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Fin Rot?? Help!!

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Jon Bennett

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Hi All,

Would really appreciate some advice please.

I have a relatively new set up:

200L Fresh water Aquarium with a Fluval 406canister filter.

I did a fish-less cycle with pure ammonia, to the point where my bacteria would convert 2ppm of ammonia to nitrates within 24 hours.

My water conditions/parameters are very good. Latest test readings were 0 ppm Ammonia, 0 ppm Nitrites, about 20 ppm Nitrates and my Ph reading is around 7.2

I do 25% weekly water changes, and use a Nitrate filter to lower my tap water Nitrates as it comes out of the tap at around 40 ppm.

I always treat my tap water to get rid of chlorine etc...

My stock is currently:

11 Cardinal Tetras (they out too many in the bag at the shop)
10 Rummy Nose Tetras
6 Corydoras Venezuelanus "Orange"

I very gradually introduced my mentioned stock.......not all at the same time.

My ammonia has never read above 0, and neither have my nitrites. so i'm very confident that my water quality is more than adequate for happy fish.

After i had bought my Rummy nose tetras, i noticed that a few of them had damaged fins, and i'm pretty sure (maybe wrong) that this was from nipping whilst they were in their extremely crowded tank at the Fish store.

after a couple of weeks, the fins were very evidently starting to grow back, which i was delighted about.

However, over the last week, they seem to have gotten a bit worse again, (particularly on their anal fins) they are starting to look a little "shredded" and a few of them are showing signs of whiteness on their fins (I wouldn't say that this was fuzzy though)
I am still unsure if they have fin rot or not. Getting pictures is near impossible..........

All my fish seem happy, non of them are lethargic, and they are all very happy and get extremely excited at feeding time.

They have a mixed diet of flake, ground pellet, frozen daphnia & wafers for the Cory's.

I would appreciate some experienced advice please.....i'm terrified to add any treatment, and really concerned about my little friends.

I've tried to cover all the details, but if I've missed anything, let me know.

Thanks in advance,

Jon
 
Hi and welcome to the forum :)

Unfortunately without pictures of the fish we can only guess. But fish have a mucous coating over their body and if they are stressed from poor water quality, chemicals or parasites, they will produce more mucous and this can look like the body has got a cream or white film over it.

Your water appears good with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite so that is unlikely to be the issue.

None of the fish have started gasping at the surface or dropped dead so we can assume there is nothing toxic in the tank that is causing this.

This leaves us with physical damage possibly caused by displaying & breeding, or a protozoan infection. Protozoan infections like Costia, Chilodonella & Trichodina can cause damage and irritation to fish's fins and bodies and the fish respond by increasing the mucous coating in that spot, making the infected area look like it is cream or white.
While the parasites are in low numbers the fish remain healthy and act normally but over time the parasites build up in numbers and weaken the fish and eventually kill it.

Fortunately most protozoan infections are relatively easy to treat and you use the same treatment for all of them. Malachite Green or sodium chloride (salt) will treat protozoan infections in freshwater fishes. However, without seeing the fish I would not suggest using any medication. And it depends on what else is in the tank. Corydoras do not like salt but will tolerate low levels, and they don't do well with full strength medications containing Malachite Green.

One way to reduce the spread of protozoan infections is to do massive (75-90%) water changes each day, and do a complete gravel clean at the same time. This dilutes the number of pathogens in the water and can help but will not cure the problem.

At this stage I would monitor the fish over the next few weeks and if they get more cream/ white patches over their body or fins, then get some medication (containing Malachite Green) to treat protozoan infections. Make sure it is suitable for scaleless fishes. If you can't find a medication for scaleless fishes then use a normal medication at half strength.
 
Colin_T said:
Hi and welcome to the forum :)

Unfortunately without pictures of the fish we can only guess. But fish have a mucous coating over their body and if they are stressed from poor water quality, chemicals or parasites, they will produce more mucous and this can look like the body has got a cream or white film over it.

Your water appears good with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite so that is unlikely to be the issue.

None of the fish have started gasping at the surface or dropped dead so we can assume there is nothing toxic in the tank that is causing this.

This leaves us with physical damage possibly caused by displaying & breeding, or a protozoan infection. Protozoan infections like Costia, Chilodonella & Trichodina can cause damage and irritation to fish's fins and bodies and the fish respond by increasing the mucous coating in that spot, making the infected area look like it is cream or white.
While the parasites are in low numbers the fish remain healthy and act normally but over time the parasites build up in numbers and weaken the fish and eventually kill it.

