Razers Fishless Cycle!

[razer121]

ok so ive finaly got all my bits and bobs that i need to get my main tank up and running with almost everything added so heres a new picture of it for all to see!

dont worry about the little bits of crap floating about thats because i kept messing around with the filter ###### propeller keeps making loads of noise for no reason! any ideas on this one? how to stop it? it like a chugging sound as if its not propelling its self properly

so.....ive added plants and such from some tanks which have already cycled so im guessing there migh be some good bac going into my tank from these! but now im stuck, everyone keeps talking about adding 5ppm of ammonia, well i would do that if i knew what it ment.....

to clear some stuf up i have a 60L tank with live plants in, a fluval plus2 filter with a heater which i have set to 30 degrees (read this was good for bacteria growth please correct me if im wrong!)

so i think ive givin enough info if needed but if i do need to do anything else or such please leave a message!

btw im using a tetra liquid test kit,

an one last thing....the ammonia im using is "household ammonia" its a 500ml bottle from boots and only cost £1.75p! bargain lol but kids please do NOT sniff it...wow i wont be doing that again in a hurry!! thanks!


DAY 1 24/6/09

ammonia 5ppm

DAY 3 26/6/09

ammonia 0ppm topped back upto 5ppm

going to skip a few days now ive revamped the tank, put sand back in it and added a few plants, will update a picture asap but im going to jump this to day

DAY 9 3/7/09

ive added ammonia up to 5ppm again unsure how i have affected to cycle.....

DAY 10 4/7/09

ok finaly got myself my api test kit!! and here ae my results....

ammonia 0.50mg
nitrate 40
nitrite 5.0
pH 7.6

tested at 10.30am

DAY 11 5/7/09

ammonia 5ppm
ph 8.4

added ammonia at 1pm

DAY 16 10/7/09

ammonia 0.50ppm
nitrites 0.25ppm
nitrAtes 5.0ppm
high range ph 8.0

i need to keep on top of my updates.......sorry about this guys

DAY 17 11/7/09

ammonia 0.00ppm

ammonia raised to 5ppm at 3.28pm.....

DAY 18 12/7/09 time:8.00pm

ammonia 8.00ppm!!!! think the dead fly could be causing this???


DAY 19 13/7/09 time:10.00pm

ammonia 0.50
nitrite 0.00
nitrAte 0.00

DAY 20 14/7/09 time:8.00pm

ammonia 0.15ppm its only just a little bit green
ammonia added at 10pm

DAY 21 15/7/09 time:10.00pm

ammonia 0.50ppm

DAY 22 16/07/09 time:7.00pm

ammonia topped up to 5ppm (was test at 6 and gave a reading of 0ppm)

DAY 24 18/07/09 time 8.00pm

ammonia 0.25ppm
nitrite 0
nitrAte 0

ammonia is going to be topped up at 10.00pm tonight to 5ppm

DAY 25 19/07/09 time 10.20pm

ammonia 0.25ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm
nitrAte 20ppm

DAY 26 20/07/09 time 10.12pm

ammonia 0.15ppm (was very slightly green so i guessed it wasnt .25ppm)
nitrite 2.0ppm
nitrAte 15ppm


DAY 27 21/07/09 time 10.30pm

ammonia 0.00ppm!!!!!! is it normal for this to happen?
nitrite 2.0ppm
nitrAte 10.00ppm

DAY 28 22/07/09 time 10.30pm

ammonia 0.00ppm
nitrite 0
nitrAte 0

DAY 29 23/07/09 time 10.10pm

ammonia 0.00ppm
nitrite 1.0ppm
nitrAte 10.00ppm

DAY 30 24/07/09 time 10.00pm

ammonia 0.25ppm
nitrite 0.25ppm
nitrAte 1.0ppm


DAY 31 25/07/09 time 10.04pm

ammonia 0.00ppm
nitrite 1.0ppm
nitrAte 2.0ppm


DAY 32 26/07/09 time 10.00am ammonia added no test done yet.

ammonia
nitrite
nitrAte

DAY 32 (still!) 26/07/09 time 11.00pm

ammonia 0.50ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm
nitrAte 20ppm

DAY 33 27/07/09 time 6.30am

ammonia 0.00ppm
nitrite 1.0ppm
nitrAte 5ppm


DAY 33 27/07/09 time 6.36pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.25ppm
nitrAte 5.0ppm

DAY 34 28/07/09 time 6.33am

ammonia 0.25ppm (only just looks like 0.25!) ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.0ppm
nitrAte 0.0ppm

DAY 34 28/07/09 time 7.00pm little late on testing on this one...

ammonia 0.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.0ppm
high range PH 8.0

DAY 35 29/07/09 time 6.32am

ammonia 1.0ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 35 29/07/09 time 7.21pm (yes im a little late again...)

