The Impossible Dream

[Rocky998]

A few people will probably know that my favourite fish are Nicaraguan Cichlids, in particular the females. This is because of a female I had for around 2 years who I called Elsie. You might remember her from my old avatar, I have no idea why since I lost her I havent gone back and tried to keep them again, so that is the 'dream'.

View attachment 142867

Bit of a disclaimer upfront this project is a slow burn, I will likely be setting the actual tank up in late December but that is also the big news that Mrs Wills has agreed to my impossible dream of having a 4 foot tank specifically for a female Nicaraguan Cichlid and some friends Since we reached this treaty the concept of the tank has basically lived rent free in my head 60-70% of the time and I wanted a place to start putting these ideas down and I thought it would be good to share with people here and get some opinions on what I want to do.

I'm approaching this tank in a very different way to how I have any other in the past. Usually I want to look at rare, unique, unusual fish and sometimes these fish are not known to be the most colourful, they might be irridescant or spangled or cool behaviour but not in your face screaming colour. And following from the Nicaraguan Cichlid I want everything in this tank to be crazy colourful.

Fish

I often struggle with setting up tanks because of my tapwater, its hard and has around 25ppm of nitrate in it as well as quite high levels of things that cause algae. The hardness often leaves me a bit dispondant because it limits my fish choice without using RO water (which I do have access to now) but its actually pretty good for the centre piece of this tank Nicaraguan Cichlids.

So in my hard water there are 4 obvious groups of fish to look at for a tank like this, Central American Cichlids, Livebearers, Rainbow Fish and Synodontis Catfish. There are a couple of others too but these four groups are basically my plan.

(non of these pics are mine btw just found to illustrate my ideas)

The centrepiece fish will be (hopefully) 3 female Central American Cichlids and I want a Nicaraguan, Salvini and an Electric Blue Jack Dempsey

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I want females because all Central American cichlids can hybridise, Nics and Salvini are easy to sex, female Nics are super obvious, female Salvini get black spots on their gill plates (like this pic) JDs are harder but I'll do my best. I feel these three will work in a big 4 foot all are feisty but kind of in the same way. I think the Salvini has the worst reputation but I have seen them do well in a mixed tank, Nics are bolshy but I think would be able balance and the EBJD is possibly an outlier in that people say the EBs are quite a bit less aggressive than the regular JDs. Also aware of the health issues EBJDs are said to have so I'll be really careful on where I get one from to make sure I get the best chance.

Schooling fish will be Rainbow Fish, I'm really undecided on which species but I think it will be one of these three. All have their advantages and disadvantages but I feel all of them would be viable. The choices are Bosmani (which would look great with the cichlids and are a real wow fish especially some of the strains available now but the school would be smaller) Dwarf Neon (which would allow a bigger school but I've only seen really sickly ones recently) Kamaka (really nice Rainbow but quite rare, they stay smaller too so would be a bigger school than the Bosmani but would I ever be able to buy them?).


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Up towards the surface I'm mainly looking at livebearers. I think Platies will be ok and I really like the bright colours (I said I'm not looking for super rare lol) and Swordtails would def work, of either species I'd look at the sunsets, red wags and kohakus. To go with them as well I'm thinking of some Golden Wonder Killis who also match my criteria, bright colours and also do well in my water.

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Then down at the bottom, while giving the cichlids as much space as possible I want some of the black and white Synodontis species like Polli and Multipunctatus. While not a bright colour the white scales are so white they are bright in their own right so I think would look good with the others in here. I'm also tempted by some of the other Synos like Angelicus or the Pyjama ones which have a great pattern too.

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I may also add in some Bristlenose Plecs to help keep ontop of algae, maybe some snails in there too I don't think any of the fish I'm thinking of would be a threat?

Equipment

I'm hoping to go for a 4x2x2 120 gallon tank, it will be rimless but I want black silicone and I'll be using a jump guard with clear netting this time as the black I have on my current tank is a bit distracting from the tank. Its going to be custom made as I want the stand to match my 100 litre which will be in the same room and the manufacurer has gone now but the custom people seem to be able to use the same bronze stone laminate I have on the 100 litre.

