Tell Me What To Do With This Tap Water

[ginaekdal]

I am waiting for my tank to be levelled and I need to swap my gravel for sand before cycling, so in the meantime I decided to test my tap water so I know what parameters I am dealing with when it comes to future stocking.
 
I have the JBL "professional test lab".
 
pH 3 - 10 tested to 6,5 (if leaning, towards 6)
pH 6,0 - 7,6 tested to 6,6 (if leaning, towards 6,4)
 
I did not let the above samples rest for 24 hours. Is pH likely to be much affected by this (up, down)? I am happy to let it sit and retest, but does this initial test give me a good indicator of what I am in fact dealing with?
 
KH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7, 8, and 9 drops. The water sample got a yellow shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart yellow. I never saw a blue tinge at all.
 
GH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7 and 8 drops. The water sample got a green shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart green. I never saw a red tinge at all.
 
I am very new to this. Do the above results look accurate together? What kind of water do I have? How do I convert these measurements to other scales? I want to stock small fish that thrive at these exact parameters, and that will thrive in a 63 litre tank with sand substrate.

 

[Akasha72]

I also have this test kit and it seems to be very accurate. The only test I don't like is the Nitrate - that potash dust stuff won't dissolve no matter how hard to shake the bottle.
 
Looks like you've got soft water. Not a massive tank so how about some harlequins or even the lovely dwarf rasbora's - look up the Kuboti rasbora, they are a lovely bright green, a nice school of those would look stunning.
If your going with sand you could look at some pygmi cories or some of smaller cory types such as panda's  

 

[ginaekdal]

Thank you!
 
As an aside I will test my tap water for ammonia as well as let a pH sample sit until tomorrow before testing again, just to cover all bases. Should I also test it for nitrites and/or nitrates that may be coming out of the tap?
 
My test results have thrown me for a bit of a loop as I originally had my heart set on a species tank with a few male guppies. I haven't looked much at soft water fish until now. I like the M. kubotai (I love green!) and I do believe my LFS are able to order them via their supplier. I also like the look of the small red rasboras (there are a few different types if I got it right?).
 
Would I be able to for example have a shoal of one small species, and a cory species alongside? I would like activity in the whole tank if possible, but I know nothing about bottom-dwelling fish.
 
The only thing I know for sure right now that I have to think again with regards to stocking, is that the smaller the fish the better.

 

[Akasha72]

hi again, yes, there are other types of dwarf rasboras, there is a red one with black spots which is another lovely colourful fish. Your limited a little with a small tank so if you want colour and activity look to the dwarf species.
As to bottom dwellers - with soft water cories are the obvious choice but remember these are social fish and they need to be in a group of their own kind so if you go with pygmy's you'll need to add a minimum of 6. If you were to go with panda's for instance you'd need to add a minimum  of 6 of those. With a smaller tank I'd avoid the larger cory species such as peppered.
In these cases head over to planetcatfish.com and do some research into sizes as there are hundreds of cory types

 

[ginaekdal]

hi again, yes, there are other types of dwarf rasboras, there is a red one with black spots which is another lovely colourful fish. Your limited a little with a small tank so if you want colour and activity look to the dwarf species.
As to bottom dwellers - with soft water cories are the obvious choice but remember these are social fish and they need to be in a group of their own kind so if you go with pygmy's you'll need to add a minimum of 6. If you were to go with panda's for instance you'd need to add a minimum  of 6 of those. With a smaller tank I'd avoid the larger cory species such as peppered.
In these cases head over to planetcatfish.com and do some research into sizes as there are hundreds of cory types

 
Thanks again!
 
I have spent the day nosing around the 'net, bearing in mind I have to look for fish that are 1. compatible with my parameters, 2. compatible with my tank size, 3. available (via order) where I live, and 4. fish I will actually enjoy looking at.
 
So with all of those restrictions in mind, I have compiled a tiny list of fish that fit the criteria.
 
