Tropical & Coldwater Mix

[Zeoth]

i've got a 35 gal aquarium with 3 Harlequin Rasboras, 2 Honey Gourami, 2 Bolivian Rams andd 2 Goldfish and 1 Golden Mystery Snail. Now I've been reading alot that you shouldn't mix tropical and coldwater fish.(I found this out after I started the adding the fish). I've had these fish togeather for over a year now and there hasn't been a single problem. (Aside from the ich outbreak when I started the tank). The goldfish are active as ever and they get along fine with the other fish. The only agression that's been going in the tank are the 2 Male Bolivs. Not anything seriouse. Just a little nip on the fin occasionaly.. So why is theren so much negative thought on not mixing these fish togeather. Any information accepted!

Temp:77(farenhiet)
Ph:7.1

EDIT: Would gladly give the goldfish away if there is anything that harms them.

 

[Teelie]

Coldwater fish generally produce a lot more waste (mostly in the form of ammonia in urine) and don't tolerate warmer water as well. They can live in it but not necessarily thrive. It's like taking a Malamute (think large Alaskan Huskie) that is bred for living in freezing temperatures and sending him to the Bahamas to live. Sure, he might be able to live there but he'd be miserable and constantly needing to be treated for heat exhaustion.

 

[keepsfalling]

Well firstly; 2 goldfish need about 30 gallons (correct me if I'm wrong) on their own to be comfortable (unless you're doing water changes like every half hour) and secondly; goldfish will not live anywhere near as long in tropical water and tropical fish won't live anywhere near as long in cold water.

It's like saying human's can live in the sea and fish can live on land, but not quite as extreme. You may not see any effects for a while, but you're fish almost certainly won't live as long as they should; IMO anyways.

EDIT: Teelie obviously posted whilst I was writing mine (darn your quick replies!!)

 

[Zeoth]

I see...

 

[Tessla]

What sort of goldfish? If you've got fancies, 35 gallons is cutting it a bit close (but would be doable with lots of maintainence) just for the two of them. If those are commons, comets or shubunkins they need a much larger tank! I personally wouldn't go under 55 gallons for any goldfish as they're heavy polluters.

The only problem with that tank is the goldfish, and not because of the temperature, though that's a long term problem for them as well. Goldfish are very long lived, 20 years at the very least for a fancy and more like 30-40 for others, so when talking long term problems with them, we're looking at years, not months. They get big (fast growers too) and are very messy which will pollute your water very quickly and won't be good for any of the fish in there. Note that while goldfish can and should get big, they are also easily stunted in small tanks that promote poor water conditions. If they aren't very big after a year you've definitley got water quality issues in there affecting your goldfish and all of your other fish. On top of that, you're very overstocked for such a small tank, if you take out the goldfish you'll have a reasonable stocking level.

 

[Zeoth]

What sort of goldfish? If you've got fancies, 35 gallons is cutting it a bit close (but would be doable with lots of maintainence) just for the two of them. If those are commons, comets or shubunkins they need a much larger tank! I personally wouldn't go under 55 gallons for any goldfish as they're heavy polluters.

The only problem with that tank is the goldfish, and not because of the temperature, though that's a long term problem for them as well. Goldfish are very long lived, 20 years at the very least for a fancy and more like 30-40 for others, so when talking long term problems with them, we're looking at years, not months. They get big (fast growers too) and are very messy which will pollute your water very quickly and won't be good for any of the fish in there. Note that while goldfish can and should get big, they are also easily stunted in small tanks that promote poor water conditions. If they aren't very big after a year you've definitley got water quality issues in there affecting your goldfish and all of your other fish. On top of that, you're very overstocked for such a small tank, if you take out the goldfish you'll have a reasonable stocking level.

