Angelfish Red Gills?!

[tj3stanv]

this is my aquarium status.

I had afully established, stable 35g hexagon aquarium that i kept for 5 years,however, last month i had to restart all over again because the floors in our house needed to be fixed so i completely drained all the water. my 3 yr old angelfish also died during the process. n e ways, now i started from scratch.

i set up the tank about 5 days ago, added the water 5 days ago with running undergravel filter and a powerhead filter. i let it sit withouth n e fishes for 2 days. the 3rd day, i added 6 angelfishes, 2 plecos and a female betta. so everyone was doing well on the 4th day except for the fact that one of the angels are a "loner" and not really following the school. And i also noticed the reddish gills of 2 of the angels. i researched it and i found out that it was only a species of angels called "The blushing angelfish" but i was skeptic, so i assumed that its red because they have a translucent gill. however, today i noticed that their gills are much redder than yesterdays. one of the ones with red gills has frayed fins but acting pretty normal. the other is not doing well, it appears like its stationary, and its mouth is open and his gills looks like its bleeding internally. the shaft of the left flippers are also red. Hes not actively swimming and looks like hes having a hard time mving.

I put Seachem STABILITy eveyrday and also Seachem Prime which suppose to remove clorine clorahmine, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. i also add a Ph stabilizer so it can go up to a 7.

I did some water test, the results are the FF.
Ph : about 7.5-7.8
Ammonia: .25 PPM
Nitrite: 0
Temp: safe about 70-75

im in a situation like i was when i first got this aquarium. and i kinda lost alot of fish before the aquarium got stabilized. i lost alot of money.

Please HELP! Thank you
Tristan

 

[blackeyes]

It is true I own several angelfish blushers. Otherwise it could be an outbreak of septicemia- an internal blood infection that needs to be treated immediately with antibiotic like oxytetracycline or maracyn two. Are they eating? if they are eating it is not too late too treat. this disease moslty affects angels while other fish are fine. i was in a similar situation- didn't know a thing about septicemia till it struck my tank. Lost a tank of baby angels, well.. I hope they get better.

 

[tj3stanv]

One is not eating, the other with the frayed fins is. I am suspecting that the one with frayed fins are suffering from fin rot but im not sure.

 

[blackeyes]

It is true I own several angelfish blushers. Otherwise it could be an outbreak of septicemia- an internal blood infection that needs to be treated immediately with antibiotic like oxytetracycline or maracyn two. Are they eating? if they are eating it is not too late too treat. this disease moslty affects angels while other fish are fine. i was in a similar situation- didn't know a thing about septicemia till it struck my tank. Lost a tank of baby angels, well.. I hope they get better.

I laso checked your water parameters and the temp is abit low for angel do far better at temps of-78-82 and have better immune response

 

[beesnees]

IMO

not exacily clude up on fish diseses but i do know that the amonia needs to be at 0ppm
or will do a lot of harm to your fish

recomend doing at least a 30% water change stright away

http/www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/hdgilld.htm

this may help good luck

 

[tj3stanv]

k k ill change it right away. should i quarantine the 2 angels with the red gils? one i suspect of fin rot because of its frayed fins and one is just in one spot not actively moving like the others.

 

[beesnees]

if youy have a quaratine tank i would advise you to use it, but fin rot doesnt affect health fish. so if the other fish seem to be fit and health it shouldn't bother them.

just try and keep the ammonia and nitrites at 0ppm


http/www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/hdisease.htm

add this link to your favorites will help you with most of your future problems HOPEFULLY great site have a look around may be able to help you a little more

GOOD LUCK

 

[tj3stanv]

so in a newly establish fish, how can i reduce that to 0? i have Seachem Prime that removes chlorine, choramine, ammonia, nititrites, and nitrates... so thats not enough to put the ammonia andnitrites to 0?

