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Doggfather

Al Bundy
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I'v decided that my "goal" in fish keeping is to get a marine tank...and a big one hopefully i.e...100+ gal. (In the next 2 years)

Anyway, i'v been following this forum trying to pick a few things up, but i'm stuck!

1) I have no idea what live rock is, and what you use it for!!! (Please don't laugh, i'm being serious!!!)

2)Whats with people drilling holes on the bottom of their tank, and why?

3)how much will the lighting cost you...and how much to you need if you want Corals, etc

4) How do you make a sump?

5) How do you attatch coral, anemones, etc

6) what other equipment is useful and needed!!!, apart from the protein skimmer, tank, heaters, filters, lights, etc.

thanks for your help!!!
 
Well I'm no expert. :D

Anemones like to move around when they feel like it.
I've heard of some people using some sort of glue to attatch them and corals.
Don't know if that's a good idea though.

And people arent laughing- SW is a big colourful step! :D
An awesome goal too! :thumbs:

Oh yeah-

Live Rock is full of living things. You can get all sorts of critters- sometimes good and sometimes bad when you buy it.
It's used to get those possible pretties- and I think (THINK) it will help your overall set up. ( I repeat- I THINK.) :D
 
Live Rock is full of living things. You can get all sorts of critters- sometimes good and sometimes bad when you buy it.
It's used to get those possible pretties- and I think (THINK) it will help your overall set up. ( I repeat- I THINK.)

what do you use it for though??? like a substrate, etc, etc?
 
firstly, live rock is dead coral that has broken of from the reef and has been colonised by algaes, worms, pods (copepods,amphipods etc) even small corals. it does not resemble dead coral by the time it is collected it is that heavily encrusted by other life forms. it is the shipped but due to the wight of the stuff, it is shipped damp toreduce the cost. by doing this 60% of the life on the rock dies in cluding small bits of coral, some algae worms pods etc. this is then put in a large tank at the other end in the lfs. all the dead algae/animals can then rot down and be washed free of the rock and the life that surveved can start to recolonise. it is then safe to add to your tank. when you first setup your tank,you can put it in straight away as there are no fish etc in the tank that would suffer the bad water quality produced by the "die off" when it is newly shipped and there is dead life on the rock, that is "un-cured". once all the life that died during the shipping has died off, then that in now cured rock. only cured rock can be added to an existing system. live rock will provide all the biological filtration that you would need if you have enough of it.

people drill holes in the bottom of the tank so that they can have a sump underneath. (see later) . the water overflows from the tank down a stand pipe going to the surface of the water. the water overflows down the pipe in to the sump tank below. it is then pumped back up to the main tank with a large sump pump.

lighting can cost you as much as you want it to. if you want corals etc in there, then I would go for metal halide lighting which can cost as little as £40 per unit + a bulb @ around £30 from an industrial supplyer. these are called "lowbays". you can go for halides such as the arcadia series 3 which would cost you around 3500 for a double with two blue tubes. the difference is that a lowbay is just a big white box which needt to be mounted on a wooden frame above then tank. an arcadia series 3 can be hung on hanging wires from the roof or from wall brackets and looks like a section of an airoplane wing with 2 big lights on the bottom so it loks much better. heres a pic of a lowbay unit
Image27.gif


and heres an arcadia series 3. (there are a lot of companys that do simular looking lights, some cheaper, some dearer)
metalHadie02.gif


you could also go for T5's if you want a hood on the tank. these don't give the same lighting as halides but you can keep the same corals you could keep with halides. if you do go for halides, the I'd go for 150 watt 10,000K bulbs.

a sump is just another tank below the main aquarium. it has weirs built in to divert the flown in an under-over fasion and you can put most of your equipment in it out of view under the cabinet. some people even have them in the garage and have the pipes through the wall.

heres a baisic pic of a sump but they are variable in there design.

tankraffle2.jpg


this shows the overflown going through the base of thetank with the stand pipes.

anenomys will walk round the tank until they find a place they like and ten normally stay put but can go for a walk from time to time. corals do not move. (some speciese may be able to move a little like fungia SP. but is extreemly rare) corals normaly come on some sort of base normally live rock. you can stich the base on which the coral is attached to to the live rock/ocean rock by usin milliput (2 part epoxy resin) or you can do what a lot of people do and just push then in to a small gap or just rest them on.

as for equipment, you wil need a skimmer pumps to run the sump (if you have one) skimmer chemical filtration biofiltration etc if you go for lots of live rock, then you will just need a couple of large powerheads i the tank to move the water around. a large external filter is also a good idea with some biological media in just to back up the live rock. you will also need a small external to put some rowaphos and maybe some carbon in. rowaphos is a product from D-D aquarium solutions and is probably the best on the market. if you keep your phosphates at 0 or as near to 0 ar you can, then you will have a lot less algae problems. as for a skimmer, i'd go for one by either deltec or aquamedic as these are highly efficient. if you go far a sump, you will still need a skimmer heaters etc but will not need the external filters.

hope this helps answer some of the questions but it is a very broad subject and with sumps for example, there is so much you can do with them it is hard to cover everything.

ste :)
 
Well done in the reply ste2k3!

