Hi there!. A quick question..... I was rather silly and set-up a new tropical tank not realising that I had to let it mature before putting fish in it. When my fish started behaving rather sadly I investigated why. I found that the PH levels were at 8.4! This was not suitable for the type of fish I had in the tank. I reduced the PH to 7.0 slowly, but I have noticed that it keeps increasing again. I lower it and the next day it has increased. I am not sure why this keeps happening. Is it the ammonia levels in the water? They aren't too bad still but still far from perfect. How do I stablise the PH. I don't think it can be very good for the fish if it keeps going up and down. Any advice would be gladly appreciated, thanx!
Ph Levels
- Thread starter Lorna
- Start date
I found this in "Non fish photographs" - moved.
Unless you know what you are doing, adjusting pH is best avoided.
Unless you know what you are doing, adjusting pH is best avoided.
montyII
Fish Fanatic
I'm still a newbie myself so hopefully one of the gurus will reply to you. That said, my pH has been 7.5 ever since I set up my tank, which is a little high for some of my fish but I haven't lost any. Admittedly yours is a fair bit higher.
My understanding is that a stable pH is more important than exactly the correct pH for a particular fish - pH swings distress the fish (but I can't promise that 8.4 is not harmful to your fish).
I think it's preferable to find out why your pH is high rather than using additives to lower it.
Maybe you could have a look at some of the beginner resources on this forum? http
/www.fishforums.net/Beginner-Resouce...ere-t88643.html
My understanding is that a stable pH is more important than exactly the correct pH for a particular fish - pH swings distress the fish (but I can't promise that 8.4 is not harmful to your fish).
I think it's preferable to find out why your pH is high rather than using additives to lower it.
Maybe you could have a look at some of the beginner resources on this forum? http
/www.fishforums.net/Beginner-Resouce...ere-t88643.html
Can you give us some information on your tank?
Size:
Type/number of fish:
How long set up:
Chemicals you're using:
Plants(real or fake)/Decorations:
Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate readings:
Tap water readings for ammonia, nirite, nitrate and pH:
Type substrate:
As mentioned, adjusting pH is very tricky unless it is done by natural means. The best way to naturally lower pH is to add driftwood to the tank, peat moss to your filter or use RO water instead of tap water. The chemicals keep the pH in constant swing as you have seen which is much worse for the fish than a pH that is outside their optimal range. Most fish can adjust to the pH as long as it's stable. The biggest issue with a high pH in a cycling tank with fish is that ammonia becomes more toxic as the pH level rises. So a reading of .5 ppm in a tank with water at 8.4 is much more harmful to fish than the same .5 reading in water that is 6.5.
Unless your pH is that high from the tap, I suspect you have something in the tank that is raising it. Some substrates such as crushed coral and aragonite sand will raise the pH. They are used in cichlid tanks to keep the pH up. Certian types of rocks can also raise the pH. To test any rocks you may have in the tank, put a few drops of vinegar on them. If they fizz, then it will raise the pH.
Size:
Type/number of fish:
How long set up:
Chemicals you're using:
Plants(real or fake)/Decorations:
Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate readings:
Tap water readings for ammonia, nirite, nitrate and pH:
Type substrate:
As mentioned, adjusting pH is very tricky unless it is done by natural means. The best way to naturally lower pH is to add driftwood to the tank, peat moss to your filter or use RO water instead of tap water. The chemicals keep the pH in constant swing as you have seen which is much worse for the fish than a pH that is outside their optimal range. Most fish can adjust to the pH as long as it's stable. The biggest issue with a high pH in a cycling tank with fish is that ammonia becomes more toxic as the pH level rises. So a reading of .5 ppm in a tank with water at 8.4 is much more harmful to fish than the same .5 reading in water that is 6.5.
Unless your pH is that high from the tap, I suspect you have something in the tank that is raising it. Some substrates such as crushed coral and aragonite sand will raise the pH. They are used in cichlid tanks to keep the pH up. Certian types of rocks can also raise the pH. To test any rocks you may have in the tank, put a few drops of vinegar on them. If they fizz, then it will raise the pH.
The tank is 60Litres (15.83 Gallons)
Fish are:
2 platys (male)
3 Clown loaches
5 Tetras.
Like I said before I didn't realise the tank had to cycle so it is only a week old.
Tank: (NOW)
ammonia 5.0ppm
nitrate 10ppm
nitrite 0.50ppm
PH 7.4
(Like I said it managed to peak to 8.4 within 4 days since setting it up)
Tap:
ammonia 0ppm
nitrate 0ppm
nitrite 0ppm
PH 7.4
I have done 1 20% water change so far
All fake plants
Substrate is gravel
The only real thing in there are big pebbles which i bought from the shop
Chemicals used so far are:
API Stress Zyme
API PH down
NUTRAFIN Cycle & Aqua Plus (which I got free with the tank but stopped using these because I ran out).
Filter:
Elite Stingray 15
The tank is aerated well
The fish seem quite happy now since i lowered the PH but the loaches are still stressed out because they have become pale and I don't see them as much as I used to.