I think the tank is going to have a 3D background with a rocky effect. The one I want is super expensive and I'm trying to decide if I want to go with the silicone one or if I should just buy aquascaping rock and do it myself? Keep it natural?

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Substrate will be sand, but if I go with the 3D background I'll get one of the rubber floor mats too so the sand might not be super thick but also as the cichlids dig the stone effect base would be revealed. Planting I'm undecided on I'd like some of the bigger crinkled Crypts and some Criniums, I'll try and get some moss going on rocks or the 3D background and I also want to do some emmerged plants like Peace Lillys to help with my nitrate issues (from the tap and the messy fish).

For filtration I might go with the Oase Biomaster for the external filter but if I got the 3D background I could hide heaters behind that and go for one of the FX filters? Because of the nitrate in my tap water my plan is to use some chemical filtration in my filters rather than as a prefilter. I'm also trying to learn about nitrate filters which a few people have mentioned to me which uses a trickle system and grows an anaerobic bacteria that converts nitrate to nitrogen which gasses off through the water (I think...)


Like I say this is a really slow burn and I'm a few months away from buying the tank but it feels great to get this down and I'm really looking forward to hear peoples opinions on the plan. I'll update this thread as I start to pull together a shopping list of kit I'm going to get and hopefully someone will find that process useful too.

Wills

Thats a heck of a dream tank!! Makes me want to do the same one! Wish you the best of luck.

 

[Wills]

Whoo, those are 3D backgrounds?!

Wow, that’s stunning, now I understand. Seems those 3D background developers have moved on a lot since last time I looked at them, which was a number of years ago to be fair.

£600+, not cheap, wonder if you can’t make something yourself much cheaper or just go natural. Some beautiful long pieces of wood and style those together, couple hundred quid maybe, as you say use those images as inspiration.

Personal choice though, it’s your tank

And yes, you’ll definitely appreciate a good python hose system or rig up a system where hoses connects to taps and drainage or use decent quality universal pumps, (I use a Eheim universal pump) a real time and backsaver for sure. Using buckets will take you a long time to change 50% of your 120g which is around 220 litres, and buckets tend to be around 10 litres so that’s 22 buckets each way for draining and another 22 for refilling water so you can imagine how much work is involved.

In my old tank I used to use a pump to empty the tank with a pipe through an open window to a drain. Filling it up however meant 4 40 litre builders buckets on dollies and pump that back in. Now though I think I would just pump both ways and maybe syphon substrate to a bucket at the same time?

This photo with the plants is all natural which is probably more amazing? The company that do the 3D backgrounds is aquadecorbackgrounds.com which I think are really good but I've never seen one in real life which puts me off a bit.

To be fair to those I met, basically looking after their hobby well was always the prime concern, with any competition and/or plaudits well down their list of priorities and the fact of their truly beautiful tanks was just a happy by-product. None were out to win prizes, but all practiced what they preached, kept on learning and applying those lessons. Sharing was much more hands-on and personal and I benefitted much from monkey see, monkey do...with me being the ever-so willing monkey.
I agree with you that it'd be interesting to view the many similarly beautiful we see on-line, up close and personal...after the cameras have been put away.

I think a lot of aquascapers with youtube channels only keep tanks set up for 6-12 months mainly so they can make more content. With the contest tanks there are a couple of approaches to keep them long lived, if you use a lot of stem plants likely to only last a year but with mosses and epiphite plants they can last pretty much indefinitely.

Beautiful

I wonder where they source fantastic looking wood like this. Ive been looking for x large pieces for a good while now but cant seem to find any like above.

If yours ends up anything like above Wills you coming to do mine next lol

For my big tank i use a 110litre bin with a submersible pump and hose for W/C's and its the best equipment ive ever purchased. No more buckets and its a pleasure doing maintance now.

​

There are a few places that do the XL wood, Horizon Aquatics and Riverwood Aquatics have pretty good inventory on their websites. Aqua One do a range of them too but yes they are very hard to find lol.

