Just as it says, I want to overstock a 20g long with small fish. Not a beginner and I already have certain fish in mind. I've had just about every fish there is to have but never had guppies and I'm considering a tank full of them. Is it ok to have just an all male tank or males and females mixed? Or any other small fish that will mix? Or maybe just a bunch of different small fish? Give me some ideas!
Overstocking a 20g long
- Thread starter gilpi
- Start date
Well if you go male and females your tank is going to be overrun in no time. I'd probably go all males.
You can go with small rainbow fish instead.
www.seriouslyfish.com
Just don't go with both because they can interbreed. Of course you may be okay with that.
You can go with small rainbow fish instead.
Pseudomugil gertrudae – Spotted Blue-eye — Seriously Fish
www.seriouslyfish.com
Just don't go with both because they can interbreed. Of course you may be okay with that.
That’s a great suggestion, the forktail blue eye is a beautiful fish. Price is a concern for me, I believe these are somewhat pricey, one of the reasons I was going with guppies. Then again, I have not purchased any fish in the last year or two, so I need to do some research. This is just to fill up a secondary tank I had running for years with other fish.Well if you go male and females your tank is going to be overrun in no time. I'd probably go all males.
You can go with small rainbow fish instead.
Pseudomugil gertrudae – Spotted Blue-eye — Seriously Fish
Just don't go with both because they can interbreed. Of course you may be okay with that.
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I know overstock is a sensitive word around here but it's nothing new to me since I've kept African Cichlids for years. Lets say the "by the rules" limit is around 15 guppies in a 20 long, I'd like to go over by just a few more say 20 to 25, so that would be considered slightly overstocked. Not all fish do well in a semi-crowded tank, I never kept guppies and from the reading I've done, it seems they do well in a "semi" overstocked tank. Neons are great in a big bunch, but they need more swim space. Also, I've had good results with a big bunch of Tiger Barbs but in a bigger tank. So, I'm looking for suggestions on smaller fish.
Ah, the old every fish is like my mbuna trap. I've seen a few people fall into it. Welcome to that club.
Guppies are hardy and their behaviour is very stereotyped. If they're fancy guppies they'll swim around having fins, and that's about it. If they overload the tank, they'll be smaller and live shorter lives. Do enough water changes, and even a beginner can do that.
But why?
Overstocked non-mbuna tanks are boring. The fish are just ornaments, not living creatures acting in ways that are fun to watch.. You get no complex behaviour, just a permanent subway platform at rush hour. Everyone there is nicely dressed, and that's about it. The fish are stressed and disease prone, and live unpleasant lives. Eventually, the tank crashes and you do it all again with more unlucky fish.
When it comes to moving past the beginner stage in fishkeeping, non mbuna overstocking is underappreciating. You've put the plan to overstock first, even before you've decided what fish to apply it to.
You have a 20 long, and you want lots of fish. You don't seem to want to breed the fish. Why not raise your game, stock reasonably but go for micro fish? With a little planting, you could have a big group (easily 30) of Bororas in there. You could find Heterandria formosa, and really go to town. They thrive in large groups, and stay small. You started with the only group of Cichlids that like to be crowded. For your tank size, look for micro fish that live in large groups if you want to keep moving in that direction. Chili rasbora are a common Bororas species that's generally available, likes big groups and won't break the bank. Plus they're active, social and fun to watch.
Guppies are hardy and their behaviour is very stereotyped. If they're fancy guppies they'll swim around having fins, and that's about it. If they overload the tank, they'll be smaller and live shorter lives. Do enough water changes, and even a beginner can do that.
But why?
Overstocked non-mbuna tanks are boring. The fish are just ornaments, not living creatures acting in ways that are fun to watch.. You get no complex behaviour, just a permanent subway platform at rush hour. Everyone there is nicely dressed, and that's about it. The fish are stressed and disease prone, and live unpleasant lives. Eventually, the tank crashes and you do it all again with more unlucky fish.
When it comes to moving past the beginner stage in fishkeeping, non mbuna overstocking is underappreciating. You've put the plan to overstock first, even before you've decided what fish to apply it to.
