Please Help On Diagnosis...is It Really Whitespot?

[fishyfishface]

Hi,
One of my platys seems to have whitespot but is not responding to treatment at all. She has a white spot on her head, one the size of a sugar grain on her tail and then a couple of small spots of her body. She also seems to have scratched off some of her scales ( I assume rubbing against things from the whitespot). She doesn't seem ill apart from that and is eating well. She hasn't had any new fry in a couple of months though, which is a bit surprising. She lives with a male platy who isn't showing any symptoms.

The trouble is that I have treated her several times with White spot remedy and she's not improved at all.

Is there anything else that it could be? I'm dying to buy some new fish but want the tank to be disease free before I introduce any new ones.

Thanks very much

 

[fishyfishface]

Also I just read somewhere that otos are sensitive to white spot meds...is this true? I have one little oto in there with the platys.

 

[Davo86]

Hi,
whitespot is usually cause by stress so there may be a valid reason why the fish isn't improving,

firstly do you have any water stats?
Also is it just the 1M and 1F platy you have atm? if yes does the Male chase the Female at all?

Also what sized tank do you have and what is the full stocking?
Do any fish show any signs of harassing or bothering the platy?

Also have you already:
turned the temp up to at least 28C,
increased aeration
Removed any carbon from the filter

Lastly what treatment are you using and how long have you been treating for?

 

[Colin_T]

All catfish and loaches are sensitive to certain chemicals. This is due to the fact they are scaleless fishes. Most fish have scales over their body and the scales help prevent chemicals coming in contact with the fish's skin. If the fish doesn't have scales the medication can be absorbed directly through the skin and overdose the fish.
Some medications/ chemicals are more of a problem than others. Things like formalin/ formaldehyde, Malachite green, methylene blue are pretty toxic. Drugs like triple sulpha are quite safe for catfish and can be used at full strength.

White spot & Ich are the same thing, an organism called Ichthyophthiriasis, (ich for short).
Velvet or Oodinium is caused by a parasite called Oodinium.
Whitespot is about 1mm in diameter whereas velvet is about half that size and can have a golden sheen to it. Whitespot is an actual white spot. Marine Oodinium is identified by lots of very small white spots.

Both parasites are treated in the same way.

The best thing you can do is make sure the fish are kept at the correct temperature for the species, about 24-26C for most tropical fishes. Then treat the fish with an appropriate whitespot remedy. Continue treating the tank for about a week after the spots have disappeared.

You can raise the water temperature a few degrees (maximum temp is about 30C), increasing it speeds up the parasite’s lifecycle. This causes it to develop quicker and die off sooner. However, the temp should only be raised after the medication has been added to the tank. If you turn the temp up and don't have medication in the water then the disease organisms grow faster and spread more rapidly, causing more damage to the fish.

Increase aeration/ surface turbulence to maximise the oxygen levels in the tank. Medications and high temperatures reduce the oxygen carrying capacity of the water, so the more surface turbulence the higher the oxygen levels will be.

You don't have to increase or change the temperature to treat the fish. I often leave the temp at about 26C and just treat the fish for about 10-14 days. "Waterlife Protozin" or any medication with copper in, will treat it.

Keep treating the fish for a week after the spots have gone. The whitespot parasite has 3 stages to its lifecycle.
1) the white spots on the fish
2) the spots fall off the fish and the parasite multiplies inside a cyst while it is in the gravel.
3) the cysts in the gravel rupture open releasing thousands of new parasites to re-infect the fish.
The parasite can only be killed during the 3rd stage when they are free swimming and before they attach to a fish.

To work out the volume of water in the tank
measure Length x Width x Height in cm
divide by 1000
equals volume in litres

When measuring the height, measure from the top of the gravel to the top of the water level. If you have big rocks or driftwood in the tank, remove them before measuring the height.

Before you treat the tank do a 50% water change and complete gravel clean. This will reduce the gunk in the tank and allow the medication to work more effectively. It will also lower the pathogen count in the water and mean there are less nasties around to infect the fish.

Remove carbon from the filter before treating otherwise it will absorb the medication out of the water.

Make sure any new water is free of chlorine and has a similar temperature & PH to the tank.

 

[fishyfishface]

Thanks for your replies.

My tank's 15 litres. I have the 2 platys, an oto and a black and white bottom feeder fish (not sure what it's called but you can also get weird albino ones too) and an anorexic guppy which is the last of a batch that all died. I imagine he's a bit lonely but I'm not buying any more guppies as they always seem to die, often with TB symptoms.
I didn't realise when I got the platys that they were different sexes. I'm intending to get 2 more female platys to balance it out as the male does chase the female occasionally. Generally they are very peaceful together though. Or I might take one of them back to the LFS and get all the same sex as I don't want to be inundated with fry I can't look after.

I only have a nitrite test. I check the water regularly and it's fine according to the chart in the pack. I also do a 25% change weekly/fortnightly and have a filter and airpump.

I've been treating the tank with Interpret Anti-whitespot. Its active ingredients are formaldehyde and malachite green oxalate. I think I should stop using it and find another as I don't want to hurt my oto with the formaldehyde. On the packet it says don't use with elephant nose fish but doesnt give a warning for any other sorts of fish....
I'm on the 3rd course of double treatments (you do a dose and then another dose 4 days later). I also gave the gravel a good hoovering to get rid of the nasties. Any recommendations for gravel cleaning and water changes during the whitespot treatment? Should I still do it every week? Will it make the meds less effective if I remove water during treatment?

 

[Colin_T]

Is your tank only 15litres? If so I wouldn't add any more fish because it is too small for more fish.

If you have to do a water change when you are treating fish, you should do it before you add another dose. Basically treat the tank and 4 days later before you add another lots of medication, do a water change and gravel clean, and then re-treat the tank after that water change.

Make sure you don't have any carbon (black granulated substance) in the filter as it will absorb the medication. The medication you have should be fine fro treating whitespot as it has malachite green in. Malachite green will affect catfish if overdosed.
Elephant nose are scaleless fish, like catfish, eels and loaches, and care should be taken when treating a tank with any of these fishes.