UPDATE....Lost 5 Tetras

[rdd1952]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this or not. It's really not an emergency now and it really doesn't apply to just tetras. Actually just a general question since the damage is already done.

I currently have a problem with brown algae in my 29 gallon tank. Last night I did a 50% water change and vacuumed most of the algae off and cleaned up the bottom. I replaced water with water of same temp or at least within a few tenths of a degree (digital thermometer). I fed them and turned out the light. When I got up this morning, all 5 of my red-eye tetras were either dead or dying. One was dead and the other 4 were floating and barely breathing. Everyone else (5 serpae tetras, 5 pristellas, 5 corys, 2 otos, 2 ghost shrimp) was fine.

I set up a quick hospital tank (actually a 5 gallon bucket with heater and filter from a newly cycled 2.5 gallon) for the 4 that were still alive but I really don't expect them to be alive when I get home from work. I mainly did this to keep the other fish from eating them after they die. I inspected the one that was completely dead very well and there was no sign of any problems.

The water parameters did not change from before to after other than the pH may have gone up about .2 from before (6.4 before WC to 6.6 this morning). That happens almost everytime I do a water change since my pH of the tanks seems to drop slightly over time from what the tap water is. Ammonia and nitrite both still at 0. Any idea what may have gone wrong and why it would have only affected the red eye tetras?

 

[bartender_in_ny]

DID U TREAT YOUR TAP WATER? SOME TAPS HAVE CLORINE IN IT, I USE THE DROPS CALED START RITE 10 DROPS TO ONE GALLON

 

[Ferris]

Were the red eye tetras new or newish to the tank? It seems strange that it was only them affected and your water params are obviously ok. Can't see the very slight ph change making any difference and i'm guessing you did use dechlorinator, right?

 

[rdd1952]

I dechlorinate with Stress Coat.

 

[rdd1952]

Were the red eye tetras new or newish to the tank? It seems strange that it was only them affected and your water params are obviously ok. Can't see the very slight ph change making any difference and i'm guessing you did use dechlorinator, right?

They have been in the tank since late December, actually the first fish we bought so they were well established. All fish have been in for almost 2 months. I used Stres Coat to dechlorinate.

 

[pendragon]

That is very strange. Red-Eyes are very, very hardy. I've seen Red-Eyes survive beginner "oops"es that killed off everything in the tank but them. I should think that any water parameter change severe enough to kill Red-Eyes would likely have already done in your corys, ottos and ghost shrimp. Red-Eyes are just plain tough.

Your pH is awfully low. Has it always been that low?

I would move them to your hospital tank for care and isolation and just see what happens. Maybe they have a sickness the other fish don't have. I know it sounds unlikely, but it's awfully hard for me to believe it's a water parameter thing if your other fish are all fine.

pendragon!

 

[rdd1952]

That is very strange. Red-Eyes are very, very hardy. I've seen Red-Eyes survive beginner "oops"es that killed off everything in the tank but them. I should think that any water parameter change severe enough to kill Red-Eyes would likely have already done in your corys, ottos and ghost shrimp. Red-Eyes are just plain tough.

Your pH is awfully low. Has it always been that low?

I would move them to your hospital tank for care and isolation and just see what happens. Maybe they have a sickness the other fish don't have. I know it sounds unlikely, but it's awfully hard for me to believe it's a water parameter thing if your other fish are all fine.

pendragon!

The red-eyes along with the serpaes (3 each to start with, other 2 of each added a week or so later) were basically what we cycled with so they are definitely hardy.

As for my pH, it is low. My tap pH is about 6.8 to 7.0 but I have no buffering capacity (KH = 1 degree). My pH usually levels out around 6.4 to 6.6 in the tanks but seems to hav been going a little lower of late. I don't have a clue what could cause that. I'm not doing anything different other than that I have added plants which should actually raise the pH if anything since there would be more oxygen in the water. I am NOT using CO2 because of my low pH/KH. I have considered using crushed coral to raise the pH or baking soda to add buffering but haven'y yet since I really don't want to start messing with the pH since the fish can all handle the lower pH. Even with this, I still haven't had any problems in the past.

I took the red eyes out and put them in the hospital tank but I don't think it matters. They were only barely alive so I don't really expect to find them alive when I get home. I just didn't want them to get eaten by the other fish after they finally did pass on.

