Are Pethia Gelius and Pethia Gelius Dwarf two different types of fish?

[otterblue]

Are Pethia Gelius and Pethia Gelius Dwarf two different types of fish?

I've seen them under a lot of common names with the above scientific names: Golden Dwarf Barb, Gold Clown Barb, Gold Barb, etc.

Thank you for any help.

 

[Byron]

There is one distinct species, Pethia gelius. If there is one or more varieties that have been selectively bred, I do not know, but these would not be distinct species. Many of our common aquarium fish have numerous varieties of one distinct species. The gourami Trichopodus trichopterus for example has I don't know how many varieties such as the blue, gold, cosby, 3-spot, marble, and opaline, but these are all the same distinct species and thus share all of the distinct biological features that make them this species.

Common names should frankly not be relied upon since it is only adding confusion because the common name really only means what it means to the individual using it, not necessarily anyone else.

Pethia gelius has gone through some reclassification since it was first described as Cyprinus gelius by Hamilton in 1822 in this publication:

Text - An account of the fishes found in the river Ganges and its branches - Biodiversity Heritage Library

The Biodiversity Heritage Library works collaboratively to make biodiversity literature openly available to the world as part of a global biodiversity community.

www.biodiversitylibrary.org

It was moved into the genus Puntius by Rahman in 1989, where it remained until Pethiyagoda et al (2012) placed it in Pethia in their synopsis of the species then considered in Puntius.

http://www.pfeil-verlag.de/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/ief23_1_12.pdf

Subsequent studies have accepted this taxonomy without question.

 

[GaryE]

Here is the problem: the importing and farming side of the hobby invents most English names for fish, and they often shy away from diversity. A strange problem has grown in our hobby - a lack of curiosity. Where years ago, hobbyists would seek out new species (and the industry would invent several names for some species), now, if the name isn't familiar the fish isn't ordered. The old multiple marketing names still linger on: "Golden Dwarf Barb, Gold Clown Barb, Gold Barb, etc" as you noted are from the curiosity era. But now, people don't seem to buy diversity as much.

Now, for a fish like Pethia gelius, there can be two or three distinct biological species being sold even under the one Latin name. All Pethia become gelius to the trade, and sales stumble along. That means you and I have to dig a bit, and make certain of what we have, if we care. "Dwarf" is a relative term.

You should be able to trust the Latin name, but it pays to do a little (not easy) research. mThe most famous mess up in the hobby is the common kribensis, which isn't a kribensis. Someone screwed up decades ago and thought Pelvicachromis pulcher was P. kribensis, and now the 'real' krib is uncommon, even though it's a far nicer fish.

So Pethia gelius should be (and is, scientifically) one fish, but commercially? Dwarf is probably for sales purposes. The answer is "should be, maybe."

 

[otterblue]

Great information from both of you, thank you. The Latin name on the order matches the fish I intended to buy.

I was initially concerned for two reasons:

1. The common name from the seller was "Gold Clown Barb" - which is a different species. I didn't notice the common name until I saw the invoice.

2. The fish I received are already at maximum length, leading me to believe the addition of "Dwarf" on some sites indicated a variant. My site didn't indicate "Dwarf". They are also wild caught. (Perhaps they are full size due to being wild caught; I'm used to receiving sub-adults from breeders.)

Purchased from "The Wet Spot" in Portland. I've been very happy with them in the past.

 

[GaryE]

The "Wet Spot" is astonishing, when you look at their lists. I know a Canadian trucker who used to take routes to the US west coast so she could stop in there on the way back. She lives in Quebec, on the eastern side of the continent. If you ever go there and see an 18 wheeler with Quebec plates in the parking lot, you'll know she's gone back into the trucking business.

They have a reputation for accuracy in species identification.

 

[otterblue]

CORRECTION: "Wild caught" IS indicated on their website. That was my oversight.