Ammonia Readings Are Driving Me Mad!

[Akasha72]

Sorry, I just needed a rant I guess. I changed my substrate to sand over a week ago and ever since I've been dealing with ammonia. After over 6 months of a cycled tank - with this tank and the previous one, I thought I was done with cycling.

I'm going insane here

The annoying bit is the fish just arn't bothered at all! You'd think there was nothing wrong! The platies are breeding and the cories are chasing and playing and the 2 oto's are happily cleaning off any bit of tasty algae they can find. I don't get it but I do if that makes sense.

My PH is reading at 6 - which I suppose means that the ammonia isn't so harmful but with a reading of 1ppm for ammonia you'd think the fish would be looking just a little bit bothered

Last night I added a dose of protozin as I'd seen 2 white dots of a platies tail and I suspected white spot and I have wondered if that has influenced the latest ammonia test but then that doesn't account for the smell that prompted me to do the test in the first place!

So, now what? Carry on changing water? Leave it alone and let it spike until it cycles again? Common sense says get the buckets out and get that water changed but then I look at the fish all happy and playing and think "I don't want to stress em out again"

This is a nightmare and I'm beginning to wish I'd left my nice black pebbles in the tank and the sand at argos

 

[TwoTankAmin]

At a pH of 6 there is virtually no NH3 with a total ammonia reading of 1ppm. So the fish should be pretty safe.

 

[Akasha72]

so am I wasting my time changing 50% of the water every day then? Can I just leave it alone?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

No- you need to find the cause and correct it. Longer term your fish will not be happy living this way. My point was more that it wasn't an immediate threat. There is a difference between ammonia levels that are causing immediate damage/harm vs low level ong term exposure which eventually will cause a different level of harm. Think of it this way. If you go out and sit in your car in a closed garage and turn on the engine the carbon monoxide will quickly cause harm and then death. However, if you live in a big city with high levels of air pollution, it wont kill you overnight, but if you live there longer term under such conditions there will be health issues.

I think that changeover from gravel to sand is the cause. The reason is that some portion of your bacterial colonies live in the upper levels of the substrate (contrary to what some here will tell you). How much bacteria is outside of one's filter media depends on a number of factors, so there is no hard and fast rule for this. In addition, changing substrate can be a bit messy in that it increases the active waste levels in the tank which would contribute to creating more ammonia than normal. If I am right I would expect the problem to self correct fair quickly as the colony rebuilds.

If you are medicating and wish to change water it is important that you replace meds removed via water changes. If you are doing the change on a day you are dosing, change then dose.

 

[MBOU]

Are you 100% sure it isnt just your test kit or the way you read it? Find several shops to test it or a shop that can use several test kits and see if they get same results...

 

[Akasha72]

Hi again, thanks for the replies. The need to change the water now makes perfect sense so thanks for explaining it in a way I can understand.

This sand is causing quite a bit of trouble and I've already removed it from my fry tank and put the black gravel back in. It's the cause of the low PH and I think the cause of the ammonia - despite me doing daily sand vacs and having a lot of trumpets snails in the tank to keep it moving.

I'm really regretting changing it now. I wish I'd left my happy cycled tank alone. It's really nice to watch the cories digging in the sand but I'm not sure it was worth all this hassle just for that.

As for my test kit - it's still within date but the ammonia test was running out so I've replaced it with new (it's the API master kit) but I'm still getting the high readings with the brand new drop test.

I think TTA is correct in that a lot of my bacteria was in my substrate and removing it has crashed the cycle. Had I of known that before I changed the substrate I'd of left things alone

 

[Akasha72]

no change in the readings. PH 6, Ammonia 1ppm and no Nitrite and I'm really not up to water changing today as I've got a really bad back ... but then I feel guilty if I leave it

 

[Akasha72]

As for the fry tank that had it's sand removed and black gravel replaced it's a total different story:

PH 7.6
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0

But just yesterday I was getting the same readings in both tanks

I'm beginning to think this sand is the cause of all this

 

[Staxx]

just take it as it comes youll be fine! when i had my mini cycle i didnt do a WC everyday tbh. thats far to much hard work lol

 

[Akasha72]

I'm beginning to think that there's something in this sand that's giving me false readings. I think the PH reading is right but the ammonia reading isn't.
I say this as there is no way the filter in the fry tank has cycled over night. It was giving me the same test readings as my main tank (PH6, Ammonia 1ppm and zero nitrites) for days on end and I've done nothing to the fry tank filter that's any different to the main tank with it's Juwel filter.

My suspicion would be that if I took all the sand out of my main tank tomorrow and put back the black gravel my filter would appear cycled again over night as the one in the fry tank has.

I never excelled at Science at school but this is one of those times when I wish I'd paid more attention in Chemistry!

 

[MBOU]

said to find somewhere that you can compare your readings with! The API test kit is really good... HOWEVER... they have a habit of suddenly going crazy with their results, always seems to be the ammonia one. Doesnt matter if its in date or not, if its an unexpected reading, i would always double check the API test kit. Even if just with strips.

Been caught out this way too many times We no longer use the API test kits because it gets expensive to have to have another type of test kit to use to double check it all the time.

Its a little more expensive but the JBL liquid test kits are way more worth it, they have a better range of accuracy and i have never known the test kit to go wrong, even a year out of date lol. Its just a little more of a PITA with measuring but worth it to not worry.

 

[Akasha72]

I know my lfs uses the Tetra drop test and I'm free Wednesday so I could take a trip down there with some water and see what the outcome is there. I'll take a look at the JBL one once the API one is all used up. Thanks for the info MBOU

 

[Akasha72]

UPDATE:

I've just got back from my lfs for my water tested. They use the Tetra drop test rather than the API one that I use. They did a test for PH, Ammonia and Nitrite.

I did a test for the same and took the result with me. The API result was

PH 6
Ammonia 1.0 ppm
Nitrite 0 ppm

The Tetra test was

PH -6 (barely a reading at all)
Ammonia 0.25
Nitrite 0

So their advice was really good as it always is. They suggest I carry on with the large water changes for another week (if I can do that without going crazy) and if nothing changes in that time to remove the sand and put the old gravel back - perhaps leaving just a corner with sand for the cories.
Alternatively I could leave the sand and add some crushed coral or sand stone to the tank in the hope it would lift the PH naturally (I told them I'm not adding chemicals unless I really really have to) but they can't say whether the ammonia reading will go away by doing this.

Currently I feel in a catch 22 position. I could remove the sand right now and go back to my trusted gravel but then all I've gained is whole heap of stress and upset my cories. I've really liked watching them sifting the sand and I'd feel cruel to take that away from them.
If I remove say 90% of the sand and replace with the old black pebbles it will look utterly rubbish and that's not the look I want. I have just seen a large-ish bag of fine black sand-ish substrate at another lfs but it had no price on it but it was made by uni-pac which is a name I've seen on here with good reviews.

The other option (of adding coral or sand stone) could work but who's to say it will work. It could lift my PH but not drop the ammonia reading and then I'm gonna start losing fish. It could do absolutely nothing and then I've lost money buying something I'm not certain I want anyway.


The guy at my lfs has said that my platies will only stand so long with a PH so low. The cories will be okay as they like a low PH anyway but platies prefer it over PH Neutral. At present they seem okay but long term ... I just can't say.

I really don't know what to do so any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated

Akasha

 

[drobbyb]

Be careful with the coral. Read the link in my signature regarding that subject.

 

[Akasha72]

okay, thanks drobbyb