Ask Questions About Cycling

[Seandgoode]

Hi, new member here so forgive me if I have missed something. I have had a good read of cycling guide here about 10 times. At what frequency should I test the pH of the water whilst cycling? And anything I should keep an eye out for?

 

[eaglesaquarium]

weekly would be plenty often, and you are looking for a drop in pH, as it indicates that you've exceeded the buffering capacity and the bacteria no longer have access to the necessary carbon they require.

 

[Seandgoode]

Thanks, will keep checking weekly as suggested.

 

[TallTree01]

Not entirely sure if this is the right place to ask this, but has anyone found the iron in searches flourish to give false ammonia readings of about 0.25-0.5?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Find any general site that even warns one about what can mess up ammonia test kit readings.
 
Find any hobby test kit maker who warns on any of their test kits what might cause false or inaccurate results.
 
Then bear this in mind:

 
Interferences
Interfering substance Interference level

Calcium 1000 mg/L as CaCO3

Iron All levels. Correct for iron interference as follows:
1. Use one of the Iron, Total procedures to measure the iron concentration of the sample.
2. Use an iron standard solution to add iron to the deionized water blank so that the blank has the same iron concentration as the sample. The iron interference will be zeroed out from the test result.

Magnesium 6000 mg/L as CaCO3
 
Monochloramine Monochloramine that is in chloraminated drinking water interferes directly at all levels and gives high results. Use a Free Ammonia and Monochloramine method to determine free ammonia in these sample matrices.

Nitrate 100 mg/L as NO3––N

Nitrite 12 mg/L as NO2––N

pH Adjust acidic or basic samples to approximately pH 7. Use 1 N sodium hydroxide standard solution for acidic samples and 1 N hydrochloric acid standard solution for basic samples.

Phosphate 100 mg/L as PO43––P

Sulfate 300 mg/L as SO42–

Sulfide Sulfide will intensify the color. Remove sulfide interference as follows:
1. Measure approximately 350 mL of sample in a 500-mL Erlenmeyer flask.
2. Add the contents of one Sulfide Inhibitor Reagent Powder Pillow. Swirl to mix.
3. Filter the sample through a folded filter paper and filter funnel.
4. Use the filtered sample in the test procedure.

Other Substances Less common interferences such as hydrazine and glycine cause intensified colors in the prepared
sample. Turbidity and color will give incorrect high values. Samples with severe interferences

from http/www.hach.com/asset-get.download.jsa?id=7639983745

 

[Seandgoode]

Just a thought, will adding liquid carbon effect cycling my tank in any way? I haven't used any yet but I'm guessing I will have to add some form of carbon with 3 plants.

 

[KieranBoyne]

No. I don't think it would make any difference. Best to wait until eagles posts though

 

[daizeUK]

I don't think liquid carbon affects cycling either.  I'm not entirely sure though; glutaraldehyde is a disinfectant if I understand correctly so it may have an inhibitory effect on bacteria when they're trying to get established.
 
If you have easy plants and a lightly planted tank then chances are they'll be just fine without the LC.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Just a thought, will adding liquid carbon effect cycling my tank in any way? I haven't used any yet but I'm guessing I will have to add some form of carbon with 3 plants.

 
 
It depends on the plants...  Some plants are slow growers and require very little to be content to grow (albeit slowly).  Other require high light.  High light plants generally require carbon additions.
 
 
There's two schools of thought for cycling and plants (well, probably three or more, but I'm going to limit it to two):
 
School 1 - Cycle the tank before you add plants... so few plants would change much in terms of how the cycle takes place, so the easiest thing to do would be just to wait on the addition of plants and add them at the end of the cycle.
 
School 2 - Add plants at the beginning of the cycle.  This can end up changing everything.  There are a lot of variables to be considered in this and more information is required.  3 plants won't be enough to 'cycle' the tank by themselves (most plants can use ammonium in the tank, rather than nitrate, if the ammonium is available).  But, adding 3ppm ammonia could potentially harm the plants as that ammonia won't be used or processed by the bacteria very quickly.  So, if you absolutely have to cycle with the plants, I'd drop the dose of ammonia to only 1 ppm and test daily to see what happens to the ammonia.  Does the ammonia get used by the plants - and therefore you don't see nitrite building up?  Or does the ammonia get converted to nitrite by the bacteria?  More than likely you'd have a very slow process of the initial ammonia dose dropping to zero (or at least under 0.25ppm)... once it does you'd want to up the ammonia back to 1ppm and wait again, looking for nitrite.  If nitrite never shows up, then the plants are using the ammonia (more than likely won't be the case with just three plants).  The slow build up of nitrite will be evidence that you are growing a bacteria colony.  Not until you get both to be double zeros would it be safe for fish... and with such a low dose of ammonia, you'd want to stock the tank very slowly.
 
 
 
As to the actual question being asked... I have not heard of glutaraldehyde affecting the cycle either pro or con.  I do know that it doesn't have an appreciable effect on the bacteria colony (when used in proper doses) once it is established, but as Daize points out, it might affect the bacteria as they try to establish their colony.

 

[Seandgoode]

Thanks. I think I'll wait till it's cycled in that case.

 

[KieranBoyne]

It's your choice, but I would just go for it because surely it would state on the bottle that I was not fit for use when the aquarium is cycling... Right??

 

[TwoTankAmin]

With just three plants I would not drop the ammonia below 2 ppm to cycle and might consider just doing the normal fishless cycle at 3 ppm especially if you plan to stock fully when done.
 
As for nitrite showing up in a tank that has plants in it during the cycle, one can not always assume no nitrite means the plants are handling the ammonia. Folks forget that plants arrive with some amount of nitrifying bacteria on them. This includes the ones the process nitrite. The biggest clue that the plants are not handling all the ammonia is that it doesn't reach 0 in 24 hours or less. It is the absence of nitrite (or only very low level readings) that complicates things when cycling with plants because the guidelines for fishless cycling without plants wont work.
 
The problem I have with cycling and then planting is that the plants need a few weeks to establish in a tank and attach to things or root in the substrate. Here are steps # 6 and 7 of 8 in the Tropica  article on Growing in Plants:
 

 
6) Introduce algae-eating snails and shrimps as soon as possible after start-up.
 
7) We recommend that the introduction of fish is delayed for 3-4 weeks until the plants have established. In other respects, follow the fish stocking guidelines for new aquariums.

from http/www.tropica.com/en/tropica-abc/start-up/growing-in.aspx

 

[Seandgoode]

Thanks once again for the quick responses and the info. I have the plants in the tank already and dosed to 3ppm of ammonia before I asked so I think as two tank says I will just try to cycle as normal. 
 
 
Today I tested the water (day 5) and ammonia looks the same maybe slightly less, hard to tell with the API tests, and also showing some Nitrites.

 

[Ciddire]

Thanks once again for the quick responses and the info. I have the plants in the tank already and dosed to 3ppm of ammonia before I asked so I think as two tank says I will just try to cycle as normal. 
 
 
Today I tested the water (day 5) and ammonia looks the same maybe slightly less, hard to tell with the API tests, and also showing some Nitrites.

I did the same thing and I just finished my cycle early this week. I'm going to follow the guide about the snack doses before stocking the tank.
 
Most of the plants survived the ordeal and are thriving as we speak. I ended up losing 2 swords & a crypt. They were in poor condition to begin with so it comes as no surprise.
 
I didn't start seeing true results until after my ammonia & nitrite peak, after that occurred the tank rapidly cycled.
 
Best of luck with your cycle journey!

 

[KieranBoyne]

I hope everything goes well for you!!