I've got fantails. . I always use to think that as long as they are swimming they are ok. Now I realize how unhappy they are. I'll move them on to a better place.Thanks for the advice

 

[rdd1952]

Goldfish can easily adapt to a temp of 77. They live in backyard ponds in the south where the summer water temps can easily reach the mid 80s (and the 40s or lower in the winter). They are extremely hardy. Having said that, as already mentioned, 35 gallons is actually not even large enough for the 2 goldfish alone. General rule of thumb I have always used is 30 gallon for the first goldy and another 10 gallons for each additional goldy. They may be fine now but can grow to over a foot long.

 

[SamUK]

i read the warmer water speeds up there digestion which isnt too good for them.


its meant to shorten there life span too.

 

[kpintheshed]

agreed

Coldwater fish generally produce a lot more waste (mostly in the form of ammonia in urine) and don't tolerate warmer water as well. They can live in it but not necessarily thrive. It's like taking a Malamute (think large Alaskan Huskie) that is bred for living in freezing temperatures and sending him to the Bahamas to live. Sure, he might be able to live there but he'd be miserable and constantly needing to be treated for heat exhaustion.

agrred

 

[NoRp]

am i missing something gold fish are usaly kept like 3 in a 2 gallon bowl as in kpins sig.?
the main place ppl start of keeping fish is like that lol what did i miss?

 

[mommyof2bettas]

yes that's why IMO goldfish are the most misunderstood fish. They actually grow very big, can live for 30 years and more, and need a minimum 20 gallons + 10 gallons for each additional goldfish.

 

[Rex740]

I combine tropical and cold-water also and i dont have any problems. I have dojo loaches with my tropical fish.

 

[mommyof2bettas]

dojo loaches don't need cold water as much as goldfish do. And you might not see any problems but the fish will probably have a shorter lifespan and won't thrive in tropical water like it would in coldwater

 

[DevUK]

Point is, why risk it?

Coldwater fish live in cold water. Tropical live in tropical water. Theres no reason to mix them other than for your own gratification which doesn't necessarily take into account the welfare of the fish.

After a short google search I came up with this quote which seems to get the point across:

Your goldifsh's temperature should never rise above 73° Fahrenheit, and ideally should remain between 65° and 68,° so you will need a thermometer. Keeping a goldfish above 72° for long periods of time will result in Oxygen deprivation, which can cause nerve damage, heart damage, and can seriously hamper the immune system, making them more susceptible to many diseases, from easily treatable Ick to nearly untreatable swim bladder infections.

 

[Tessla]

am i missing something gold fish are usaly kept like 3 in a 2 gallon bowl as in kpins sig.?
the main place ppl start of keeping fish is like that lol what did i miss?

Yes, this is because goldfish stunt easily, are so hardy and have such a long lifespan that most people think they do fine in a bowl. They do "fine" for a few months, maybe a few years, but it's a slow tortured death for the fish. They're very cheap and easy to replace, so most think nothing of replacing thier goldfish every few months.

They're fast growers when you keep them properly, one of my very first tanks when I was younger was an 80 gallon fancy goldfish tank with 4 goldfish and two dojo loaches. They are very heavy polluters, we had several large filters running on the tank and did our water changes but they still made a huge mess, and that's understocking if you go by 30 +10 gallons for each additional fish. (I won one of the goldfish at a fair, he was a comet by the name of Charlie, the usual sort that you see in feeder tanks. Charlie grew from a couple of inches to over a foot long in about a year, most people coming over didn't believe that he was a comet goldfish.) We had them for several years, they spawned every year and we raised a few of the fry from one of the spawns. Spawning fish are happy fish, and I've never heard of goldfish spawning in a bowl. Unfortunately, we ended up losing them all to a swimbladder disorder that took over the tank and since there weren't many good resources on goldfish readily available at the time (remember how goldfish are "supposed" to live in bowls?), we couldn't fix the problem.

Edit: Forgot to mention, dojo loaches aren't actually a coldwater fish but a subtropical species. They prefer the cooler end of tropical temperatures, so they do well in goldfish tanks, which are indoors and don't get nearly as cold as outdoor ponds.