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Well Water KH/GH Question

tolstoy21

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Ok so (longish story) . . . .

I am looking at changing how I prepare aquarium water so I can install a continuous drip system for water changes.

I already perform semi-automatic water changes on a 125 gallon planted aquarium by making water in a Brute can in my basement and then triggering a remote switch to pump new water into the aquarium (the excess old water drains out via sump overflow that drains back into the basement). This has been great for years, but the whole system relies on me making RO water and then remineralizing and buffering it, and this costs money.

Near term, I am also planning on doing some small-scale breeding in my basement, so I don't want the costs and labor of making RO water to increase, especially in an environment where I need to do more frequent larger water changes.

The main challenge with my well water has been Nitrates. There is a large golf course behind my property that fertilizes heavily and swings the ground water to about 20+ppm according to API test kit. This is 8 Mg/L of Nitrogen according to a recent professional water testing (I do these once every 2 years, and the nitrogen levels fluctuate somewhat based on other environmental factors, like seasons with heavy rain, etc.). 10 Mg/L is legal residential limit before whole house remediation is required. I went the RO route to mitigate this problem as Im not planning on hooking up to city water ($$$$$$) nor investing (yet) in whole-house remediation (less $$$$$ but still $$$).

I am now realizing that since nitrates seems to be my predominate issue, it would be more cost effective to install a small nitrate removal system to target just nitrate removal (something the size of an under-sink unit). The cost of running this long term will be far more economical than running a similarly sized RO system. I kind of wished I had researched this option from the beginning, before committing to RO, equilibrium, etc. as the upfront costs is also cheaper than the upfront costs of RO units.

So now the question . . . . . .

My raw well water is 2dKH and 8dGH, according to API drop tests. I know low KH is not ideal as it can contribute to PH swings. But, in a system that is continually changing small volumes of water all the time, will this be an issue? Will the potential for swings be more avoidable in this setup?

I am looking to get out of the business of stripping stuff out of my water only to spend money to put it back in, especially if I set up more tanks. I don't want to prepare water at all, actually, except in the case of my caradina shrimp tanks. Using crushed coral also seems like a no-go as this will push the GH up more than I'd like.

So any advice? Don't worry about 2 dKH? Or, is there an easy, low maintenance way to raise it without having to mix water, or add and measure buffers on a continual basis?

Any advice would be truly greatly appreciated.
 
I expect if the contents of your aquarium remain relatively inert and you are not injecting co2, you would be ok not to worry.
 
IS there any way to replicate your current system using the filtered water? Larger changes are better - even if less frequent. WIth a drip system you are constantly flushing away a mix of old & new water so the levels of "bad stuff" (not just nitrates) can rise over time.
2dKH in itself is not a problem. I use pure RO (not mineralised) in my soft water tanks and the pH is stable (low but stable), but I do do 75% weekly water changes to keep it that way. Without these I suspect the pH would keep dropping.
 
The point of attempting to use a drip system is so I can full automate the majority of WCs. However, I'm going to retain to ability to stage filtered water in the event that i need to do larger, ad-hoc changes (for instance if I dosed the tanks with meds or something). I'm still plumped into the current WC system, I'm just augmenting it with a dripper and changing how I filter.

My plan is to not aggressively drip at first so I can gage the nitrate levels over the course of the month and see how they trend, then adjust the drip rate as needed. Also, I'm not doing a constant drip. I'm going to drip it in conjunction with a timer so I can control the total amounts of new water added per day. I could use the same set up to change water at a faster rate (30 gallons in an hour would be the maximum filter flow rate), but without staging the water for a day+, I'd be pumping cold water into the tank that has an unacclimated Ph of about 5.9. My goal is to not have to stage water, and to not have to remineralize and buffer with products, as I do now with RO. RO for me is a more costly and time consuming WC method long-term, when all I really need to do is target nitrate removal from my well water.

@seangee you mention the levels of "bad stuff" can can rise over time, what bad stuff specifically? Are these bad things unmeasurable in a way that I could not understand their trend levels over time?

Like I said, my goal is to have the dripper change approximately the same amount per month that occurs when I do the less frequent, larger changes. I've used some online calculators to determine what the ratios of new and old water look like, per month under both situations. My main worry was about exhausting Kh over time, give the lower-end levels I'm working with out of my well.

Additionally, the way my bulk water change system works now, it also does not discriminate between new and old water when flushing. It distributes new water to the same place as the dripper will, just as a much faster rate. When my tank overfills, the sump also overfills and flushes a mix of new and old water. Based on my observations, I'd guess the larger changes will flush a larger proportion of new water given that the return pump is powered down during a change and so the tank water circulation (mixing) is reduced.

There is no hard science behind what I'm doing (or plan on doing), and I don't want to overthink this. Just trying to get a best attempt at changing a portion of water as easily as possible so i don't have to lug buckets up and down stairs and reduce my overall costs. Who doesn't like doing less work for saving more money?

As always thanks for the responses. Advice is always appreciated.
 