Thnx for your response, Lorna.
Fish are:
2 platys (male)
3 Clown loaches
5 Tetras.
Like I said before I didn't realise the tank had to cycle so it is only a week old.
Tank: (NOW)
ammonia 5.0ppm
nitrate 10ppm
nitrite 0.50ppm
PH 7.4
(Like I said it managed to peak to 8.4 within 4 days since setting it up)
Tap:
ammonia 0ppm
nitrate 0ppm
nitrite 0ppm
PH 7.4
I have done 1 20% water change so far
All fake plants
Substrate is gravel
The only real thing in there are big pebbles which i bought from the shop
Chemicals used so far are:
API Stress Zyme
API PH down
NUTRAFIN Cycle & Aqua Plus (which I got free with the tank but stopped using these because I ran out).
Filter:
Elite Stingray 15
The tank is aerated well
The fish seem quite happy now since i lowered the PH but the loaches are still stressed out because they have become pale and I don't see them as much as I used to.
Thnx for your response, Lorna.
No. If the fish you have were bought in the same area as you live, it is likely they have been conditioned to accept the local water parameters. They will never be totally happy, and probably won't live as long as they might otherwise do, but they will do better left alone then having to cope with large pH swings caused by inexpert tampering.
Ammonia will kill quickly, nitrite more slowly. These are your 2 biggest problems right now. You will have to continue doing frequent water changes to try to get your stock over the filter maturing cycle.
Fish struggling against Ammonia and Nitrite will be even more stressed by pH swings.
rsands
Fish Crazy
Do at least a 50% water change straight away (today 
)...that ammonia will kill them in no time. nitrite is also high...water change wil sort this.
Do small 20% water changes daily if the figures rise above .3 for nitrite and approx 1 for ammonia. but with a ph of 8.4 the ammonia will be very toxic at that level.
Let us know the tank readings after you do the water change. remember to de-chlorinate the water
)...that ammonia will kill them in no time. nitrite is also high...water change wil sort this.Do small 20% water changes daily if the figures rise above .3 for nitrite and approx 1 for ammonia. but with a ph of 8.4 the ammonia will be very toxic at that level.
Let us know the tank readings after you do the water change. remember to de-chlorinate the water
What type gravel do you have for a substrate? If your tap pH is 7.4 (which is fine for the fish you have) then something in the tank caused it to go to 8.4 although you say it is back down now. As mentioned, do small 20% water changes as often as needed to get the ammonia back below .5 ppm. You can do 3 or 4 a day if necessary. Doing smaller ones more often is better than one large one, especially if the tank pH and tap pH are considerable different. Also, cut down on how much and how often you feed them. Less food means less waste and less ammonia. Don't use any more of the pH adjuster. Let it settle. If it goes back up to 8.4 then you need to start testing the decorations, rocks etc in you tank to see what is causing the rise.
On a side note, your tank isn't big enough for the clown loaches. I know they are small now but they really need a minimum of 30 gallons no and eventually bigger as they can grow to a foot long. I'm sure the stress they are having is from the high ammonia level more than high pH.
On a side note, your tank isn't big enough for the clown loaches. I know they are small now but they really need a minimum of 30 gallons no and eventually bigger as they can grow to a foot long. I'm sure the stress they are having is from the high ammonia level more than high pH.
The gravel brand is called Roman Gravel made from silica aggregates. Oh yes I know about the clown loaches now when I got them I didn't realise. They are small now so I will have to eventually get another tank for them. thanks for the advice I will give it a go and see what happens.
The gravel shouldn't be the problem then as that particular one doesn't hae an affect on pH. Must be one of the decorations.
I did a water change like suggested also used my gravel vac, sucked up quite a bit of muck.
Does ammonia cause the PH to rise?
I think I am still over feeding the fish too much since they are cold blooded they don't need much food right? How long can they go without being fed, how much should I be feeding them? I don't feed them an awful lot now but there was still lots of food in the gravel.
Does ammonia cause the PH to rise?
I think I am still over feeding the fish too much since they are cold blooded they don't need much food right? How long can they go without being fed, how much should I be feeding them? I don't feed them an awful lot now but there was still lots of food in the gravel.
Christine1014
Fish Crazy
Fish can easily go a few days without being fed. While my tank was cycling, I fed them every other day. My guess is that the Ph fluxuation is a result of the cycle. I've heard people say - and experienced it myself - that the ph goes all over the place until the cycle is complete. One thing I did want to mention, though -- up in one of your earlier responses, you said that you had Aqua Safe, but hadn't replaced it after you ran out. Unless you have well water, or are using bottled, you MUST get some sort of tap water conditioner (make sure it's something that takes care of chlorine AND chloramine) and use it when you do the water changes. Otherwise the chlorine will knock out the beneficial bacteria that are building up (and possibly kill your fish, too).
OK, I wondered about that. The guy at the fish shop said that API Stress Zyme would do that because it has water conditioners in it. I read the bottle and it said nothing about removing chlorine, so I used some more Aqua Safe tonight when changing the water. I feel so sorry for my poor fish
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