Thats a heck of a dream tank!! Makes me want to do the same one! Wish you the best of luck.

Go for it I've suggested this combo to other people with hard water before.

Wills

 

[Animallover😍]

A few people will probably know that my favourite fish are Nicaraguan Cichlids, in particular the females. This is because of a female I had for around 2 years who I called Elsie. You might remember her from my old avatar, I have no idea why since I lost her I havent gone back and tried to keep them again, so that is the 'dream'.

View attachment 142867

Bit of a disclaimer upfront this project is a slow burn, I will likely be setting the actual tank up in late December but that is also the big news that Mrs Wills has agreed to my impossible dream of having a 4 foot tank specifically for a female Nicaraguan Cichlid and some friends Since we reached this treaty the concept of the tank has basically lived rent free in my head 60-70% of the time and I wanted a place to start putting these ideas down and I thought it would be good to share with people here and get some opinions on what I want to do.

I'm approaching this tank in a very different way to how I have any other in the past. Usually I want to look at rare, unique, unusual fish and sometimes these fish are not known to be the most colourful, they might be irridescant or spangled or cool behaviour but not in your face screaming colour. And following from the Nicaraguan Cichlid I want everything in this tank to be crazy colourful.

Fish

I often struggle with setting up tanks because of my tapwater, its hard and has around 25ppm of nitrate in it as well as quite high levels of things that cause algae. The hardness often leaves me a bit dispondant because it limits my fish choice without using RO water (which I do have access to now) but its actually pretty good for the centre piece of this tank Nicaraguan Cichlids.

So in my hard water there are 4 obvious groups of fish to look at for a tank like this, Central American Cichlids, Livebearers, Rainbow Fish and Synodontis Catfish. There are a couple of others too but these four groups are basically my plan.

(non of these pics are mine btw just found to illustrate my ideas)

The centrepiece fish will be (hopefully) 3 female Central American Cichlids and I want a Nicaraguan, Salvini and an Electric Blue Jack Dempsey

View attachment 142870 View attachment 142871 View attachment 142872

I want females because all Central American cichlids can hybridise, Nics and Salvini are easy to sex, female Nics are super obvious, female Salvini get black spots on their gill plates (like this pic) JDs are harder but I'll do my best. I feel these three will work in a big 4 foot all are feisty but kind of in the same way. I think the Salvini has the worst reputation but I have seen them do well in a mixed tank, Nics are bolshy but I think would be able balance and the EBJD is possibly an outlier in that people say the EBs are quite a bit less aggressive than the regular JDs. Also aware of the health issues EBJDs are said to have so I'll be really careful on where I get one from to make sure I get the best chance.

Schooling fish will be Rainbow Fish, I'm really undecided on which species but I think it will be one of these three. All have their advantages and disadvantages but I feel all of them would be viable. The choices are Bosmani (which would look great with the cichlids and are a real wow fish especially some of the strains available now but the school would be smaller) Dwarf Neon (which would allow a bigger school but I've only seen really sickly ones recently) Kamaka (really nice Rainbow but quite rare, they stay smaller too so would be a bigger school than the Bosmani but would I ever be able to buy them?).


View attachment 142873 View attachment 142874 View attachment 142875

Up towards the surface I'm mainly looking at livebearers. I think Platies will be ok and I really like the bright colours (I said I'm not looking for super rare lol) and Swordtails would def work, of either species I'd look at the sunsets, red wags and kohakus. To go with them as well I'm thinking of some Golden Wonder Killis who also match my criteria, bright colours and also do well in my water.

View attachment 142876 View attachment 142877 View attachment 142878 View attachment 142879

Then down at the bottom, while giving the cichlids as much space as possible I want some of the black and white Synodontis species like Polli and Multipunctatus. While not a bright colour the white scales are so white they are bright in their own right so I think would look good with the others in here. I'm also tempted by some of the other Synos like Angelicus or the Pyjama ones which have a great pattern too.

