Plastic Pollution

[Back in the fold]

Been reading up on plastic pollution lately and it is a very serious problem with no apparent solution . Read the Greenpeace report “Circular Claims Fall Flat Again” on their website . The title refers to the circular recycling symbol on plastic products . Little to no plastic is recycled which I was surprised to find out . According to Greenpeace each US citizen generates 295 pounds of plastic waste yearly . I wondered about that and I started watching my own habits . Fast food and take out meals are almost entirely packaged in plastic . Saran Wrap , toothpaste tubes , milk jugs , peanut butter jars - the list is endless. Is there a solution to this problem ? I have thought about this and the answer I get is a resounding NO ! No political will on the part of our feckless leaders . No will among ourselves because nobody wants to give up anything and you almost can’t because basic necessary foods are all in plastic containers. The oil companies are ramping up production of the petroleum based goo that plastic is made from because electric cars are on the way to cutting into their wallets . Is plastic “pollution” too strong a term ? I don’t think so . The oil companies gave us smog and we might finally be getting a small handle on that but plastic is as ever present as smog . The only solution I see is everybody should have to keep every piece of plastic they buy forever. Good luck with that huh ?

 

[vince82]

We should advocate to switch the subsidies away from oil companies and redirect the same subsidies to industries that make compostable packaging.
The packaging already exists. Several fast food already use them, from cardboard boxes to paper straw and compostable coffee lids.
Problem is that they genrally cost 1 or 2 cents more per unit and it's because of those 1 or 2 cents that companies keep polluting.

Corporations are just profit driven, and profit is the pursuit of short term gain. Make it profitable to use compostable alternative and the problem is solved.
I would do it with subsidies, but you can also do it with carbon tax on plastic.


On the other hand, when plastic is not recycled but just buried in a landfill, that is basically sequestering carbon.
There are worms now that can digest plastic, and companies that work at commercializing these worms. I think their goal is to seed the landfills, but that would put the carbon back in circle.. I can see that as both a good and a bad thing. Unclear.

 

[GaryE]

I reuse a lot of containers in the fishroom, but that just delays their entry into the ecosystem.

I try to avoid plastic or non recyclable or compostable packaging. I do what I can. But one of life's great twists is that it is expensive to drop out, and very few of us are rich.
If you come to my fishroom and I give you fish, they'll be in well cleaned jars, not bags. But then you end up putting the glass into a landfill instead of me. So what is won?

 

[vince82]

If you come to my fishroom and I give you fish, they'll be in well cleaned jars, not bags. But then you end up putting the glass into a landfill instead of me. So what is won?

The plastic bag for the fish was never involved.

I do the same, I use a lot of recycled containers around fish. Also for flowers. My favorite is rice pudding containers to make these cute artemia donuts:

 

[CaptainBarnicles]

Between global warming, plastic, cancer and AI taking over we appear to be doomed

 

[Lcc86]

Plastic has been found at the deepest part of the oceans and the highest mountains (in part thanks to the rubbish mountain left on Everest by tourists). It's incredibly depressing. I try to minimise buying it eg bottled water, but it's impossible to avoid. Had my shopping delivered last night and even though I don't get plastic bags, half the food is wrapped in plastic anyway.

I think plastic can only be recycled about 3 times before it loses its integrity and becomes useless. Better alternatives would be cans or glass but they cost more so companies don't want to use them.

 

[Magnum Man]

Locally here, the biggest change for us, has been the recent switch from aluminum drink packages to plastic… we personally have resisted, but huge bags of aluminum cans has turned into huge bags of plastic bottles… we do turn them in for recycle, but the empty aluminum cans had a monetary value ( you sold them ) the bottles… nothing… we used to have to separate all the recycling, only to watch them dump them in the same compacting truck as the trash… we live on a farm, in the country, and burn our non recycle trash…. The bottles have gotten to be such a big part of the recycle, that I have personally started to think of how to use them… right now I’m thinking of making a mold, to melt them in ( over my trash burn barrel ) to make patio pavers, or some sort of bricks, to make sure they actually get reused

 

[vince82]

Not only: aluminium is recycled. Mining aluminium is a lot more expensive than recycling it, and it does not degrade. Almost all aluminium in circulation is recycled.
So switching from aluminum to plastic is a big mistake, who the hell went for that?

 

[Back in the fold]

Steel rusts , glass is non toxic and aluminum is fully recyclable. If what I know is correct plastic is forever . The problem really comes down to money . Plastic is cheap , lightweight and unbreakable in shipping . The Captains of Industry sure won’t give that up for something that costs more to ship , could break and waste product during shipping and take up more space in shipping. We like cheap things and most people don’t have money to burn so we always get the best price we can .
I‘m doing what I can to recycle , being a bit more careful in what I buy and spreading the word about plastic pollution . That’s all I can do and I hope others are trying as well . Politicians sit on their hands and businessmen sit on their wallets so if there is going to be any revolutionary thinking or action it has to start with the individuals voluntary action . Not to sound overly dramatic but our grandchildren are going to live in a dirty world if we don’t try and if we don’t teach them .

 

[Magnum Man]

... & you didn't list weight... they can put more soda ( weight wise ) on a truck full of plastic bottles than they can with the same product in glass... of course this goes for any product from beverages to canned peaches... at least in the US, shipping is a major portion of the expense in any product

 

[vince82]

All very true but if we all start doing "the right thing" we'd be in a hippie communist commune.
Let's instead just tax the producer. Stop this plastic recycling bull****, since all it ends up being is just bury the plastic in landfills in poorer countries, and tax the producer, never the consumer, for the impact of every single non-compostable or truly recyclable packaging.

 

[Back in the fold]

All very true but if we all start doing "the right thing" we'd be in a hippie communist commune.
Let's instead just tax the producer. Stop this plastic recycling bull****, since all it ends up being is just bury the plastic in landfills in poorer countries, and tax the producer, never the consumer, for the impact of every single non-compostable or truly recyclable packaging.

Tax the producer ? Good luck with that ! You are right about recycling being a bunch of bull . You are also right about poor countries being the target for giant plastic landfills . Read the Greenpeace report on their website if you have the stomach . They list their references and sources of information too in case you think it’s just alarmist sensationalism.
Just as an aside - I wouldn’t mind living in a hippie commune at all and since I’m already a Communist I’m already doing the right thing .

 

[StevenF]

Some plastic is recycled but every time it is the molecular structure changes a bit. Eventually it is no longer usable. Plastic can mixed with water the pressure cooked to quickly convert it to methane than can be used to make new plastic or be used as a fuel. Metals and other elements can be recycled indefinitely since heating them doesn't change them.

Also scientist have found that some plastics and rubbers are consumed by bacteria Wax moths play there eggs in bee hives. The worms then eat the wax. They will also eat polyethylene plastic. Bacteria in the worm convert the plastic to food for the worm. Also styrofoam cups in the ocean due break down to small particles in the ocean which are then consumed by bacteria. The process is slow but eventually the plastic is converted to CO2. Scientist have also found enzymes in these bacteria that do break down plastic.

https://news.northwestern.edu/stori...ium, Comamonas,waste from plants and plastics.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/04/12/...larvae, also,plastic at an unprecedented rate.