Some corals do move: Green Star Polyps, Xenia moves like crazy. Some gorgonians are known to cruise around.

Live rock and live sand can provide the bulk of the filtration, but you will want a skimmer for sure. Most of us overstock and overfeed so a skimmer is a good idea.

Since you seem to want corals you will need as much lighting as possible. The live rock will 'house" the corals you buy: you will attach them to your rock structure. Most of us turn into interior designers quickly. At first I just said I'd plop in the rock and put the corals on. HA! I've redecorated at least a dozen times since June. Now I simply reassemble after big tumbles (those are a drag). When getting rock try to get large pieces with pretty shapes, rather than a bunch of small pieces you have to stack. Trust me, it'll be worth it. One day I'll begin slowly replacing my littlish pieces.

Not all live rock is dead coral off of reefs. Many places man-make rocks. Farms@thesea I think they are called actually make rock from limestone I think, then cure it in the ocean off Florida for several years before selling it. Their stuff is supposed to be gorgeous. Me, I'm against buying from suppliers taking it from Fiji, etc, as I don't want to contribute to the raping of the world's coral reefs. You can also buy from someone leaving the hobby, that is usually the best way to get nice rock at a good price and not do any more damage!

I use superglue gel to attach corals, or if that isn't working or I'm attaching inside the tank, I use a product from Home Depot called aquamend. Basically a two-part putty you squeeze into a grey color, that hardens around the surfaces you are trying to attach. What you are after is getting as much of the surface area of your two pieces into contact with each other so that the tissue will naturally bond. Coral tissue attaches to rock, so if you can secure a coral to the rock in any way at all so that it doesn't move, in a few days it will be self-attached. So not a lot of glue or cement is needed, and the less area of the coral covered the better.
 
thanks a heap for all the info you guys!!!

ste2k3, you must have sat typing this for an hour!!!

i just got one last question, how much does electrcity cost for a tank like this per month?
 
are you in the US or Uk or other?. the price will vary form place to place. I'm not quite sure but I remember there was a calculator somewhere for it so i will try and find it.

ste :)
 
found it,

not exactly the same one but does the same job. its in £ so you may have to convert to $ etc

ste :)
 
thanks for all your help...i'm in Australia, btw...i'll try looking one up on goolge, hopefully i can find some...this might be just be a pipe-dream, there are so many choices, i'm lost, lol

btw, ste2k3, how big is your tank?
 
my tank is 120 gallong UK and is 5' long x 15x18 high. I'v always regretted not getting a wider tank. Hopefully maybe able to upgrade in the future.

ste :)
 
Put it this way: I had an electrician wire a new circuit exclusively for my 75G tank (GFI circuit). I wish I had done two circuits...
 
If you dont want to mess around with drilling holes and all that check out the Berlin method, to do this you will need: Lots of live rock, live sand 1 to 2 inches, a good light (coral life makes a nice one), a skimmer, and a few power heads placed about the tank. Load it up with corals, snails, brittle star, hermit crabs, xenia, and a few fish. Do a RO water change, 10% once every 4 to 6 weeks.
Oh, go to your local fish shop and get a cup of the crap at bottom of the live rock tank and put that in it. They will be happy to give it to you and it contains all kinds of life and food for the rest of your tank. Oh, its a good Idea to put a bio filter or one macanical filter on it, say a magnum or aqua clear, or I would be happy to tell you how to use a magnum with a aqua clear filter for an even better system.
If you would like to see my tank, I have high quality photos posted at www.webshots.com do a username search for lewerke1.
Oh, the corals that move around, you can stick the base in the sand and leave it for a few days, it will grab enough of the sand that you can then pull it and place it in a better location, the substraight that it is holding onto will act as a weight to help hold it in place will it gets a better hold on the new location. I have also used rubber bands to help hold them down for a little, dont really like doing that though, the rubber bands can fall apart and the particals can harm other living creatures in the tank.
 
i was actually thinking of a variation of the berlin meathod, about 1 to 1 1/4 pounds of live rock per gallon + Live Sand with a fluval 404 or eheim equivilent running to support it...would that work?
 
How big of a tank do you want to go this with? The rock formula sounds right, dont forget that you will need many filter feeders and carpets if you try this, or the arthopods and what not will take over. I cant remember what the fluval 404 can do in an hour, I like to over power it a little( I think it is a good idea starting out) and also have many power heads going at different levels in the tank, and a power strip that will kick the power heads on and off in random order to simulat natural ocean curent. This prevents dead spots in the tank. All that rock can stop the curents from traveling through the tank.(thats why I have 5 in my tank, and a sixth waiting to go in as I add) I like this method because I can spend my money on things that go in the tank instead of under or behind it. Oh, its always nice to buy a protien skimmer with a built in UV light, I have mine unplugged but if the tank starts to get overtaken or gets ick or something I can plug it in and let it kill some of the drifters off.
 

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