ammonia 0.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.25ppm

DAY 36 30/07/09 time 6.30am

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 36 30/07/09 time 6.30pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 37 31/07/09 time 6.28am

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 37 31/07/09 time 6.31pm

ammonia no test done ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite no test done

DAY 38 01/07/09 time 6.30am

ammonia no test done ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite no test done

DAY 38 01/07/09 time 6.30pm

ammonia no test done ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite no test done

DAY 39 02/07/09 time 6.30am

ammonia 0.50ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 39 02/07/09 time 6.33pm

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 40 03/07/09 time 6.19am

ammonia 0.50ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 2.0ppm

DAY 40 03/07/09 time 6.30pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.0ppm

DAY 41 04/07/09 time 6.31am

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.0ppm

DAY 41 04/07/09 time 6.26pm

ammonia 0.50ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.0ppm

DAY 42 05/07/09 time 6.33am

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.50ppm

DAY 42 06/07/09 time 6.40pm

ammonia 0.50ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.00ppm


DAY 43 05/07/09 time 6.29am

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.00ppm

DAY 44 06/07/09

ammonia ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 45 07/07/09 time: 6.40pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 46 08/07/09 time: 6.30am

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 46 08/07/09 time: 6.50pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm

DAY 47 09/07/09 time: 6.46am

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 47 09/07/09 time: 6.30pm

ammonia 0.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 48 10/07/09 time: 6.29am

ammonia 0.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite


DAY 48 10/07/09 time: 6.32pm

ammonia 0.25ppm ammonia NOT topped up to 5ppm
nitrite


DAY 49 11/07/09 time: 6.30am

ammonia 0.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite


DAY 50 12/07/09 time: 6.30am

ammonia 0.50ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite


DAY 51 13/07/09 time: 6.33am

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite

DAY 52 14/07/09 time: 6.29am

ammonia 1.00ppm ammonia topped up to 5ppm
nitrite 0.10ppm wasnt completely blue but also wasnt hitting purple

DAY 51 13/07/09 time: 7.30pm

ammonia 2.00ppm
nitrAte 5.0ppm
nitrite 0.25ppm
ph 6.6

 

[cowboy507]

everyone keeps talking about adding 5ppm of ammonia, well i would do that if i knew what it ment.....

This is what you should add the ammonia up to. when you test the water stats it should read in ppm (i am not familiar with your test kit though, so it might read in something else). you can use the Aquarium calculator at the top of the page to figure out how many mL it will take. it should be around 3 mL though. You will have to test this to get it right, sometimes it will take more, sometimes less.

 

[razer121]

ok thanks next up....

the impeller, how do i stop it making so much noise, is there some kind of lubricante i use in the impeller? or will is it being noisy because its brand new? will this thing hush up over time?? sorry for the questions i sleep near my tank lol

 

[djl08]

try playing about with the height at which the filter sits in the water. I find that mine makes this noise if it is positioned correctly. If its positioned too high it begins to lose its syphon, which is the sound you can hear (if i understand the description correctly).

- Dj -

 

[razer121]

see this is the problem....its not that its to low as i have 2 impellers, tryed the old one and it makes no noise although it does lose a little bit of pressure for some reason, now i dont know what it is thats causing it but OMG its driving me crazy!

and the kits name is, tetra test heres a link to the exsact stuff im using to test my ammonia

http/www.seapets.co.uk/products/aquarium...it-ammonia.html

please help,

 

[waterdrop]

everyone keeps talking about adding 5ppm of ammonia, well i would do that if i knew what it ment.....

This is what you should add the ammonia up to. when you test the water stats it should read in ppm (i am not familiar with your test kit though, so it might read in something else). you can use the Aquarium calculator at the top of the page to figure out how many mL it will take. it should be around 3 mL though. You will have to test this to get it right, sometimes it will take more, sometimes less.

Yes, agree with this. Its better to make your first guess be -less- than you think it should and then test your way up to what seems to be 4ppm (mg/L and ppm are the same for our purposes) or a tiny shade darker. Keep track of how much ammonia you're putting in as your goal is to gradually, these first few times, narrow it down to a pretty accurate amount. You'll be adding this amount lots during your fishless cycle. If the ammonia has dropped to zero ppm at any time during the previous 24 hours, then you add your "5ppm" at your usual time (your "add mark" within the 24 hours.. most people pick a time in the morning or evening when they're likely to be home as their "add mark" or "add point" and it helps later if you can also be home at the time that's 12 hours away from your add point. (I know that sounds confusing, let us know if you don't understand.)