- Microdevario kubotai
- Boraras brigittae
- Corydoras pygmaeus
 
I wonder whether the B. brigittae (via private seller and mail shipment) is easier for me to get than M. kubotai (via special order at the LFS). So ideally I would like either B. brigittae or M. kubotai, with C. pygmaeus living alongside. Does anyone have thoughts on this? Alternatively, is it possible to have both B. brigittae and M. kubotai together (in which case I would probably have to give the C. pygmaeus a miss)? Thoughts on suitable numbers for each species alone or together?
 
A backup stocking plan to the above, is either P. innesi or P. axelrodi depending on which my LFS carries. I am not as keen on these as I am the above species, however, so these are what I will look to if I cannot find the first.
 
The private seller that advertises B. brigittae also sells shrimp, which is something I might look into as a second backup.
 
The downside for me is that I had wanted more different colours (similar to what you get with guppies). I had also wanted fish that I could tell apart... I like to name my pets, however with shoaling species I think this will be too tricky. So as an alternative to go alongside this main tank, I am considering setting up a separate tank for a single male Betta as I see my water parameters should be right. This might give me the colour I am missing from the 63-litre stocking list, as well as a fish to name.
 
And that is about as far as I have gotten now that I am having to think new. Any input on these species will be gratefully received.

 

[Byron]

I am waiting for my tank to be levelled and I need to swap my gravel for sand before cycling, so in the meantime I decided to test my tap water so I know what parameters I am dealing with when it comes to future stocking.
 
I have the JBL "professional test lab".
 
pH 3 - 10 tested to 6,5 (if leaning, towards 6)
pH 6,0 - 7,6 tested to 6,6 (if leaning, towards 6,4)
 
I did not let the above samples rest for 24 hours. Is pH likely to be much affected by this (up, down)? I am happy to let it sit and retest, but does this initial test give me a good indicator of what I am in fact dealing with?
 
KH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7, 8, and 9 drops. The water sample got a yellow shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart yellow. I never saw a blue tinge at all.
 
GH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7 and 8 drops. The water sample got a green shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart green. I never saw a red tinge at all.
 
I am very new to this. Do the above results look accurate together? What kind of water do I have? How do I convert these measurements to other scales? I want to stock small fish that thrive at these exact parameters, and that will thrive in a 63 litre tank with sand substrate.

 
There are some issues here with the tests.
 
First on the GH and KH...I do not know the JBL kit so I cannot comment on the colour differences.  But one quick way to check your results is to have a look at your municipal water authority's dat, probably posted somewhere on their website, or you could ask them directly.  GH is the more important for fish as it refers to the level of hard minerals in the water.  KH can affect fish, but this is more useful when it comes to pH, as the KH acts to buffer the pH so it is unlikely to fluctuate much if at all.
 
Turning to the pH, when testing tap water it is always possible that CO2 will have built up, and this does affect the pH.  You can out-gas the CO2 by letting a glass of water sit for about 24 hours.  This will then give you a more accurate pH.  As you didnot do this previously, and the reading was 6.5 or so, it might turn out to be higher.  You can also see if pH is included in the water data on the website as another check.
 
Ths is well worth doing, because you are mentioning fish that will be wild caught (the rasboras) and require very soft water.
 
Byron.

 

[ginaekdal]

 

I am waiting for my tank to be levelled and I need to swap my gravel for sand before cycling, so in the meantime I decided to test my tap water so I know what parameters I am dealing with when it comes to future stocking.
 
I have the JBL "professional test lab".
 
pH 3 - 10 tested to 6,5 (if leaning, towards 6)
pH 6,0 - 7,6 tested to 6,6 (if leaning, towards 6,4)
 
I did not let the above samples rest for 24 hours. Is pH likely to be much affected by this (up, down)? I am happy to let it sit and retest, but does this initial test give me a good indicator of what I am in fact dealing with?
 
KH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7, 8, and 9 drops. The water sample got a yellow shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart yellow. I never saw a blue tinge at all.
 
GH tested to approx. 8° (German scale). I had difficulties seeing much difference between 7 and 8 drops. The water sample got a green shade from the first drop added, and I worked my way up until it matched the darker chart green. I never saw a red tinge at all.
 
I am very new to this. Do the above results look accurate together? What kind of water do I have? How do I convert these measurements to other scales? I want to stock small fish that thrive at these exact parameters, and that will thrive in a 63 litre tank with sand substrate.

