Substrate Query

[Arimus]

As I'm having cory's and Bn Plec's in our new tank I need a nice soft sand substrate - as I'm also planning to have plants it needs to be suitable for plants as well.

The tank is a 270l Juwel delta 300 (now obsolete) and so to buy the usual bags of sand/plant substrate at aquarium stores is going cost an arm and a leg...

Is there any alternative sources of sand and 'soil' I can use safely in a tank?

 

[Arimus]

Would this do for plants?

Just been shopping at Asda and noticed they're selling steralised (ised?ized?) top-soil which is lime-free etc... My thoughts are use that as a base substrate with sand forming a layer above...

 

[Underwurlde]

A few hours ago I wrote this in another thread...

I am experimenting with soil as a substrate at the mo.

Take an equal measure of (by volume):

Top soil dug up out of someone (else's) garden. Sift it if you want.
Westland John Innes No.2 Potting-on Compost.
Sand (large gravelly stuff) - washed.

Cost: less than a fiver.

Mix them all together. Now this is the part i'm testing at the mo: To either boil the mix or soak the mix for a month / 6 weeks. (Boiling looks a winner to be honest).

To use:

Mulm.
1.5" 1:1:1 mix above from above.
Kitchen roll (stops the water clouding!).
1" Sand (the same large gravelly stuff as above, washed).
3" Water.
Plant.
Fill tank.

Andy.

 

[Arimus]

Mix them all together. Now this is the part i'm testing at the mo: To either boil the mix or soak the mix for a month / 6 weeks. (Boiling looks a winner to be honest).

To use:

Mulm.
1.5" 1:1:1 mix above from above.
Kitchen roll (stops the water clouding!).
1" Sand (the same large gravelly stuff as above, washed).
3" Water.
Plant.
Fill tank.

Andy.

Andy, how long do you boil it for? And in the above what's Mulm?

 

[Underwurlde]

Don't have to boil it for long, I did it for 10mins simply simmering away on the lowest heat.

Note, that if you were to just bung soil in your tank you'd get a 6-8 week ammonia spike. The idea of soaking / boiling is to leech out this ammonia. I am currently testing both methods, and boiling definately works...

From my notes:

What is Mulm & how do I get it?
Mulm is Nitrifying bacteria along with its carbon based food source, decayed plant material, fish waste detritus, invertebrates, diatoms, other algae, BGA etc. It is loaded with organic matter, bacteria and fungi, as well as a source of food for them. It can therefore be considered as active living thing and adds precisely what's missing from an established tank to a new one.

Deep Vacuum a substrate, let the water settle in the bucket, the dirt on the bottom? That's Mulm. The dirt in the filter sponge is Mulm. This is the wet "dirt" left on the bottom of a water change bucket after vacuuming the gravel. You wait about 2-5 minutes and pour off the clear water, save the wet soupy stuff left over and add this to the bottom of a new tank setup.

Adding Mulm to the substrate will also help to prevent new tank syndrome – this goes for planted and non-planted tanks.

So mulm is just bacteria and some organic matter. Adding a little peat (not Peat Moss as it is too acidic, try Sphagnum Peat Moss) along with this is good for most planted tank. It is mainly a nice starter culture along with an organic food for the bacteria to eat. New tanks have very little of this type of food for bacteria (they just use the NH4 / NO2 from the fish), however they still need a carbon source (not CO2 but reduced carbon, just like us eating our carbohydrates).

 

[Underwurlde]

Oh, and a 'trick' to prevent (or rather reduce the possibilty) of algae is to tape up the substrate leyer (on the glass on the outside of the tank) - Don't allow light to penetrate the sides of the substrate layer in other words...

Andy

 

[Arimus]

Many many thanks for that

Time to get some soil and sand etc...

 

[dthoffsett]

If you don't want to use the soil, you could always put a layer of laterite in the bottom and then top that with play sand (you can get 50lbs for around $3-$5 at your local garden/hardware center, generally used for kids sand boxes). Just be sure to wash the play sand very well.

 

[darkwolf29a]

Will play sand work for a planted tank? I'm thinking that route myself with my 55. I really don't want gravel in there, if I can avoid it. I'm just not a fan of the look. That stated...I've still always used it. LOL

And I'm wanting quite a few plants in there.

 

[Arimus]

Would I still need to boil the soil mix if the soil is steralised already?

 

[Underwurlde]

Laterite is NOT the same as soil. Soil has so many advantages over Laterite.... Not to mention it is free.

Yes, boil ANY soil, it is not sterilization you are after, you want to get rid of the ammonia....

Play sand capping a soil substrate is cool...

Andy

 

[dthoffsett]

Laterite is NOT the same as soil. Soil has so many advantages over Laterite.... Not to mention it is free.

Yes, boil ANY soil, it is not sterilization you are after, you want to get rid of the ammonia....

Play sand capping a soil substrate is cool...

Andy

I wasn't implying that laterite and soil are the same, I was just suggesting an alternative to soil.

Darkwolf, sand will work with a planted tank, though IMO it's best to put a layer of planting medium (laterite, soil, etc) under a layer of sand.

 

[tegrey2007]

i have juwel rio 400 and i want sand as a substrate but if i bought from lfs it would cost me a fortune what sand can i use for it? it will be an odd ball set up with a few cats no plants.

 

[Underwurlde]

Play sand from Argos. Wash it first.

Andy

 

[dthoffsett]

i have juwel rio 400 and i want sand as a substrate but if i bought from lfs it would cost me a fortune what sand can i use for it? it will be an odd ball set up with a few cats no plants.

There are several different kinds of inexpensive sand you can use. Here's a link on choosing and cleaning sand.
http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=71597