Fortunately most protozoan infections are relatively easy to treat and you use the same treatment for all of them. Malachite Green or sodium chloride (salt) will treat protozoan infections in freshwater fishes. However, without seeing the fish I would not suggest using any medication. And it depends on what else is in the tank. Corydoras do not like salt but will tolerate low levels, and they don't do well with full strength medications containing Malachite Green.

One way to reduce the spread of protozoan infections is to do massive (75-90%) water changes each day, and do a complete gravel clean at the same time. This dilutes the number of pathogens in the water and can help but will not cure the problem.

At this stage I would monitor the fish over the next few weeks and if they get more cream/ white patches over their body or fins, then get some medication (containing Malachite Green) to treat protozoan infections. Make sure it is suitable for scaleless fishes. If you can't find a medication for scaleless fishes then use a normal medication at half strength.
Click to expand...

Thanks Colin.......

I will try and get some photos when i get home.

I have looked up what you have made a suggestion it might be and i don;t think this is the case.

Jon
 
Here is a picture I managed to get. I noticed last night when the light went off that there was a lot of chasing......I'm unsure whether this was playful or aggressive. A few of my cardinals now how bits of tail fin missing.

It's always on the lower half of the tail, and the anal fin.
20180603_195416.jpg
 
The fish in the picture look pretty healthy besides the fin damage. That should heal by itself. Just monitor the fins for infection. If they go white and fluffy then they have fungus, red is bacterial. Right now they are fine tho.

It could be breeding behaviour with males trying to encourage females to release eggs by head butting and nipping the anal fin and surrounding area. If you put a decent size clump of Java Moss in the tank, the fish will swim into that when laying eggs. Adding a few more of each tetra can help too because it helps calm the fish down when they are in larger numbers, and spreads any aggression among more individuals rather than just a few. :)
 
Any suggestions on how to stop the nipping? do you think they will settle down?
 
Neither rummynose or cardinals are renown fin nippers so it should settle down. Adding more plants and more cardinals & rummynose might help reduce the nipping :)
 
Last edited:
Yes, i am going to the shop after work to get some more plants........
the cardinals, all seem to rest in the plants i already have at night. Leaving the rummies pretty much in open water, near the bottom of the tank.
 
So.....got home tonight, and one of my cardinals has been absolutely destroyed. I've seen fin nipping with my own eyes now, and has certainly getting picked on. I don't think he has long left
Any advice at this point would be great. I really didn't think this would happen. I thought that I would have zero problems with these fish getting along. I just don't understand.
 
Grab a breeding net and put the fish in that for a few weeks. If you can't get a breeding net then use a large fish net and rest it across the top of the tank and put a small rock in the net to weight it down so the fish can swim around in it. If you don't have a big net to use then get a 2 litre plastic container and put the fish in that and let it float around the tank. Poke a couple of holes in the sides of the container.
 
The fish in question is still alive, still looks healthy, other than his fins looking tattered.

his tail hasn't got either worse or better. I still haven't added any type of medication, but i have added some extra plants, for a bit more cover for all of the fish.

I am still contemplating adding some melafix, but still not sure. It's the corys i worry about when considering adding "stuff" to the water.
 
Don't add anything unless you have to. At this stage there is only physical damage to the fins and this should heal up by itself without any medication or help from you. Fish regularly lose bits of fin to other fish and parasites in the wild and they heal up without any problems.

If the damaged area goes red then it has a bacterial infection and will need treating. If the damaged area goes white and fluffy it has a fungal infection and will need treating. But until that happens, don't add anything.

All I can suggest is more fish and more plants. More plants will provide more hiding places, and more fish will help to spread the aggression out over more fish, so one isn't picked on continuously.

If you can find the one doing the damage, then you could isolate it for a few days and see how they do without that fish in the group and after it is added back in. You might have one overly boisterous male that is just being a bully and removing it could fix the problem. Introducing more fish might add another male that the bully can spar with and that could reduce the problem too. :)
 
Hi Colin,

I suppose i'm just a little concerned that the fish wont even get chance for his fins to heal......

When you say white and fluffy, how fluffy are we talking? There is a bit of white around the damaged edge of the tail, but this could just be part of the damage.

I added more plants yesterday


20180604_215304.jpg
 
A pale cream/ white film is normal mucous produced by the fish to protect the damaged area.

Fungus will stand up away from the body/ fin and in advanced cases will look like a white prickly shrub. I have added a link below with a goldfish that has a bad fungal infection on the tail. The fish in the picture has an advanced case of fungus but it will give you an idea of what to look for.
https://www.fishkeeper.co.uk/post/diseases-in-fish-part-2-fungal-infections
 
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