 

[beesnees]

dont really know much about undergravel filters, i use the one build into my juwel tank and and external filter on my big 200g tank

IMO
the tank needs cycling

reed this on the fishless cycle to get an idea

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=113861

have fun. welcome to the wonderful world of fish LOL

 

[Tolak]

I'm seeing a few situations going on at once here. You probably killed off a good portion if not all of your nitrifying bacteria by letting your aquarium run for two days without any source of ammonia. Posting your nitrite level will help to determine if you killed off all of them, or just a large portion. If you are seeing nitrites without nitrates in the next 5-7 days you probably did serious damage to the nitrifying bacteria. Read up on cycling, it will help you to understand what is going on; http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=141944


Blushers do have a translucent gill plate, most all koi angels are blushers. With exposure to ammonia, or with stress, the gills will appear to be more red. Adult angels need 10 gallons per fish, and a hex tank is taller, offering less surface area for O2 transfer. You will eventually need to rehome at least half of those angels, I imagine they are smaller now. Here's a quick stocking chart, I'm pretty sure I got this from the Angelfish Microhatchery site;

Newly free swimming fry 40 fry per gallon
Two week old fry 20 fry per gallon
Month old fry 10 fry per gallon
Pea size bodies 3 fish per gallon
Dime size bodies 2 fish per gallon
Nickel size bodies 1 fish per gallon
Quarter size bodies 1 fish per 2 gallons
Silver Dollar size bodies 1 fish per 3 gallons
Potential breeders 1 fish per 5 gallons
Show Specimens 1 fish per 10 gallons
One breeding pair 20 gallon high tank


Once you start to have nitrites, which will happen in a cycling tank, the fish's ability to process O2 will be hindered. This is where the surface area of a hex tank is a problem, as you need to increase aeration, and surface area plays a big part in this.

Depending on the size of the fish the one with frayed fins that is acting lethargic could be a victim of aggression, or plain stress from a combo of ammonia & an overstocked tank. Add to this the pH adjustment chemicals, which are famous for creating pH swings in a cycling tank, and you have more stress. A cycling tank tends to have pH swings no matter what you do, the pH stabilizer only adds to that. Your water will soon return to it's original pH, how long depends on the hardness. Your pH of 7.5 to 7.8 is fine for angels, mine is 7.6 to 7.8 out of the tap, and I breed angels by the hundreds.

Seachem Stability is a sales gimmick. While Seachem Prime is an excellent product, which probably makes up a major portion of Seachem's sales, Stability does nothing except make the aquarist feel better. Just so you know I have nothing against Seachem, I order Prime in 2 liter jugs. It is the only thing I add to my tank with water changes.

Septicemia often appears around the edges of fins, usually the dorsal & tail. The odds of it affecting one pectoral fin & not the other is slim. I would bet this is a symptom of overcrowding, some exposure to ammonia, pH swings, and perhaps not being properly acclimated. It could also be attributed to bad stock, this all depends on where the shop you got the fish from gets their stock.

Honest opinion; Take all the fish back, read the link on cycling & do a fishless cycle. Angels are a poor choice for cycling, betta will withstand it a little better, the plecs depending on the species may do well or may not. That tank will be way overstocked when the fish mature, and it is overstocked for a cycling tank right now.



If taking the fish back isn't an option, you will be doing daily water changes of around 50% until the tank cycles in order to minimize losses. As those angels grow you will need to thin the herd, and unless those two plecs are of a smaller species they will need to be rehomed as well.

 

[tj3stanv]

TY for ur very long and personal reply tolak... ive read the cycling forum, i have one question though, how long does this cycling usually take?

 

[Tolak]

Time for a chart;

If you can seed your filter with some mature filter media from a cycled tank, or even some gravel from a cycled tank it seems to speed up the process a little. Raising the temperature will speed it up as well, bacteria grows faster at higher temperatures to a reasonable point.

If you don't have a friend with a cycled tank, or a shop that is willing to help nearby, check out this link for forum members willing to donate cycled filter media; http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=150631