 
There are some issues here with the tests.
 
First on the GH and KH...I do not know the JBL kit so I cannot comment on the colour differences.  But one quick way to check your results is to have a look at your municipal water authority's dat, probably posted somewhere on their website, or you could ask them directly.  GH is the more important for fish as it refers to the level of hard minerals in the water.  KH can affect fish, but this is more useful when it comes to pH, as the KH acts to buffer the pH so it is unlikely to fluctuate much if at all.
 
Turning to the pH, when testing tap water it is always possible that CO2 will have built up, and this does affect the pH.  You can out-gas the CO2 by letting a glass of water sit for about 24 hours.  This will then give you a more accurate pH.  As you didnot do this previously, and the reading was 6.5 or so, it might turn out to be higher.  You can also see if pH is included in the water data on the website as another check.
 
Ths is well worth doing, because you are mentioning fish that will be wild caught (the rasboras) and require very soft water.
 
Byron.
 

 
Thank you!
 
I have a second sample sitting with about three hours to go before I can test pH again. Will be interesting to see what the outcome is.
 
Unfortunately the water supplier here does not have a website, or much of any contact information to go on. I will have to dig to find whoever is in charge. If I can find an email address I might send an enquiry about parameters to double check. I am a little surprised this information is not more readily available here!

 

[Akasha72]

have a look at these 
 
http/www.seriouslyfish.com/species/boraras-brigittae/
 
http/www.seriouslyfish.com/species/microdevario-kubotai/
 
I've never heard of rasbora's being any trouble and I can see no reason why these two couldn't live together, but ... they are a schooling species and you'll see them at their best in large number. I currently have 10 very young rasboras in my quarantine tank and watching them interact and play is great fun. I have 8 or 9 adults in my 4ft tank and I'm looking forward to the day these new one's are large enough to join the others as I'll then be able to watch them schooling and showing natural behaviour.
If it were me I'd choose one of the two and have a large group rather than two smaller groups but that's personal choice.
 
Regarding the cories - as the rasboras are mid to top dwellers having a bottom dweller too is fine. You could go for a large group of pygmy's too. I'd also consider adding some little oto's to nibble away on algae but if you decide to go down that route wait until the tank has got well established as they can starve very easily

 

[Essjay]

You mention using JBL hardness testers, both GH and KH, and adding drops to the water sample. I am not familiar with this brand so I googled it. Their instructions say that these are titration testers.
 
Quote from JBL website

 
This type of test involves measuring certain
water ingredients by adding a test solution in
drops to a sample of water until the added
indicator changes colour. The number of
drops of test solution used in the process provides
information on the quantity of water
ingredients tested.
 

 
In other words you are looking for the change in colour not comparing the colour to a chart.
 
They say that GH turns from red to green; it is the number of drops it takes to change from red to green that gives the GH in German degrees. If yours never showed red and went straight to green, you have virtually no GH in your tap water.
Similarly, the KH test changes from blue to yellow; if yours never showed blue and went straight to yellow, you have virtually no KH.
 
With these tests it is not the strength of the colour that matters, it is the change from one colour to another. When the GH and KH is very low, you only add a drop or two to get the colour change. Because very little reagent is added, the colour will be pale when it changes. It is only water with high GH and KH that take many drops that show the deep colours.
When dealing with water that changes colour at the first, second or third drop it is easier to see the colour by removing the lid, placing the tube on something white and looking down the tube. That extra depth of liquid intensifies the colour.

 

[ginaekdal]

You mention using JBL hardness testers, both GH and KH, and adding drops to the water sample. I am not familiar with this brand so I googled it. Their instructions say that these are titration testers.
 
Quote from JBL website

 
This type of test involves measuring certain
water ingredients by adding a test solution in
drops to a sample of water until the added
indicator changes colour. The number of
drops of test solution used in the process provides
information on the quantity of water
ingredients tested.
 

 
In other words you are looking for the change in colour not comparing the colour to a chart.
 