View attachment 142880 View attachment 142881

I may also add in some Bristlenose Plecs to help keep ontop of algae, maybe some snails in there too I don't think any of the fish I'm thinking of would be a threat?

Equipment

I'm hoping to go for a 4x2x2 120 gallon tank, it will be rimless but I want black silicone and I'll be using a jump guard with clear netting this time as the black I have on my current tank is a bit distracting from the tank. Its going to be custom made as I want the stand to match my 100 litre which will be in the same room and the manufacurer has gone now but the custom people seem to be able to use the same bronze stone laminate I have on the 100 litre.

I think the tank is going to have a 3D background with a rocky effect. The one I want is super expensive and I'm trying to decide if I want to go with the silicone one or if I should just buy aquascaping rock and do it myself? Keep it natural?

View attachment 142882View attachment 142883

Substrate will be sand, but if I go with the 3D background I'll get one of the rubber floor mats too so the sand might not be super thick but also as the cichlids dig the stone effect base would be revealed. Planting I'm undecided on I'd like some of the bigger crinkled Crypts and some Criniums, I'll try and get some moss going on rocks or the 3D background and I also want to do some emmerged plants like Peace Lillys to help with my nitrate issues (from the tap and the messy fish).

For filtration I might go with the Oase Biomaster for the external filter but if I got the 3D background I could hide heaters behind that and go for one of the FX filters? Because of the nitrate in my tap water my plan is to use some chemical filtration in my filters rather than as a prefilter. I'm also trying to learn about nitrate filters which a few people have mentioned to me which uses a trickle system and grows an anaerobic bacteria that converts nitrate to nitrogen which gasses off through the water (I think...)


Like I say this is a really slow burn and I'm a few months away from buying the tank but it feels great to get this down and I'm really looking forward to hear peoples opinions on the plan. I'll update this thread as I start to pull together a shopping list of kit I'm going to get and hopefully someone will find that process useful too.

Wills

Can't wait to see it when it's done!!

 

[Dajuyu]

I love to see The "Dream" in the making ... to me its the journey that matters ...

 

[AquaBarb]

Any update on the dream tank @Wills ?

Have you managed to find a tank to suit your plan?

 

[Rocky998]

This has been on the back of my mind as well! We want updates, pleeeeease!

 

[Wills]

Any update on the dream tank @Wills ?

Have you managed to find a tank to suit your plan?

This has been on the back of my mind as well! We want updates, pleeeeease!

Sorry for no updates, it is because there is nothing really to report. Only thing at this moment is that it looks like that it will be a tank of 300 litres as it will likely be second hand so a common size is most likely. Fore runner for the tank as an Aqua One Aqusys, there have been a few for sale at great prices on Facebook recently. The big hold up is that I don't know where I'm going to put it, there are a few locations I have in mind but one is going through major decoration in late January and the other only works if some life plans work out which should have been in place by now but have gone a bit wibbly wobbly so waiting on this.

I still think about this tank on a near daily basis, it helps keep me sane some days. It is somewhat of an obsession I just hope it lives upto expectations when it is here

Wills

 

[AquaBarb]

Sorry for no updates, it is because there is nothing really to report. Only thing at this moment is that it looks like that it will be a tank of 300 litres as it will likely be second hand so a common size is most likely. Fore runner for the tank as an Aqua One Aqusys, there have been a few for sale at great prices on Facebook recently. The big hold up is that I don't know where I'm going to put it, there are a few locations I have in mind but one is going through major decoration in late January and the other only works if some life plans work out which should have been in place by now but have gone a bit wibbly wobbly so waiting on this.

I still think about this tank on a near daily basis, it helps keep me sane some days. It is somewhat of an obsession I just hope it lives upto expectations when it is here

Wills

If it turns out half as good as your plan sounds im sure it will live upto your expectations and more! I cant wait to see this tanks journey.