 

[Ferris]

Stress coat is good stuff so no problem there and your ph is not an issue, its slightly below neutral, which is fine. They are hardy fish so this is really strange, no signs of disease, other fish are ok (thank god), water seems fine.......hmm you've got me stumped....i'll think about it some more.

 

[rdd1952]

Thanks for everyone's help. If there was a problem, I can't believe the otos and shrimp lived through it and the tetras didn't. I've lost otos in perfect water before.

One of the otos even ended up out of water for probably 15 to 20 minutes last night and he's fine. I had used a lettuce clip to feed them a cucumber the day before and had not removed the clip. It was hanging on the top, inside of the tank all during the water change. When I got ready to refill the tank, I took the clip off and pinched it open to see it there was any of the cucumber left that I couldn't see. To my surprise there wasn't any cucumber but there was an oto which I probably partially mashed a little in opening the clip. I stuck it down in the water and gently shook him free. He was swimming around this morning just like nothing had happened.

 

[rdd1952]

Just a quick update. I came home to find that all 4 of the red-eyes that were still barely alive this morning were indeed dead this afternoon. I pretty much knew that would be the case as they were only barely moving this morning. On a more positive note, all of the other fish in the 29 gallon are still fine - eating, swimming and playing just like normal. I am still at a total lose as to what would kill all 5 red eye tetras and not harm the other fish and shrimp at all.

 

[Ferris]

Sorry to hear that rdd1952 . Hopefully though this could be the end of it and the other fish will be OK .

 

[smiley]

I lost 3 lemon tetras in sort of the same way when i converted to an external filter, and the last remaining one is all on his/her lonesome but doin well! Lemon tetras are easy to keep cos there colour talks to you so u know how they are.

 

[pendragon]

I'm sorry you lost them. But I'm at a loss too for explanation. It just doesn't make sense. Hopefully everything continues fine from here on.

pendragon!

 

[rdd1952]

Here's a further update:

As I said, everything was fine yesterday. I got up this morning and everyone was still in fine. I fed them flakes as usual and everyone ate like normal. My wife got up and we looked at the tank and talked about what had happened to the red eyes. I went in the other room to get ready. I walked back in the living room about 10 to 15 minutes later and just glanced back at the tank. To my surprise, one of the serpae tetras was near the top, on his side and really struggling.

Since I was already running late for work, I didn't have time to do much other than scoop him up and put him into an empty 2.5 gallon tank that had just finished cycling. I had just checked the parameters on it about 30 minutes earlier so I knew the water was good. I added some melafix as that was all I had. He got quite a bit more active once I put him in but still wasn't really swimming. He was still mainly on his side. I guess the difference in the water was the reason for that.

Simply because of his condition, I don't expect him to be alive when I get home but really didn't know what else to do. Yesterday, I looked the red eyes over really good and I checked this one too. There are no signs of injury or disease. I have also examined the other fish really well and don't see any problems. Now I am terrified that I'm going to lose all my fish. I don't know what to do with them. I guess I'll just leave the tank alone for a few days and hope for the best.

As a side note, what can be done when a fish so suddenly changes like that? I would like to know if there was anything that I should have done or could have done. Also, when they're in that condition, is it better to euthanize them or do as I did and isolate them, hoping they make it through the day? I don't want to kill them if there is a chance they will survive but I also hate for them to suffer through the slow death too.

 

[rdd1952]

Quite to my surprise and joy, my serpae was simming around the 2.5 gallon tank when I got home as if nothing had every happened. I don't know how he made it but glad he did. Everyone in the 29 gallon tank is also doing fine. I am at a lose as to what happened to him so quickly this morning. I just checked all parameters in both the tank he came from (29 gallon) and the 2.5 he is now in.

ammonia and nitrite = 0 in both tanks
nitrate = 0 in 2.5 gallon (has 2 plants) and 10 ppm in 29 gallon
pH = 6.8 in 29 gallon and 6.0 in 2.5 gallon

The small tanks seem to always drop a lot more from the tap water pH than the big tanks. In any case, should I leave him there for a while or go ahead and move him back to the 29 gallon? I know that I would have to acclimate him to adjust to the pH change if I move him. I hate for him to be in that tank by himself but want to do what's best.