Ammonia Issues - Levels Too High

[jasonpetts]

hi

my tank is new ( about 6 weeks ) small tank with 1 sword tail, 3 platy's and 1 molly. im having massive problems keeping the ammonia levels down.

-i do weekly water change - about 30 -40 %
-vacuum stones on bottom to clear waste - weekly
-add bacteria weekly
-feed fish combination of dry flakes and blood worm ( blood worm once per week )
-i have live plant x 1 ( only small tank )

i took a reading today and it came out at 2.0 on ammonia test, i get local fish shop to test water weekly and all other levels are ok ( apparantly ) they have advised liquid to break down ammonia but its a constant battle and im sure the chemicals arent great for the fish.

i know i should of done fishless cycling but pets at home convinced me otherwise - i was easily led as of course news hobby and got excited. about 2 weeks ago i lost a sword tail and a molly, both with same symptoms, floating around at top as if gasping for air and responding little to feeding.

there was some bullying going on as 2 of the platys seamed to harrass these fish - not sure wether its linked?

any advice would be appreciated as muyself and my son have picked some lovely fish and want them to be happy

cheers
jason

 

[Tropicoll]

Hey Jason, welcome to the forum!

Nothing new from P@H, they told me exactly the same thing. Thankfully I didn't follow their suggestion and went reading on the 'nets first.

Like you I found this fantastic forum.

You are now "doing" what is called a fish-in cycle rather than the fishless one. Have a read of THIS THREAD by Miss Wiggle (bless her!) for some excellent information on fish-in cycling.

I am by no means an expert and I hope someone else will be along soon to confirm this, but I think you need to be doing daily water changes to get that ammonia level down. I believe that 20% daily will be the recommended amount, but you may initially need to do three or four small changes in a day.

As you probably know, the ammonia is produced in the fish waste and is poisenous to them. There's no bacterial culture in your filter right now to cope with the ammonia and resulting nitrites, hence the fish gasping for air.

A couple of questions for you though:

1. Do you know the make/model of your tank?
2. Do you know the water volume in litres or gallons?
3. Do you have a water test kit yourself? Although P@H will test the water for free it's rumoured that they have in the past tailored the results of the water test to get you to buy more product.

If you don't have a test kit it is highly recommended that you get one - you'll need to be testing the water daily. The API Master Freshwater kit is one of the best and will test for Ammonia, NitrIte, Nitrate and Ph levels.

I hope this helps, please do not be afraid to ask any questions - even if you think they are silly!

Collin

 

[jasonpetts]

nice one, thankyou

i think i will need test kit as im sure pets at home just want to sell, bit wrong really! im currently only testing ammonia myself and have trusted them with rest - should know really, im in sales so im sure they want to sell just like i would. will buy test kit - is this the best one? - The API Master or any other reccomendations people?

have read lots on forum but pet shops and p@h always contradict and tell you its ok, buggers!

will try more regular water changes and as for details -

30 litres - small tank - new hobby, will be going large in new year and from what ive read im sure i will do fishless cycle and wait.

make - Rena? i think - threw box away

i obviously have heater, filter and air pump all came in pack with Rena tank

cheers so far

jason

 

[backtotropical]

Hi Jasonpetts,

Good advice from Collin there. The only thing I would say is that suggesting 20% as a nominal water change amount isn't the best way to go.

Ammonia is deadly for fish even in small concentrations and there is no safe limit other than 0. I would suggest that you need to get a test kit to monitor the condition of the water, and you need to be testing for at least ammonia and nitrite daily, if not twice daily.

If when you test there is any amount whatsoever of detectable ammonia or nitrite, you need to be doing water changes, and big ones (50%+).

Change as much water as is required to keep ammonia and nitrite as low as possible. Do not be fooled into thinking that large water changes are bad for the fish because exactly the opposite is true. In fact, your fish's lives may depend on large water changes at the moment.

Get a test kit of your own asap and post results on here, and then we can help you further. Meantime, until you get the test kit, change at least 70% of the water daily.

When you change the water, make sure you dechlorinate the replacement water and match the temperature as close as you can so the fish aren't exposed to extreme changes.

With regard to test kits, API or Nutrafin have a good reputation. Make sure you get a liquid reagent based kit, not dip-strips or tablets, as these are well known for being inaccurate. Make sure you get a test for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. API and Nutrafin both do kits which include all 4 of these tests.

Good luck and if you have any questions, just ask.

BTT

 

[jasonpetts]

thanks, shall be investing tomorrow at P@H instead of asking for usual test, this way i can be sure.

anyway to speed up cycle without causing fish distress?

 

[Tropicoll]

Unfortunately not unless you can get hold of some mature media from someone elses tank.

Prepare for a shock, the kit at P@H is 27 quid.

Regular healthy water changes will keep the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates down and your fish will be happy.

Thanks for the correction BTT, duly noted.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, BTT has got a good post up there for you to follow. If a 50% water change does not get your ammonia and/or nitrite(NO2) below 0.25ppm (closer to zero ppm hopefully) then you can do another one as soon as one hour later, and then even another one... hopefully you get the idea of what we are talking about!

Your goal will be to figure out what combination of percentages and/or frequency of changes will accomplish this thing of keeping ammonia between 0ppm and 0.25ppm without it going above 0.25ppm while you are away for longer periods. It can be tricky to figure that out but that's what you must try to do.

Don't worry about the cycling. Even with massive water changes, the bacteria will still get enough ammonia to be carrying on their process of building up biofilms on the filter media. Hopefully you have some sponge or ceramics in there and and not other strange chemicals. It usually takes about a month to Fish-In cycle (unless you luck into a mature media donation) and then finally you will reach the point where the filter will keep things at zero without water changes for a couple of days. Fish-In cycling stands a good chance of killing the fish, so there are no guarantees, but with the knowledge to do the right kind of water changes you can manually do the job of the biofilter and keep them alive and well.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[OldMan47]

Jason, the only way that I know of to speed a cycle is to get some used filter media from an established tank's filter. Make sure the filter media is from somebody that you know has healthy fish and that you trust. Put that bit of used filter media in your filter to help it deal with the biological load and to seed your filter with the right bacteria and leave it there for several weeks. After several weeks, your own filter media should have a large enough colony built up on it to be able to run without that extra bit. Any cycle with fish in will cause some fish distress but if you keep up with the water changes that BTT recommended, you should be able to minimize that stress.