Ive been looking into 3d backgrounds again today and watched some scenes of cichlids in their natural habitat to try and get a vision of the style and colour etc i should look for. One of the videos i viewed had a female Salvini protecting her fry (stunning fish). I thought of this tank straight away

A while longer for you to wait but im sure it will be worth it

 

[Wills]

Time for an update as this project has got the green light and I'm now in the process of making real decisions and spending some pennies! As ever on this, a real journal for me and you can just see the inner workings as I plan it.

I think I'm going to go for one of these https://www.aquariums4life.co.uk/aquascape-aquarium-and-cabinets.php The 340 litre one so I get that 4x2 foot print. I was going to go for an AquaOne AquaSys300 but the foot print here is better and it has adjustable feet which will suit my house as the floor (though solid) is a bit wibbly wobbly.

I'm going to go second hand for the filters, there are quite a few FX4s and 6s for sale on Facebook Marketplace and from my past experience with them they will break as soon as the warranty is up so I'll try and find some good ones and save some cash! Though I could just go for a more reliable brand and not have to replace them....

Lighting will be these https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B079LLRQ2Q/?tag=

Which if you've ever seen MD Fishtanks are the ones he uses and my plan is to get a branch of wood to paint and varnish to hang above the tank with 2-3 of these attached to it. Heaters, I may get inline heaters for the filters but I may just get some ehiem ones as I've had these before and they are pretty reliable and simple to use. Infact I've just remembered I may actually have 2 300 watt ones left over from my old tank, I may have given the guy that bought the tank them though so need to check. The other bit of kit I'm going to get is a nitrate filter/reactor as with cichlids and my problematic tapwater this is going to be a solution to the issue alongside the growth of multiple terrestrial plants like Monstera, Peace Lillys etc.

I've been having a chat with some other cichlid people and had quite a few warnings against mixing cichlids in a 75 (though this tank is actually nearly 90) Some of them I think are quite specific on keeping single species tanks which I cant fully get on board with but their words ring in my ears to the point where the Salvini just isnt a good idea. Which leaves me with the Nicaraguan and an EBJD both fish I would love but the Nicaraguan is 100% what this tank is all about.

Right now, tonight, I'm thinking just have one cichlid with all the other fish from the first post and that will be the easiest set up and no drama and after learning the hard way the Nicaraguan would be totally safe with non territorial fish and no one to fight with etc but... it can be done especially in 90 gallons. So the other cichlids that would be on my list would be

- Electric Blue Jack Dempsey (same as before)
- Oscura Heterospila
- Cryptoheros/Amatitlania, few species that I'd think of here like the Nanoluteus, Sajica, few others but not sure...

Or I could push it a bit further and think about a trio of female Nicaraguans. But I worry that would leave me with an alpha female and 2 betas who wouldnt colour up as much. There is evidence from the wild that females are semi-gregarious, to the point where they raise eggs and fry together so could be interesting and I think a 90g would be good for this.

Using the Nicaraguan cichlid as a starting point I have been thinking about how to scape the tank and one thing I'm thinking of doing is theming the tank around Lake Nicaragua, which is a volcanic crater so likely full of Lava Rock. I've found black lava rock which is available from most aquascaping shops and there is a brand called Wio who do really intricate and very black lava rock like this

I'm not going to do the 3D background as they are super expensive, to get the one I want and the floor mat etc it would be around £500 or more and I'd rather buy actual rock and do it myself. There will be huge sections of sand in this tank for the Nicaraguans to dig about in. I cant decide if I want to go dark sand or light, I was thinking if I went light with the big black lava rock it would look kind of ancient like the sand is from far away carried in the flow and the rocks are so permanent theyve been there for years. Either way I want to try and grade the substrate and I've found some good pebbles and substrates to do this with. Some of the tank will be planted with large crypts, valisneria, criniums and possily some penny wort but not 100% on that yet. As mentioned it will have some hanging plants too like Monsterra and Peace Lillys.

These are some videos I've been using as inspiration, as you can see the Central American crater lakes are super sparse and next to no plants - they look almost other worldly. I dont want the thick detritus and algae layers but may grow some simple moss on some rocks to replicate that rippling effect the substrate seems to have.

