A Quick Question On Bn Plecos

[Gruntle]

HI all,
 
I have two tanks, a 130l Aqua One AR620T, and a 200l 4' x 15" x 18" rectangular tank. IMHO the 200l is slightly understocked (9 Neon tetras, 5 Cherry Barbs and 9 Pacific Blue-eyes), whereas the 130l is probably reaching its limit with 7 Harlequin Rasboras and about 15 (they're too quick to count) male Endlers. The other fish I have are three BN Plecos.
 
At the moment I have two of the BN's in the 130l and one in the 200l. The two in the smaller tank were bought at the same time, however one (at 3") is almost twice as big as the other. The other one in the larger tank is significantly older and runs to about 4".
 
My plan is to capture one from the smaller tank and introduce it to the larger tank. The question is which one, and am I going to cause any issues by moving a younger fish into a tank that has a well established matriarch (as far as I can see, they're all female, they don't have the massive bristles that my long-lost male once had).
 
My initial thought was to move the larger one, if the fish are closer to the same size then I'd expect less bullying. I've been dropping two algae wafers into the smaller tank at opposite ends, and the larger fish seems to choose which one she's going to eat, then swims to the other end to take the one the smaller fish is left with (so I got sneaky and broke them into two, so there are four bits which means the smaller one gets something).
 
I'm also planning to add a bit more ornamentation (I have a spare sunken ship at the moment) to give an extra hiding space.
 
Am I on the right track?

 

[Alasse]

If that were me all those fish would be in the 200L and i would have the 620T to do with as i wish

 

[Gruntle]

Well, I had plans to replace the 200l with a 48 x 15 x 24 this year, but it seems Mother Nature has other plans for any spare cash I might have once had. So I'm reduced to shuffling the deck chairs at the moment...

 

[eaglesaquarium]

There are several things to consider.  Male BN Plecos are highly territorial.  The larger, older pleco in the 200L tank will have a clear and defined territory that HE has claimed and will not allow a new comer into.   The first thing you need to do is determine WHERE that territory is... where does he hang out.  There's likely more than one place that he calls 'home'.  He probably has his breeding cave, and he likely has his preferred feeding locations.  
 
 
Next question:  Are you certain that all the BNs you have are male?  If one of the smaller ones is female, then THAT is the one that you introduce to the 200L tank.  Give her a spot to claim in the new tank as her cave and you may find that you'll have fry eventually.  
 
 
If they are all males, rather than moving one of the males into the larger tank, where your largest BN has already staked a massive claim, why not consider a swap with someone for a known female?  It is much safer to have a male and a female in the tank where the male has a long established territory than to introduce a new male.  
 
 
 
IF you decide against this advice, you NEED (absolutely MUST) rearrange the decor, break up the current territories and give the new male a chance to stake his own claim SOMEWHERE (and make sure there are MULTIPLE 'caves' to choose from) that he can claim as his very own.  Personally, I have a 55 gallon tank with a single male BN... there's no way that I would introduce another male into that tank.  That is his tank as he sees it and he's not going to be very accommodating to any newcomers.  Adding a female to the tank is something that I've considered, but never a male.

 

[Gruntle]

A new camera for Christmas means better pictures. Also, severely "pruning" the enormous crop of Java Moss (I grabbed a bit and most of it came out so I thought fair enough) means the Downstairs BN is a little easier to photograph, as I can quite often catch him (and yes, he is a him) sunbaking (light baking?). Here he is:
 

 
Upstairs there's definitely two females:
 


 
So based on eagles' advice, I should move the little one downstairs?  I have a cave in the shape of a sunken ship:
 

 
And there's a sizeable piece of mangrove in there that has a lot of rib-shaped root fins, where the big man likes to hide when I'm trying to take his photo (but I caught him this time):
 

 
I also noticed one of the rocks in the tank has a hole through it, so I guess I'll keep an eye on the pair and make sure there's enough hiding spaces. If there's too much aggravation, I can source some more mangrove (it's good to have a friend who's a professional diver) and put it in the other end of the tank.

 

[NickAu]

 
There are several things to consider.  Male BN Plecos are highly territorial.  The larger, older pleco in the 200L tank will have a clear and defined territory that HE has claimed and will not allow a new comer into.   The first thing you need to do is determine WHERE that territory is... where does he hang out.  There's likely more than one place that he calls 'home'.  He probably has his breeding cave, and he likely has his preferred feeding locations.
If they are all males, rather than moving one of the males into the larger tank, where your largest BN has already staked a massive claim, why not consider a swap with someone for a known female?  It is much safer to have a male and a female in the tank where the male has a long established territory than to introduce a new male.

Totally agree, My male chases the female away all the time if she gets too close, Only time he don't display aggression towards her is when she lays eggs in his cave.
 
If you put a female in buy a breeding cave  http/www.thetechden.com.au/Catfish_Breeding_Log_p/l3.htm

 

[Alasse]

I have 5 breeding pairs of bn in a 55gal tank, have no issues with aggression. 1 pair was recently added.  I would have no qualms whatsoever of adding in males or females to a tank that already has BN in it

 

[RCA]

Confused somewhat as initially (unless I have misread) the OP states all are females, then Eagles talks based on all being males. However, the photos appear to clarify things. If it were me I would put both females into the tank with the male to spread any aggression and harassment from the male. He will eventually pair off with a female and you will see her getting very fat with eggs.

Love the mangrove, looks awesome. Keep us updated on your progress.

 

[Gruntle]

Initially I thought I had all females. A couple of years ago I had a big old male BN who had the biggest bristles in the world. Sadly, his life came to an end.
 
When I got my rectangular tank I bought 2 BN's but I was under the impression both were females, one passed away but the other has grown to be the man in the photos above. Since his bristles are nowhere near as big as my last male, I assumed he was female.
 
Now that I've been able to photograph all three BN's and compare, it's completely obvious that I have one male and two females.
 
Looks like I'll be doing a re-scape next weekend then...

 

[RCA]

You definitely have a male there, maybe your old boy had selective breeding that made his bristles longer?!? I have a male red BN and his bristles are not that long, but he is a regular breeder and King of the tank (ref the Juwel link in my sig). Enjoy the rescape, can you post a full shot of the tank now, and then after the rescape, as we all love pics.

 

[Gruntle]

Well, I guess one of my questions has been answered - how long before they start breeding?

Two weeks ago I bought a breeding cave. I can't remember the exact day, but that weekend I caught the smaller of the females and moved her to the big tank, along with the breeding cave and the shipwreck.

Tonight my internet has been haywire so I turned the light on to reset the modem, and there are four baby bristlenoses munching away on the tank walls! Which means there are probably twice as many hiding somewhere.

I thought it would take weeks or months for them to breed, but there you go. I'll take some photos tomorrow and post them.