Sick Burmeese Boarder Loach

[RobotDeathSquad]

Tank size: 29 Gal Bowfront
pH: ~6.6
ammonia: .25 ppm
nitrite: less than .5 ppm
nitrate: between 20 & 40 ppm
kH: unknown
gH: unknown
tank temp: 80F

Fish Symptoms (include full description including lesion, color, location, fish behavior):
Lethargic, Hides in tree root all the time, very very skinny looking. Doesn't come out for food. Doesn't act crazy when forced from hiding area. Just lays there.

Volume and Frequency of water changes:
30% once a week.

Chemical Additives or Media in your tank:
None

Tank inhabitants:
4 Platys, 1 Honey Gouramis and 2 other BB Loaches (3 total)

Recent additions to your tank (living or decoration):
All the loaches are new (just over 2 weeks). The other two look GREAT and are very active.

Exposure to chemicals:
New root, so there are some tannins in the water. Other than that, none.

Digital photo (include if possible):
None on hand right now, can provide if needed.


I have no idea how to treat this. There's no spots, there's no sores, etc. He doesn't seem to be swimming funny, although I seem to recall seeing one of the loaches swim funny about 3-4 days ago. Sort of spaz out sideways and flop around for a brief moment.

Anyone have any suggestions?

 

[WILDER]

Bad water quality that why they are ill.
How long has the tank been set up.
Immediate water change, increase aeration in the tank.
The fish that gone skinny is it through not eating, or was he skinny before.

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

Bad water quality that why they are ill.
How long has the tank been set up.
Immediate water change, increase aeration in the tank.
The fish that gone skinny is it through not eating, or was he skinny before.

Well, it seems like he is skinnier, but was more skinny than the others when I bought him.

I will do a 50% water change every day and see if that helps.

The tank has been set up 2 weeks, but all of the gravel in the bottom and the filter media came from a 10 gal that had been up 3-4 months with just 4 platy (and had fully cycled).

 

[mikev]

Rule #1: Do not put Botia's into tanks that are not fully established. Run tanks on dither fish for 1-2 months first.

Do check water, as Wilder said, of course.

Now, your problem may be simply psychological. Some Botia's (including B.Kubotai) need time to adjust in a new tank. They will hide and eat little, and often only when it is dark.

Rule #2: Leave a little food overnight.

They will hide more if you try to force them out of the hiding place.

Rule #3: Don't touch them.

But you want to make sure they are OK, so

Rule #4: Provide only the type of hiding places that are not completely enclosed, so you can see the fish.

Now, to the essentials.

If the fish is skinny (and I have no way of knowing this unless you post a picture -- it may be a normally skinny juv too), it is likely an internal parasite. About 1/4-1/3 of Botia's seem to have them.

Rule #5: DEWORM all loaches the moment they arrive, otherwise you are likely to have problems (and sometimes, big problems) down the road.
Levamisole, Flubendazole, Fenbendazole, these are the drugs to use.

hth

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

So, would it be better to move them to my completely not cycled Hospital tank and give them those Meds or leave them in my almost re-cycled tank and give them the meds?

As far as the tank not being cycled, like I said, it has all the gravel and filter media out of my old tank (now the hospital tank) and was set up for a week with all the other fish and I was showing no ammonia or nitrites, so I assumed it was still cycled. Why, now, 2 weeks after adding the botias I'm getting Ammonia and Nitrites, I'm not sure. I know all loaches are susceptible to bad water, but like I said, I figured I was ok since i was using cycled materials in this new tank.


Thanks for hte info so far. I appreciate it. I really hope I don't lose this guy.

 

[WILDER]

Whats your location as not sure if the worming meds in the states knock the bacteria in the filter.

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

I'm in the us.

 

[WILDER]

Being skinny can be fish is not eating obviously but usually a reason why.
Interal parasites, symtoms, being thin, sunken in belly, bloated belly, red inflamed anus or enlarged, long stringy white poo, bent spine.
Being skinny can also be fish tb.
I would worm the fish if I was you.
Good luck.

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

Well, I think the sick one is on his last legs, so to speak.

He came out after feeding time and is laying on his side just squirming around. He's not reacting to me being near the glass (the 2 others are extremely skidish) and he's only breathing once every 1-2 seconds (seems very slow).

I don't know if you can see how skinny he is in that picture, but here is a picture I took when I first got him (I think this is the same fish):

Thoughts? I'm going out this afternoon to find some anti-parasite medicine. I think the other fish may also have it because I have seen some very white stringy feces from at least 2 other fish.

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

Also, he's definitely lost color, starting at his belly going up to his back (worse at the belly). And it doesn't look like it's on his skin, it looks like it's the skin it's self.

 

[ryan2170]

Yes definatly lost colour!

 

[WILDER]

Internal parasites do alot of damage to the insides of the fish causing bacterial infections, this meaning the parasite med is to late for that fish.
I would definately get the wormer and dose the whole tank.
As for the one in the pic he's in very bad shape might be best to do the kind thing and end his misery, sorry.

 

[mikev]

With loaches, internal parasites are far the most common cause of wasting. TB does happen, but seldom.

By the look of your loach, it is a fairly advanced case, some of the damage may be permanent (if not treated). I'd give it a chance, however, he may recover if treated soon. I've seen bad cases. Quite possible that he will have problems growing (but still lead a normal life).

Generally, anti-parasitic medication are safe to be used in the main tank, do not move the fish unless you also treat with antibiotics (some people do this, I don't).

Treat ALL loaches, not just this fish. It is quite possible the others have the same problem, you just don't see it yet.

I'm going out this afternoon to find some anti-parasite medicine.

Don't get SOME. Get one of the ones I've listed. If the fish is still eating, UltraCarePX may work, it is the only one that may be available in your local fish store. Soak dry blood worms in UltraCare (it is a gel) and feed this to the fish. (or any other dry food). For a several day, make sure that ALL food in the tank is treated==has the med on it.

Good luck.

PS. Wilder is correct that anti-parasite food may fail (but I had very good results with specifically UltraCarePX)... it would be wise to order one of the soluble warmers to back you up. www.flubenol.co.uk will ship to the US, ask them.

 

[RobotDeathSquad]

Thanks for the advice everyone. He's finally given up the ghost and I am off to the LFS to return him (they have a 14 day guarantee and he's only been with me for 10 days) and to pick up the de-worming stuff.

 

[WILDER]

Bless him R.I.P.