.

And ofcourse there are already tons of good examples of nicaragua biotopes like these

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81hGi0c1XFg&ab_channel=LeeNuttall
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYB10aIHWcg&t=142s&ab_channel=BiotopeAquarium
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muezKW0oWvs&t=133s&ab_channel=Bordaaquarium

If you've read this far thank you for putting up with my musings, let me know your thoughts

Wills

 

[Rocky998]

So cool! Cant wait to see it all done! Very good idea for an aquarium!

 

[Colin_T]

My concerns about the original fish you wanted are for the rainbowfish and livebearers. Full grown M. boesemani will be too big for a Jack Dempsey to ear but the other rainbows (M. kamaka and M. praecox) would both get eaten and so would any livebearers.

Rainbowfish jump and having a predator in the tank would encourage that. The new tank does not appear to have coverglass and you will probably find the rainbowfish on the floor.

 

[Wills]

My concerns about the original fish you wanted are for the rainbowfish and livebearers. Full grown M. boesemani will be too big for a Jack Dempsey to ear but the other rainbows (M. kamaka and M. praecox) would both get eaten and so would any livebearers.

Rainbowfish jump and having a predator in the tank would encourage that. The new tank does not appear to have coverglass and you will probably find the rainbowfish on the floor.

An other vote for just going with a Nicaraguan. With a single female a 6 inch cichlid shouldnt be an issue and they dont have a reputation for being predatory either. I kept mine with all kinds of fish so I think as long as I go for Swordtails over the Platies I think I should be ok. I dont think the smaller rainbows would be an issue with them either.

Tank is open topped but it will have a jump guard on (metal frame with a net mesh)

Wills

 

[Colin_T]

What about a pr of cichlids with the rainbows and livebearers?
Or don't you want babies?

The Synodontis catfish are from Lake Tanganyika and need hard water with a high pH. They also like to be kept in groups of at least 6.

If you want a blue rainbowfish that is bigger, Melanotaenia lacustris grows to the same size as M. boesemani. However, with the JD and salvini gone, the M. praecox and kamaka should be ok.

 

[Wills]

What about a pr of cichlids with the rainbows and livebearers?
Or don't you want babies?

The Synodontis catfish are from Lake Tanganyika and need hard water with a high pH. They also like to be kept in groups of at least 6.

If you want a blue rainbowfish that is bigger, Melanotaenia lacustris grows to the same size as M. boesemani. However, with the JD and salvini gone, the M. praecox and kamaka should be ok.

I have considered a pair but don’t really want to breed or the risk to the female. But otherwise I think what you’ve said is spot on as usual

I want the Bosemani Rainbows to match the Nicaraguan (blue head yellow body) but the Kubutai would be a nice contrast (yellow head blue body) but I would be able to get a bigger school of something like the Kamaka?

Noted on the numbers and hardness on the Synos too, ph is around 7.4 and hardness is around 15gh. Thats why I've chosen all these fish as they all do well in harder water Do you think I'd be ok with a group of the Synos in a tank with Lava Rock in? I think it can be quite rough and they are semi naked fish so worried it could be too rough? But I have seen it used in a lot of African Cichlid tanks which often feature Synos?

Wills

 

[Colin_T]

I want the Bosemani Rainbows to match the Nicaraguan (blue head yellow body) but the Kubutai would be a nice contrast (yellow head blue body) but I would be able to get a bigger school of something like the Kamaka?

Not sure what you mean?

All Melanotaenia rainbowfish can be kept together and you can have a couple of this and a couple of that. They will all hang out together. The main thing is to try and keep similar sized species.
eg: have a couple of prs of M. boesemani and a couple of prs of Kamaka, or more if you like. The male boesemani will be able to dsiplay to each other and the male kamakas will display to each other. They will probably display to the boesemani too.

-----------------

Do you think I'd be ok with a group of the Synos in a tank with Lava Rock in?

I prefer limestone for Synodontis from Lake Tanganyika. Anything that is sharp or rough could be an injury waiting to happen.