Water Issues

[IrishMom]

Well my tank is finally cycled.

So I am left with my persistent pH issues. My tap water is from a salt based water softener. It tests at or above 8.8 before it goes in the tank. My 50% RO water changes are only bringing it down to 8.2-8.4. I have a bag of peat moss in the tank.

While my snail seems happy, I don't want to put anything in that will get stressed. If I resort to using distilled water, RO water, or spring water for all water changes, what would I need to add to the water nutrient wise?

Maybe I should just buy betta water. I'm about to give up.

 

[Byron]

Well my tank is finally cycled.

So I am left with my persistent pH issues. My tap water is from a salt based water softener. It tests at or above 8.8 before it goes in the tank. My 50% RO water changes are only bringing it down to 8.2-8.4. I have a bag of peat moss in the tank.

While my snail seems happy, I don't want to put anything in that will get stressed. If I resort to using distilled water, RO water, or spring water for all water changes, what would I need to add to the water nutrient wise?

Maybe I should just buy betta water. I'm about to give up.

First, water softeners that use salt are not good for fish, so I would find another water source. If you are only concerned with a single Betta, the onus of RO water (bought or if you get a RO unit as mentioned earlier) willnot be as much as it would for a 100 gallon tank of something. The other thing is, can you use the water before it goes through the softener, and what is it like (parameters, etc)?

Second point, you need to kow the GH and KH of the water before you can even begin to deal with pH, as they are closely related. The GH is the level of dissolved hard minerals (calcium and magnesium) in the water, and the KH (carbonate hardness or Alkalinity) is bicarbonate hardness that "buffers" pH to prevent fluctuations. Attempts to lower the pH if the GH/KH are moderate or high will not have much success. Organics (wood, leaves, peat) will be temporary at best, if they have much effect at all, when the KH especially is high.

To your last question, what to add to "pure" water...this depends upoon the parameters of the pure water, and the fish (and live plants if any) intended. For a Betta, you wouldn't need to add anything, frankly. This fish is designed to live in water with no minerals, and an acidic pH. The generations of commercially-raised fish make it somewhat adaptable, but in the end its inherent needs are low.

Byron.

 

[IrishMom]

First, water softeners that use salt are not good for fish, so I would find another water source. If you are only concerned with a single Betta, the onus of RO water (bought or if you get a RO unit as mentioned earlier) willnot be as much as it would for a 100 gallon tank of something. The other thing is, can you use the water before it goes through the softener, and what is it like (parameters, etc)?

Second point, you need to kow the GH and KH of the water before you can even begin to deal with pH, as they are closely related. The GH is the level of dissolved hard minerals (calcium and magnesium) in the water, and the KH (carbonate hardness or Alkalinity) is bicarbonate hardness that "buffers" pH to prevent fluctuations. Attempts to lower the pH if the GH/KH are moderate or high will not have much success. Organics (wood, leaves, peat) will be temporary at best, if they have much effect at all, when the KH especially is high.

To your last question, what to add to "pure" water...this depends upoon the parameters of the pure water, and the fish (and live plants if any) intended. For a Betta, you wouldn't need to add anything, frankly. This fish is designed to live in water with no minerals, and an acidic pH. The generations of commercially-raised fish make it somewhat adaptable, but in the end its inherent needs are low.

Byron.

Thank you so much. I am not sure I have a way to get water before it goes through the softener. I would have to investigate. My local fish store had assured me it wouldn't be a problem. Shows what they know - eyeroll.

Anyway, long story short, Petco staff and literature suggest spring water for bettas. So I have decided to give it a try with 100% spring water (I can easily keep to the same brand as Ozarka is readily available).

So fingers crossed. It's only $1.09 a gallon. So if I do a weekly 20% water change, not very expensive at all.

 

[Byron]

Thank you so much. I am not sure I have a way to get water before it goes through the softener. I would have to investigate. My local fish store had assured me it wouldn't be a problem. Shows what they know - eyeroll.

Anyway, long story short, Petco staff and literature suggest spring water for bettas. So I have decided to give it a try with 100% spring water (I can easily keep to the same brand as Ozarka is readily available).

So fingers crossed. It's only $1.09 a gallon. So if I do a weekly 20% water change, not very expensive at all.

In a small tank with the Betta, that would work. Make sure you find out what if anything is in the "spring water" before using it. Some of these might have minerals, and you are back where you started.

Fish stores sadly are not always the best source of reliable information. There are exceptions, but not all. The benefit of a forum like this one is that you have many knowledgeable members, and even if one of us says something that is not quite right, the others can jump in and we all learn together.

Byron.

 

[thrujenseyes]

Thank you so much. I am not sure I have a way to get water before it goes through the softener. I would have to investigate

Byron helped me figure very similar situations out with my water and I discovered that I have a large tank in the basement that has "taps" on the top that I can shut off to bypass the tank that holds the water softener. This way the water is coming straight from the Well. I can take a picture of it later and post it if you need help identifying what it may look like.

