Why do my cardinals seem to fight?

[BettaMan2000]

[QUOTE="Byron, post: 3779172, member: 49218You do however keep asking the same question, and appear determined to do what is not going to be in the best interests of the fish. Yes it is your aquarium, but fish come first, not your or my ideas if these should be beyond the scope of what will be in the best interest of the fish.[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry but that's both wrong and unfair, how dare you cast false accusations!

 

[Byron]

[QUOTE="Byron, post: 3779172, member: 49218You do however keep asking the same question, and appear determined to do what is not going to be in the best interests of the fish. Yes it is your aquarium, but fish come first, not your or my ideas if these should be beyond the scope of what will be in the best interest of the fish.

I'm sorry but that's both wrong and unfair, how dare you cast false accusations![/QUOTE]

That is how I read your posts, having just gone through them again. I can only go by what you say.

 

[BettaMan2000]

I'm sorry but that's both wrong and unfair, how dare you cast false accusations!

That is how I read your posts, having just gone through them again. I can only go by what you say.[/QUOTE]

Well you've clearly come to the wrong conclusion, and don't you dare accuse me of something that's a downright lie!

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I’ve got small black gravel.

Cardinals are fine for a 54 litre, in facts it’s more than enough room for them!

Could I go for 12 cardinals and 6 harlequin rasbora?

I am going to disagree with the bolded portion of this post. It is barely enough room for them.
http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/Paracheirodon-axelrodi

An aquarium with base dimensions of 60 ∗ 30 cm or larger is recommended.

You'll note that that is the minimum recommended tank size for a group of cardinals. As such, you are going to find more problems keeping them than if they were in a larger tank... one in which there actually was 'more than enough room for them'.


Adding more individuals may in fact help them to feel more comfortable. And, while seriouslyfish does recommend these fish to be kept with other peaceful shoalers for their best display, the balance of the aquarium must also be maintained.
1 - There is not a lot of swimming space, so a second mid-water shoaling fish will not work best.
2 - Bioload must always be considered in a small tank. Adding dwarf or micro fish in a tank this size is generally preferred, as they do indeed have more space to swim, and have a lighter bioload than larger fish.
3 - So... adding another fish species to this tank is not a great idea, if the fish is a mid-water swimmer.
4 - A dwarf species corydoras would be a nice addition, but they need a fine substrate. Please elaborate on the 'small black gravel' you mentioned. I will state, without knowing the fullness of the situation, that the substrate you currently have is likely not going to be suitable for the corydoras... sadly.


In the meantime, I'd remind folks to stick to the topic and not delve into the motivations of different members.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

One other idea that jumped to mind as soon as I navigated away... cardinals also prefer more dimly lit conditions...


Adding some black water elements, dimming the light you currently have or adding some floating plants would likely help with the stress as well. Adding 'cover' as well, in the form of plants (natural or artificial), would likely help as well.

 

[BettaMan2000]

Whereas I appreciate your advice, my tank is 60x30x30 cm, therefore is sufficient for the 5 cardinal tetras that are in there already.

The gravel is lentil sized, although there aren't any specifics that I can give, there aren't any from pets at home where I bought it from.

Don't think corys will be compatible and in any case I'd need more than I want, don't want more than a few of them so that wouldn't work.

I'll most likely either double the cardinals, probably go for 12 actually, or go for a bigger tank and go saltwater.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Whereas I appreciate your advice, my tank is 60x30x30 cm, therefore is sufficient for the 5 cardinal tetras that are in there already.

The gravel is lentil sized, although there aren't any specifics that I can give, there aren't any from pets at home where I bought it from.

Don't think corys will be compatible and in any case I'd need more than I want, don't want more than a few of them so that wouldn't work.

I'll most likely either double the cardinals, probably go for 12 actually, or go for a bigger tank and go saltwater.

Clearly, it is not. If it were, then you would be reporting no problems and this thread wouldn't have been started.

So, you need more cardinals, and when adding more cardinals, you are now pushing the limits of what the tank can support.


Lentil sized gravel says plenty. That is not appropriate for cories, especially not for dwarf varieties.


Doubling the number of cardinals is a good move, but I wouldn't go beyond that. Incidentally, if you were going to go with a bigger tank... then you could easily go with the 12 cardinals and a similar size group of harlequin rasboras as you'd asked about earlier. A nice 30 gallon tank would be ideal for that and still leave space for a pleco, as you had mentioned earlier or even a group of corydoras - like the sterbai you had mentioned earlier as well.

 

[BettaMan2000]

What could be kept with 12 cardinals in terms of fish with that substrate?

If the the gravel was changed to sand is there a bright coloured cory or other fish that could go in there ie plec?

 

[Demeter32]

Firstly, I am doing my own research, secondly, I appreciate any help but it's my tank and if I don't like your choice of fish, I'm not going to put it in, finally if you don't want to help don't, but don't be condescending then stroppy when I don't agree with you

I was being rather civil and only stating my thoughts. Also, I never demanded nor pushed you to add my choices of aquatic critters, twas but a simple recommendation. I apologize for possibly offending you, but please do not attack Byron, he has extensive knowledge and is perhaps the best individual on this forum for stocking choices and compatibility. We only offer suggestion and tips based off of experience and research.

 

[BettaMan2000]

I was being rather civil and only stating my thoughts. Also, I never demanded nor pushed you to add my choices of aquatic critters, twas but a simple recommendation. I apologize for possibly offending you, but please do not attack Byron, he has extensive knowledge and is perhaps the best individual on this forum for stocking choices and compatibility. We only offer suggestion and tips based off of experience and research.

In which case I accept your apology and am both very appreciative and open to any suggestions being made, in terms of attacking Byron, rather I'm defending myself, I will not accept that I'm trying to harm my fish in any shape way or form, if that was the case I'd stock as I'd like and not even come on these forums at all.

I'm earnestly trying to ascertain what works best, being a beginner!

 

[eaglesaquarium]

What could be kept with 12 cardinals in terms of fish with that substrate?

If the the gravel was changed to sand is there a bright coloured cory or other fish that could go in there ie plec?

The substrate with respect to cardinals is completely irrelevant.

In terms of finding a brightly colored fish to match with 12 cardinals, in a 15 gallon tank... that's going to be practically impossible to find. No pleco is appropriate in a 15 gallon tank, unless it is by itself in a quarantine situation. Plecos are just too much bioload for that small a tank. I wouldn't recommend a pleco in anything smaller than a 20 gallon long tank.



You'd be looking for a small, lone fish that lives primarily along the substrate... Not an easy fish to find.


sticking to the South American fish... for similar water needs as the Cardinals... the one fish that comes to mind is one of the Apistogramma species. Getting a single male would likely work in that size tank. Again though, you are really pushing the limits in a 15 gallon. A 20 Gallon long would be more suitable at the low end of the tank size.

 

[BettaMan2000]

Thanks for that, it was helpful