110 Gallon South American Biotope

[eaglesaquarium]

All present and accounted for today... 16 neons all happily shoaling together.
 
I'll try to get some pics either tomorrow or Wednesday.  Don't have a good camera at the moment, and a delay will allow me to clean up the tank a bit more.
 
 

 

[TallTree01]

Oh bugger wish I found this sooner.
 
 
Good to know your tank is happy at last even with all the hiccups along th way.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Honestly, all you missed was a bunch of heartache and mystery...

 

[Ch4rlie]

Honestly, all you missed was a bunch of heartache and mystery...

 
No, I kind of disagree with that assessment Eagles.
 
Yes, there has been heartache and mystery but thats whats fishkeeping is all about sometimes and thats what makes this thread so interesting. 
 
Its about how it works out and how everyone tried to pull together to come up with a solution that would hopefully work.
 
Like a massive science project if you like with a fairly decent ending in terms that the stocking has survived and happily swimming about but the frustration of not knowing what the mystery was.
 
I'm still reckoning it was something so simple that we all missed it. Can't see the forest for the trees kind of thing.
 
Don't put yourself down like that, this thread has meant and still means more than you think.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Thanks Charlie.
 
 
 
My current hypothesis is this:  I used an airstone.  The other tank in the other room did not.  I used the airstone in both tanks I tested.  So, perhaps the airstone released whatever airborne contaminant was present into the tank and is absorbed into the water more than it would without the air stone.
 
That's the only thing I've changed since last year, really.  No airstone.  I probably should have seen that coming... 
 
Not definite that that is the cause, but it seems the most plausible explanation now.  I'm not going to test it by turning the airstone on to see if the fish croak, but that's my current hypothesis.

 

[Ninjouzata]

I'm so glad that all is going well right now!
What are the students thoughts on it?

 

[daizeUK]

Glad that you're having better luck now.  Are you planning to try bloodfins again?

 

[hobby5]

Hello eagle!
 
I have read every detail on this topic, and I am sry for u r losses! But I could not sleep without finding the cause (To be honest I would try that airstone to be sure what the culprit was.)
 
What did u do with the tank over summer? Did u exchange any water before adding the new fish now? Did the cleaning staff change?
 
At some point you state, that water hardness was not the problem, but you did not go into detail. Did you measure e.g. conductivity of transport and tank water? If the difference was to great your fish would die despite the acclimatisation u did. (That is what i suppose and not some dubious substance outside the tank.)
 
Btw. Cardinal tetra (Paracheirodon axelrodi) are soft water fish and will do much better and live longer if u keep them in soft water. (Anything else is not considered good practice in (at least) the German speaking parts of the world.)
 
Moreover the soil you added can over time change water chemistry quite a lot, maybe that is the reason for your current success.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Thank you for your responses.
 
 
Nin - the students want big fish in the tank.  That's not happening!  I like little fish in large numbers.
 
 
Daize: Yes, eventually I plan to give the bloodfins a shot again... I just think that they will add a very active element (and color contrast) to the tank.  And perhaps their activity will cause the neons to be a little more adventurous... Even now they are still hiding in one corner or another most of the time...  They come out for brief periods that I see, but mostly in the same spots.
 
 
Hobby5:  First,   to TFF!!!  Always good to have new members, and I feel honored that your first message was after going through my nightmare journal!
 
To address your questions/concerns:
 
1 - Water hardness, both gH and kH were tested.  kH runs between 3 and 4 degrees, gH runs about 5 degrees.  So, kH is roughly ~65 ppm.  gH runs about ~90 ppm.  (both of these values are well within the tolerance of bloodfins, guppies and even cardinals).
 
2 - I did not measure the conductivity of the water from transport/tank water.  But, I did measure many of the other parameters, just as I have in the past with other fish.  The rapidity that the fish showed symptoms and death was an indicator to me of a toxin rather than an acclimation issue. 
 
3 - While I am curious if it was related to the airstone, I feel as though I have sufficient evidence to blame it on that, even though I don't have conclusive evidence.  I certainly don't want to turn it on and kill or even harm the fish I have currently.  If you have a means of testing this conclusively without putting any of the fish in danger, I'd be happy to hear about it.
 
4 - The cleaning staff is EXACTLY the same.
 
5 - Over the summer I completely emptied the tank and sealed it off from the air in the room.  I brought the cories home with me to spend the summer vacationing in a 15 gallon QT.  They were brought home in a 5 gallon bucket, half full of water from the tank, and then water from my house was used to fill the tank from there.  (My home and the school have the same water supply company, so the water is nearly identical, in theory.)

 

[hobby5]

@eagle
 
I would also rule out an infection, as the progress is so quick and affects all fish equally.
 
When your last batch of bloodfins died in the small tank, imho you showed that the water was the culprit. Either it contained some toxin or they did not manage to cope with the change. Did the water you used then, came from the big tank or directly from the tap? I still cannot imagine what should have been the poison, as the fish in the other tanks in the house and the corydoras (exposed over such a long time!) were not affected. If there was something in the air, you most likely would have smelled that. My favourte is still the acclimatisation issue. You got rather soft water, while hard water is more common. Additionally, some (many?) shops like to add sodium chloride to their water as it keeps infections down.
 
Concerning your airstone hypothesis:
Where was your airpump situated? Is anyone smoking in that room? But again, it is hard to belive that the corydoras survied without any symptoms.
 
I guess this will forever be a mystery

 
Good luck now!
 
PS: I also like small fish in a huge tank, imho that is the right approach Do you know the Silvertip tetra (Hasemania nana)? They should really be fun in such a big tank.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Bad news...
 
Tried 9 bloodfins from home again.  They survived from Friday night to Saturday afternoon, but they were all dead again by Monday morning...  So, whatever the issue was last year is still an issue, but apparently only for the bloodfins, not the neons or corydoras. 

 
 

  Bloodfins.
 
I guess bloodfins are out of the question for me, at least in this tank.  (They did fabulous in my tank at home for nearly 4 months.)  Meanwhile, I am working on getting the water tested by a professional water quality person and compare it to the tank in the classroom adjacent.
 
 
 
 
So much promise, yet so much heartache again.

 

[Ninjouzata]

I'm so sorry to hear this Eagles!

 Bloodfins <3
Really hope they can help figure out what is going on with the water!

 

[hobby5]

That is not the news we were hoping for

 
Are there bloodfins swimming in any of the other tanks? If not the likelihood is high that they would not survive there either.
And in every description it states the bloodfin is a hard fish

 
(Btw this confirms that the airstone was not the culprit.)

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Yeah... it does eliminate the airstone as the culprit.
 
No bloodfins have been tested in any of the other tanks.
 
 
 
And yes, EVERYWHERE, it states that bloodfins are hardy.

 
They seemed hardy in my home tank...

 

[daizeUK]

Sorry you're not having much luck with the bloodfins.  I guess whatever was wrong with the tank is still in there, though perhaps getting diluted out over time.