Make sure you find out what if anything is in the "spring water" before using it

I use to buy RO at my local fish store but since it's an hour away, I've just been purchasing distilled water which you can get very cheap. It's much easier!

 

[IrishMom]

Byron helped me figure very similar situations out with my water and I discovered that I have a large tank in the basement that has "taps" on the top that I can shut off to bypass the tank that holds the water softener. This way the water is coming straight from the Well. I can take a picture of it later and post it if you need help identifying what it may look like.

Thanks! I'll check it out. Would be good to know for my houseplants also.

 

[IrishMom]

Well I researched Ozarka yesterday which seems to be all water with nothing added according to their literature. Replaced most of the tank water with it (still treated with a Prime). Tested water quality over a few hours and all looked good. Might just stick with this if it stays working well. Got a new betta yesterday. Acclimated him over several hours. He now seems happy, eating well, blowing a nice bubble nest. Exploring everything. Nerite has been more active too - doing a nice job on algae.

Had to turn off pump as it is still too strong for him though. Is it best to just leave it off or try to slow it down even more with more holes punched in line?

Water still tested great this morning as well. I do have 6 live plants now.

 

[Byron]

Had to turn off pump as it is still too strong for him though. Is it best to just leave it off or try to slow it down even more with more holes punched in line?

Water still tested great this morning as well. I do have 6 live plants now.

A 5 gallon tank with just the Betta (and snails, no issue there) should be fine without a filter. Especially with floating plants which you want for Betta anyway. Be regular with a 50% partial water change (weekly), don't overfeed, and all should be well. I've run small tanks (10g) with no filter.

 

[thrujenseyes]

Well I researched Ozarka yesterday which seems to be all water with nothing added according to their literature. Replaced most of the tank water with it (still treated with a Prime). Tested water quality over a few hours and all looked good. Might just stick with this if it stays working well. Got a new betta yesterday. Acclimated him over several hours. He now seems happy, eating well, blowing a nice bubble nest. Exploring everything. Nerite has been more active too - doing a nice job on algae.

Had to turn off pump as it is still too strong for him though. Is it best to just leave it off or try to slow it down even more with more holes punched in line?

Water still tested great this morning as well. I do have 6 live plants now.

Oh that's great! Easy solution!
I'm not sure about this so maybe someone else can help...but since there are no minerals in the water (fine for the beta) the snails shell might suffer? If this is the case I believe I read in here somewhere that they have calcium blocks you can feed them.

 

[IrishMom]

Ok I'm doing semi well, but have one last lingering issue. The water is about 7.2 in the Ozarka bottles. Something is raising the pH of the water inside the tank. As I've done several water changes and the tank is still around 8.4. I took plastic plants out.

I have 6 live plants. I've tried taking the submarine out.

So I am left with too many plants, the gravel, carbon or bio filter media. Any ideas what the most likely culprit would be?

 

[Byron]

Ok I'm doing semi well, but have one last lingering issue. The water is about 7.2 in the Ozarka bottles. Something is raising the pH of the water inside the tank. As I've done several water changes and the tank is still around 8.4. I took plastic plants out.

I have 6 live plants. I've tried taking the submarine out.

So I am left with too many plants, the gravel, carbon or bio filter media. Any ideas what the most likely culprit would be?

Not plants, definitely. Not carbon. Possibly the filter media, but not too likely. Most likely is the gravel if it is calcareous--do you know the type of rock it is made from (might say on the bag, or if you know the brand, check their online site)?

 

[IrishMom]

Not plants, definitely. Not carbon. Possibly the filter media, but not too likely. Most likely is the gravel if it is calcareous--do you know the type of rock it is made from (might say on the bag, or if you know the brand, check their online site)?

Thanks Byron. It's just Tetra glofish gravel. They don't have any info on their website regarding what it is. So I guess I'll just replace it and go from there. Hope I don't start a nitrogen cycle when I remove it!!

 

[GobyMaster11276]

Make sure to remove the sediment from the new gravel before adding it. Replacing it shouldn't restart the cycle. The tank might look better with driftwood instead of the submarine, but that's just my opinion. If you like it, keep it in by all means. I have got a few questions as well. What type of light do you have? Does the tank have a lid (sorry, couldn't tell from the images)?

 

[IrishMom]

Make sure to remove the sediment from the new gravel before adding it. The tank might look better with driftwood instead of the submarine, but that's just my opinion. If you like it, keep it in by all means. I have got one question though. What type of light do you have?

Ok, I will thanks. Trying to research gravel now.

It is the Fluval Spec V light, LED. My kiddo loves the submarine and the betta seems to as well. I do need something tall for the tank obviously now that I've removed the fake plants it looks terrible. So I'll see if I can find some decent driftwood or taller live plants.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

Ok, cool. One more thing. Make sure to siphon your gravel regularly as well (assuming you decided not to use the filter).