~~waterdrop~~

 

[razer121]

that sounds very confusing im totaly stuck on all this...my impellers making horrendoes noise's for no reason which i cannot seem to solve and this whole ppm thing man its hard

 

[razer121]

ok! so forget my last post, ive decided to just use the old impeller, problem solved minus the small amount of pressure lose...no biggy

anyway, ive added 3ml of ammonia tonight at 11.00 this will be the time i add somewhenever needed i guess, im right in thinking it should be around the same time yes? also tested the water which gave of results of

7.5ph
0 nitrites
0 nitrates

im going to test it all tomoz afternoon with the liquid test kit ive got,

ON a side note i used to use sand but had loads of trouble of mist in my tank, i know think that may have been a bacteria bloom of some sort as the 2 small tanks have the same sand and are fine...how would i go about adding the sand to my tank as it sits now? thanks!

 

[waterdrop]

Sorry, don't know why one impeller would be noisy for you and another not unless the noisy one is somehow broken! Often the plastic blade portion of an impeller is clip-attached to the cylindrical magnet portion and has some limited rotation between the two, so its possible this relationship is somehow broken in the noisy one I suppose. But its kind of a "ya gotta be there" type of problem.

OK I'll give another crack at the "ppm" thing. ppm stands for "parts per million" and we use it as an indication of "concentration." If you have a million green ping-pong balls in a large container and one purple one then you have 1ppm of purple ping-pong ball concentration. One ppm of sugar in your tea would be hard to taste!

Suppose you poured one teaspoon of liquid sugar in a small glass of tea. The tea would probably taste sweet. If you poured this same one teaspoon of liquid sugar into a 100 gallon aquarium full of tea and tasted it, it probably wouldn't taste sweet. The same teaspoon of sugar would be "less concentrated" or "more diluted." OK, still with me?

Unlike a measurement like milliliters (ml) which indicates the volume of one liquid, a "concentration" measurement like "mg/L" or miligrams per liter is designating two substances, a concentration of one sustance that's inside another substance. In our case parts per million is used just like mg/L. Depending on the volume in "ml" of the ammonia we put in a volume of water in "l" (liters) we'll get a "concentration" of the ammonia in the water. The more ammonia we put in the higher the concentration.

Now it just so happens that the volume of water in a tank is hard to know exactly because of the gravel and decorations. The volume of ammonia gas dissolved in the water that's called "household ammonia" or "aqueous ammonia" that we're going to pour into the tank is also hard to know because its volatile and gasses off as soon as we open the household ammonia bottle. So even if the bottle says its, say, 9.5% ammonia, and we think we know our tank is some number of liters, the "ammonia calculator" is still likely to be "off" from reality. This is why we "test up" to get to the real concentration of ammonia in our tank.

So let's say your ammonia bottle says its "9.5%" ammonia and your tank is a 60L tank.. well, if you click on "Aquarium Calculator" at the top of the forum and enter your "60" for the volume in liters, the calculator will tell you to use 3.16 ml of the household ammonia squirted in your 60L tank to bring it up to 5ppm ammonia concentration. Well you could just start by putting in 3 ml of ammonia, doing your liquid ammonia test and seeing if it looks close to 5ppm. But it might be too high, so you might want to start at 2 ml of ammonia and then add another one ml of ammonia if your test comes up a little lower than 5ppm. This might save you having to take out water. Its also possible you'd have to add -more- than 3ml of ammonia to get to what looks on your test like 4ppm or 5ppm, which is what you're aiming for.

Hope this helps a little. You can always come back and read it a couple times when you're actually doing it after the impeller thing is solved.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[razer121]

impeller is sorted now i think you may have posted that at the same time i last posted...roughly, anyhow i kind of understand im letting the ammonia mix for abotu an hour then im going to test it! will post my results in about ten mins from now (maybe 15) thanks!

""edit""

my test kit mesures in mg's, im getting 2mgs, so im totaly unsure what i should be getting in mgs? anyone knwo? thanks!

 

[OldMan47]

Treat the numbers as the same thing. 2 mg/l is the same as 2 ppm for all practical purposes.

 

[cowboy507]

""edit""

my test kit mesures in mg's, im getting 2mgs, so im totaly unsure what i should be getting in mgs? anyone knwo? thanks!

since you are getting 2mgs (or ppm as oldman stated) you will need to add a bit more ammonia. But really any amount of ammonia will work, this gives the bacteria something to feed on and will continue to grow until there is no spare ammonia (which is what you want). cycling it at 5ppm is just a way to insure that you can fully stock your tank once established.

 

[razer121]

oh right i see....well im at work atm so i cant add anymore ammonia lol. would it be safe to add more tonight or should i wait and test at 11 tonight and see what the readings are? thanks!

 

[waterdrop]

Agree, getting it all the way up to 5ppm is only really important near the very end of fishless cycling and that is probably weeks away. Regardless of whether one is fully stocking, a 5ppm fishless cycle helps to ensure a very robust pair of colonies when they drop back to match the given fish stocking load in the tank.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[cowboy507]

. would it be safe to add more tonight or should i wait and test at 11 tonight and see what the readings are? thanks!

I would see what the readings are and if they are still low just add a bit more.