock of fish to the store is gone and you get healthy fish.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

No stress zyme really won't do anything to help your cycle process, it will only lighten your wallet. You'd be better of spending that money on some equipment to make water changes easier. In the long run, that will more than make up for the expense. For example, I use a hose and an adapter to attach it to my sink to refill my tank. It saves me a lot of time and bucket lugging. It makes a large water change far more appealing, and therefore I complete 50-75% water changes monthly.



If your friend can take the rest of the cardinals, you should move them on as well. They really do best in large shoals, 9 or more. Unless your friend is fully stocked it would be better for them all to be together. If he doesn't already have a big shoal of cardinals the two will probably spend the vast majority of the time hiding.

 

[Blue Guppy]

I recomend doing 2 every week. Say all the guppies you got had ich from the store, and you got 4 over a two day span not suspecting anything. Next morning all 4 are dead due to ich, 2 every week: If 2 of your fish have ich then 2 will die. then you get more the next week, last weeks stock of fish to the store is gone and you get healthy fish.

??

Sorry you lost me..

 

[Blue Guppy]

No stress zyme really won't do anything to help your cycle process, it will only lighten your wallet. You'd be better of spending that money on some equipment to make water changes easier. In the long run, that will more than make up for the expense. For example, I use a hose and an adapter to attach it to my sink to refill my tank. It saves me a lot of time and bucket lugging. It makes a large water change far more appealing, and therefore I complete 50-75% water changes monthly.



If your friend can take the rest of the cardinals, you should move them on as well. They really do best in large shoals, 9 or more. Unless your friend is fully stocked it would be better for them all to be together. If he doesn't already have a big shoal of cardinals the two will probably spend the vast majority of the time hiding.

I did try to convince him to take them all, but he has already got 6, and says he would be overstocked.. (more of a work colleage than friend)

Wasn't going to use it to help the cycle more to take the stress away from the fish..

Thanks

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Ok... you mean Stress COAT+, they are different products made by the same company. Stress COAT+ is a good dechlorinator. It deals with metals, it deals with ammonia and turns it into the less toxic ammonium. Stress Coat+ is my second favorite dechlorinator, after Prime. Prime also deals with nitrite and it is super concentrated. I use Stress Coat. If I were you I would just use the dechlorinator at 1.5X recommended dose when completing the water changes, that would be sufficient for them to have the effect from the aloe. If you use Stress Coat+ when completing a water change, you wouldn't need to use any other dechlorinator. So, yes, use Stress COAT, but don't use your other dechlorinator.


You could add a bit of Stress Coat in between water changes if you only see a tinge of green rather than completing a water change immediately. BUT, I would only recommend that if the ammonia is only slightly green, not anywhere near 0.25ppm. This will help slightly as naturally, ammonia converts to ammonium when the pH is below 7.0. (The lower it is, the more of it converts.) But, since your pH is over that, that isn't happening.

 

[Blue Guppy]

Just a quick update..

Cardinals have gone back , but it's for the best.
So just 2 Guppies.

Have been doing 90% water changes everyday, and will continue until the water is good and clear.

Then add another Guppy and test agian, and when clear will add my final guppy.

Thanks for the help.