Anyone Here To Help Me With Conflicting Advice?

[HayzH]

again....PETS AT HOME.
I set the tank up, added the dechlorinated water into my 24inx12in tank.(2ft)
added decoration, they told me to leave the tank for 5-7days..i went back 5 days later, they tested the water and told me it was fine to add fish, so i bought 3x mollies.
floated the bag for 15m....opened the bag added some of the tank water..floated it for 15m more.Then put them in the tank (with net)
they looked fab.
Next day i noticed them at the top of the tank gasping at the bubbles..was told it could be O2..
Day 2 .... 2 of the mollies died.
Day 3 .... the 3rd Mollie died.

I spoke to PAH and they said they would replace any lost fish.

AT NO POINT did they tell me to change the water to stop them dying of Ammonia poisioning. (levels were 0.5)

So i went to another LFS (Maidenhead Aquatics), they told me to do a 50% water change and wait a few more days to test the Ammonia levels had DROPPED to 0. I asked if the fish had already cycled it then....as the Nitrites and nitrates were both 0. They said yes they probably had.

So i did the water change.

I took another sample in a yesterday and the Ammonia was still 0.25. Too much for fish (they said) they told me to do another 10% water change and wait a few more days and that should bring it down to 0.

Meanwhile..a good friend i have (who keeps fish) said the tank needed Ammonia for the cycle to proceed..otherwise it just pauses.

She said it could be a few more WEEKS yet.. as my son knows we had fish in there he wants them back in there. (we told him they were fighting and we had to take them back to the shop)

I have just tested the water today and the Ammonia is now 0.50 (again) and the Nitrites and nitrates are both 0!!!!!!!

i would hasten to say...it hasnt cycled..why are the shops saying it has?

I am 2 weeks into this now..if i had known to do the fishless cycle back then it would be virtually done now!!! I'm seething!!!

I have Ordered some kleen off (ammonia) online which should arrive tomorrow...how much do i add? i think its about 70L ? (2ft tank)


who do i listen to??? my friend.....or the 2x LFS' My hubby says the shops know what they are talking about??

thanks in advance xx

 

[Caprichoso]

Welcome to the forum, sorry you got some really bad advice. You have an un-cycled tank which means that your fish are creating waste that cannot be broken down by beneficial bacteria, hence the ammonia spike which in any amount is toxic to fish. Water change 75% until ammonia is at 0. Could take 3 or 4 water changes to get to 0. Test your water daily as it's going to take some time to complete a fish-in cycle. If you can find the product, Seachem Stability, use it, otherwise, just continue doing large water changes to keep the ammonia at bay until the bacteria in your filter can establish itself. Don't add anymore fish and don't over feed them. Go to the beginners section on the forum and read up on fish-in cycling.

Good luck

 

[walkers101]

At no point have you mentioned that you have a filter

if you have a filter as your friend to give you some media out of her established filter (a few sponges etc) which will speed up the process

if you dont have a filter get one asap then ask your friend for media

 

[HayzH]

Welcome to the forum, sorry you got some really bad advice. You have an un-cycled tank which means that your fish are creating waste that cannot be broken down by beneficial bacteria, hence the ammonia spike which in any amount is toxic to fish. Water change 75% until ammonia is at 0. Could take 3 or 4 water changes to get to 0. Test your water daily as it's going to take some time to complete a fish-in cycle. If you can find the product, Seachem Stability, use it, otherwise, just continue doing large water changes to keep the ammonia at bay until the bacteria in your filter can establish itself. Don't add anymore fish and don't over feed them. Go to the beginners section on the forum and read up on fish-in cycling.

Good luck

all of the fish died.....so i have no fish now...the ammonia has risen from 0.25 to 0.5 since yesterday?? the fish died on thursday (4 days ago)

At no point have you mentioned that you have a filter

if you have a filter as your friend to give you some media out of her established filter (a few sponges etc) which will speed up the process

if you dont have a filter get one asap then ask your friend for media

yes i have a fluval U2 internal filter...my friend is an online friend...so nowhere near me.

 

[walkers101]

ok read up on a fishless cycle there is a section on here somewhere

 

[HayzH]

so it hasnt cycled then? I've heard fish food will up the Ammonia levels can i add some?

 

[Caprichoso]

No it's not cycled. Go to the beginner section and you will find a wealth of info there to help you be successful.

 

[walkers101]

yes it will eventually but most people on here find dosing with pure ammonia gives better results

it taks at least a month to cycle

 

[HayzH]

thanks to both of you...
i have read the fishless cycle and calculated the amount of Ammonia i need for my 71L tank. will fish food help?

 

[fluttermoth]

If you've ordered the ammonia, you might as well wait for that; fish food is great for those people who can't get pure ammonia, but the ammonia route is easier to work out; the amount of ammonia produced by rotting down fish food can be very variable.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, agree with the others and you can listen to fluttermoth, he's an expert. It is nice to have a tiny pinch of flake food to complicate the traces available but all the real fishless cycling should be done with the household ammonia so that you have control over the concentrations and can understand the results.

It is far more important and valuable to learn all about cycling and biofilters than it is to simply get your tank cycled for the first time. The knowledge will stay with you throughout your time in the hobby and will make a huge difference in your ability to keep healthy fish. (It is indeed very tough getting through a fishless cycle with young children but believe me, it is much worse trying to explain why new pets have died. It can be fun drawing diagrams of the nitrogen cycle with children and outsized cartoons of "bacteria.")

It takes a leap of faith to start doing these crazy things like putting ammonia in an empty tank and taking measurements week after week with no fish, but many of us have come through it and it is quite a wonderful feeling once you have proved it to yourself, gained the real hands-on understanding and are finally able to feel confident in giving fish a fundamentally healthy home to live in.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[moochy13]

your friend was for closer to the truth than the shops, make sure you tell hubby he was wrong

shops want your money ASAP, if they can tell you to buy fish the same week you get a tank, they get more money. very few LFS are trustworthy, even the shops like MA ive seen lots of complaints about. you're best off doing your own research, and asking the forum, as we dont want your money can can give unbiased, correct advice.

 

[-FighterFishh]

Everyone's pretty much covered everything, but if you couldn't find a page on cycling, here's one.
Also, I think 71L of ammonia is a bit much in one go! I've never done a cycle this way, so I'm not really sure, but if you find a cycling thread on here it should help you understand how much to dose into the tank each time.

 

[HayzH]

Everyone's pretty much covered everything, but if you couldn't find a page on cycling, here's one.
Also, I think 71L of ammonia is a bit much in one go! I've never done a cycle this way, so I'm not really sure, but if you find a cycling thread on here it should help you understand how much to dose into the tank each time.

i meant the tank is 71L i'm still awaiting my delivery of ammonia....i did another test this morning and its still on 0.25 (amm) 0 (nitrite) and 0 (nitrate)

getting fed up now...wanted this for so long

 

[The Taffy Apple]

Good morning HayzH.. you are going through EXACTLY what i did, same store, same advice, even down to the same fish !

I bit the bullet and done a complete fishless cycle with household ammonia (check that it is pure ammonia, no additives). Although the temptation to get some great looking fish in there is high at the moment (even more-so with your little 'un ) it probably would be in your best interest to carry out a fishless cycle.

Hopefully by now you've had a little read in the beginners section and will be aware of the use of mature media in an un-cycled tank, so would your friend be in a position to help out with media donation? This is what i was fortunate enough to do with my 120L tank..it completely cycled my external filter in 3 weeks, including a qualifying week.

Best of luck with it all, well done on finding and using this forum!

Terry.