@seangee you mention the levels of "bad stuff" can can rise over time, what bad stuff specifically? Are these bad things unmeasurable in a way that I could not understand their trend levels over time?
Some are unmeasurable, specifically hormones and pheromones. This is particularly relevant for breeding because fry produce pheromones to stop other fish from growing (survival of the fittest by eliminating the competition). Commercial breeders do large daily chnages for exactly that reason, the fish grow much faster if they get rid of these pheromones. I mentioned this because some people erroneously assume if they have no nitrates there is no need to change water.

If you use a simple spreadsheet you will see that 10x10% changes dilutes the value of anything to 53% and you would need 17x10% changes to get to 25% (i.e. 170% of the tank volume) where a single 75% change is all that is needed to achieve the same thing. And that assumes nothing is being added to the tank in the meantime, which of course is not true.

I know that many people do use drip systems successfully so I can't say its a bad thing, and its certainly better than never changing water. I just don't know if it would be sufficient to keep the tank water similar enough to the source do an emergency change if needed.
 
@seangee -- thanks for the responses. Much appreciated.

The original staging barrel will still be plumbed into the system as I do want to retain the ability to do emergency or large water changes (and I do still need to make RO for some shrimp tanks, etc.)

I guess the drip system will be an experiment for me, but I can revert at any point to either larger water changes or to RO if I'm unhappy with the results.

The true goal was to reduce cost/work as my number of tanks increases, but I'm going to build into the system the ability to tweak how much water is delivered and at what frequency, if needed.

As much as I like keeping fish, I equally enjoy engineering, tinkering and building things so that's also kind of part of the impetus for the project.
 
I use API Nitra-Zorb to filter out nitrates from my well water. Check out My Nitrate Fight. You could easily build a filter like the API Tap Water Filter out of PVC.
Note: I need to update my blog post as I now filter in the basement into a 45g Brute trash can.
 
Seems like you have some good advice, id just like to mention that my Cats named Tolstoy:)
 
@AbbeysDad -- Thanks for the link.

My current well water is 8,400 ug/L NO3-N as tested professionally (I do this bi-annually for family health reasons as this is getting close to the EPA drinkable limit). This number comes out to about 40ppm NO3- as measured by API kits and according to some conversions I've done using resources online.

I'm going to try using a nitrate filter like this -- https://www.freedrinkingwater.com/ww-fi-20bb-nitrate-water-filters.htm . That should remove the nitrates from about 3000 gallons of water, if their documentation is correct and I'm running the filter at optimal performance (so I'm guessing my mileage might vary).

There is an initial outlay cost is similar to a simple RO setup. But I'm hoping it will be cheaper and easier to treat the same volume of water longer-term (I currently burn through DI resin). I do a lot of my own plumbing in my house so won't have the expense of hiring someone to plumb it up for me.

I've already ordered the nitrate cartridge and the housing, but after reading your article, I think after I deplete the first cartridge, I'll look into the cost and effectiveness of packing the second cartridge the API product, and see what longevity I can get out of that with the salt recharges and how that stacks up from a cost/performance perspective. I'm going to reduce the flow into the filter down to .5 gpm, so I should see the same water creation rates as you in your experiment.

The 20" big blue cartridge seems to hold maybe about 8lbs of media (according to shipping weight), so that seem cheaper than a similar volume of the API product. But if one is rechargeable and the other is not, that's a huge plus. Also, they might have differing efficiencies. Don't know. (Or it could be the exact same media).

I guess experimenting with both and determining their usable lifespan, results, rechargeability and long-terms costs would be interesting to record. Or maybe not even worth the effort?

All I know right now is that I burn through RODI resin only to pay money to add back in most of what i just took out.

Thanks again for the link and sharing your experience.
 
Just a thought. Do you actually need the DI stage?
I am on municipal water so have never analysed it before or after but I use RO because our water supply has 50ppm nitrates (the legal limit). I don't use DI but the RO output had no detectable nitrates. TDS drops from >300 to <10.
 
@seangee -- so your thinking the membrane itself strips out the nitrates before the DI stage? Hadn't thought of or tried that. I could check and also test the resulting KH/GH of the resulting water.

I have a diverter on the unit that allows me to bi-pass the DI cartridge. Would be easy to test.
 
@seangee -- so your thinking the membrane itself strips out the nitrates before the DI stage? Hadn't thought of or tried that. I could check and also test the resulting KH/GH of the resulting water.

I have a diverter on the unit that allows me to bi-pass the DI cartridge. Would be easy to test.
My KH/GH is consistently 0. I have put an extra carbon filter in the final stage just to make sure there is no residual bad taste, may not be needed but I no longer drink the stuff that comes out of the tap, and carbon is cheap - especially when you are pumping already purified water through it.
 
Downstream of my RODI unit I have a whole-house softener and another filter to keep the PH neutral in my house to stop plumbing corrosion. So those boost the KH but lower the GH coming coming out of the well.

For my future needs, Im thinking of bypassing all of that and running water from the well through the nitrate filter, so I can keep the natural water KH/GH. KH is a tad on the low side from the well (hence whole house the neutral regulator), and why I started this thread. To get a feel of how low 2 KH is in terms not wanting to add buffers.

I guess for a planted, mostly tetra, danio, rasbora community tank that's probably about right were i'd want it?

It's all an experiment really, and to give me something to tinker with while I'm stuck at home!

This has been a good convo. Thanks everyone!
 

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