They say that GH turns from red to green; it is the number of drops it takes to change from red to green that gives the GH in German degrees. If yours never showed red and went straight to green, you have virtually no GH in your tap water.
Similarly, the KH test changes from blue to yellow; if yours never showed blue and went straight to yellow, you have virtually no KH.
 
With these tests it is not the strength of the colour that matters, it is the change from one colour to another. When the GH and KH is very low, you only add a drop or two to get the colour change. Because very little reagent is added, the colour will be pale when it changes. It is only water with high GH and KH that take many drops that show the deep colours.
When dealing with water that changes colour at the first, second or third drop it is easier to see the colour by removing the lid, placing the tube on something white and looking down the tube. That extra depth of liquid intensifies the colour.

 
That's interesting. I was confused by not seeing the first colour to start out with. What are the implications of GH and KH that low? I'll have to run each test again but I am fairly sure there was a tinge after the first drop or two.

 

[Akasha72]

your water is the same as mine. I have virtually no kH or gH and a pH of 6.5. There is a small chance your could see a pH crash but I've never seen one yet and I've been keeping fish in this water for over 5 years now.
 
To be honest soft water gives you so many possibilities. There is far more choice when it comes to fish as there are far more soft water fish than there are hard water. I keep plants with no trouble so no implications there.  

 

[ginaekdal]

your water is the same as mine. I have virtually no kH or gH and a pH of 6.5. There is a small chance your could see a pH crash but I've never seen one yet and I've been keeping fish in this water for over 5 years now.
 
To be honest soft water gives you so many possibilities. There is far more choice when it comes to fish as there are far more soft water fish than there are hard water. I keep plants with no trouble so no implications there.  

 
I will have to read up on it even more now!
 
As far as I can tell all the species already on my list should be suitable in my water if it is as soft as it seems. Everyone (besides the C. pygmaeus at 2° on the German scale) require from 1° and up... I am just relieved I don't have to start looking over again!

 

[ginaekdal]

Alright, so to correct my initial readings, I have done the KH and GH tests again.
 
KH comes out at 1° on the German scale. (I am blind as a bat, but I had it both against a white surface and a white wall and there was definitely a faint yellow tinge straight off; after two drops it was pronounced.)
 
GH comes out as 1° on the German scale. (No doubt about this one, the green was there straight away.)
 
pH has a little while left before I can test again.

 

[Akasha72]

same as mine then. Mine is 1 too
 
I have in my 4ft tank the following fish
 
2 Angelfish
1 laetacara curvicep cichlid
9 harlequin rasbora
9 emperor tetra (nematobrycon palmeri)
7 peppered corydora
6 panda corydora
5 melini corydora
5 bronze corydora
3 smudge-spot corydora
3 otocinclus
3 Siamese algae eaters (the only fish not best in soft water)
2 zebra nerite snails
 
I have many plants - amazon swords, ozelot swords, cryptocoryne, anubias, java fern and a red tigar lotus. All do well

 

[ginaekdal]

same as mine then. Mine is 1 too
 
I have in my 4ft tank the following fish
 
2 Angelfish
1 laetacara curvicep cichlid
9 harlequin rasbora
9 emperor tetra (nematobrycon palmeri)
7 peppered corydora
6 panda corydora
5 melini corydora
5 bronze corydora
3 smudge-spot corydora
3 otocinclus
3 Siamese algae eaters (the only fish not best in soft water)
2 zebra nerite snails
 
I have many plants - amazon swords, ozelot swords, cryptocoryne, anubias, java fern and a red tigar lotus. All do well

 
I am beginning to see the point about having many to choose from with soft water! So great to hear from someone who knows these water values well.
 
Since I won't get the colour spectrum I initially planned I want to go with two species instead for a bit of variety. One shoaling type and one bottom-dweller, I think, bearing in mind I only have the 63-litre.
 
As far as the layout of the tank goes, I will have a sand substrate... then, providing I can find a nice one, I want a piece of wood (preferably smooth, with branches) for the hardscape. Any tips on what type of wood to look for? Finally I would love a few plants that aren't too tricky to maintain, and that the fish will thrive with. Again I will have to order most online as my LFS carries exactly one type of plant!