You have a 20 long, and you want lots of fish. You don't seem to want to breed the fish. Why not raise your game, stock reasonably but go for micro fish? With a little planting, you could have a big group (easily 30) of Bororas in there. You could find Heterandria formosa, and really go to town. They thrive in large groups, and stay small. You started with the only group of Cichlids that like to be crowded. For your tank size, look for micro fish that live in large groups if you want to keep moving in that direction. Chili rasbora are a common Bororas species that's generally available, likes big groups and won't break the bank. Plus they're active, social and fun to watch.
Every fish is like my mbuna? I don't remember mentioning this.
We all have opinions, and they are just that. Let's tell everyone here that has guppies how boring they are or those "nicely dressed" angels that just sit there how boring they are or any other fish for that matter. Perhaps some of us like the "rush hour" look in their tank, I would call that active. Complex behavior... fish nipping at each other, chasing each other, stressing or even killing each other, many of us are done with that, I am. And yes, many of us not only care about the fish but the ornament value of it as well.
Why you ask? Because I want to. Are 20 guppies in a 20g long Armageddon? I hardly think so, especially with good maintenance.
I'd like to think after decades of fishkeeping, I'm way past my beginner stage.
Not interested in breeding, been there done that.
However, your last paragraph I could have appreciated, had it not been for the unnecessary rant.
speakerman3
Fish Fanatic
With the right filtration, water changes, and plenty of plants, thirty guppies wouldn't even be stressed in a 20 long. I had a huge group of guppies in a 29 that would constantly breed and I would constantly sell off groups of them to my lfs only to find the twenty that I sold magically replaced in a few weeks. Based on their appearance, behavior, and prolific breeding, they were happy and healthy. You have experience, so try something out and be flexible.
I would probably put Julidochromis transcriptus in a 20 long if I could find any right now.
I would probably put Julidochromis transcriptus in a 20 long if I could find any right now.
I suppose it depends upon the definition of "overstocking," as to what you or any of us means by the term. No tank is overstocked if it holds the correct number of each species, compatible species (there are many aspects to this term too), and the biological system easily supports the fish.
Most everyone on this forum probably defines "overstocking" as having more fish than the tank can support, and/or the fish are not compatible. Going down this road is cruel and inhumane, because it is denying the fish was they expect from their genetic blueprint. I'm not saying you are, but the point is that this is really the only meaning for the word. And none of us on TFF will or should condone this.
Most everyone on this forum probably defines "overstocking" as having more fish than the tank can support, and/or the fish are not compatible. Going down this road is cruel and inhumane, because it is denying the fish was they expect from their genetic blueprint. I'm not saying you are, but the point is that this is really the only meaning for the word. And none of us on TFF will or should condone this.
speakerman3
Fish Fanatic
Another fish that could work well in a heavily-stocked but well-filtered 20 long is white clouds. With a sponge filter powerhead combo on one end, you could have good oxygenation and current, too. A Hamburg Matten filter would give you more filter area, but using a powerhead aimed from one end to the other with the current running the length of the tank could be cool with white clouds--and you wouldn't need to heat it.
Put enough anchored java moss in the bottom and you could start with a dozen and increase those numbers as you get spawning activity.
Put enough anchored java moss in the bottom and you could start with a dozen and increase those numbers as you get spawning activity.
Another possibility, never even thought about Minnows.
This thread has taken a deep dive but anyway, good points and I agree. But how is a 20g with 20 Guppies less ethical or inhumane than compared to July 2022 TOTM?
That is one heavily stocked tank. Overstocked? I think we have the root of our disagreement - when someone announces they'll overstock, based on forums, I expect they'll be shoehorning 50 male guppies into a 20. The guy from July is heavily stocked for sure, but if you question that as a comparable, then we're on the same page.
Apologies for getting pissy and for making wrong assumptions there. No need for you to accept the apology - I was out of line.
You should, however, still explore Bororas.
I made no comparison with the July tank. And it is not overstocked by any stretch of the imagination if one defines overstocked as having too many fish for the biological system to support. Overstocked and inappropriately stocked are two very different things as well.
So you’re not actually overstocking, just having more guppies than is usually recommended. It’s not possible to literally overstock with livebearers, because they’ll adjust their numbers down to the maximum bioload for the tank.
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