Over Stocking

[rixy]

have to agree with ferris on this one 30 malawi of any size is a serious overcrowd in a 180 litre.it may look colourful from your point of view,and,nice and active,but its way overstocked.i'm not quoting out of books,im quoting my own experiences.an average malawi is 4-5 inches when fully grown.30 fish that size in a 180 litre .anything is possible for a short lenght of time,but,in the end,it will probably go wrong.malawis arent the cheapest fish to buy and i've seen so many people lose £100's of fish etc and be put of malawis because of it.30 fully growm malawis would be best suited to a 4x2x2 minimum,if not a 5x2x2.

i'm not preaching to anyone,im trying to help you not make a costly mistake.if you spend £50 at least on ocean rock plus £200 on fish (usually £6 minimum each) you will understand what i mean.ginge was trying to sell his malawis for ages with no success and i had to practically give my £300 collection to my lfs for £75 credit as no one else was interested.malawis are a lovely fishbut,you need to read as much as possible about other peoples set ups.some people do keep malawis in small tanks.but,how many are successful?some people put silver sharks in a 180 litre,but,would you

 

[aberdeen aquarist]

have to agree with ferris on this one 30 malawi of any size is a serious overcrowd in a 180 litre.it may look colourful from your point of view,and,nice and active,but its way overstocked.i'm not quoting out of books,im quoting my own experiences.an average malawi is 4-5 inches when fully grown.30 fish that size in a 180 litre .anything is possible for a short lenght of time,but,in the end,it will probably go wrong.malawis arent the cheapest fish to buy and i've seen so many people lose £100's of fish etc and be put of malawis because of it.30 fully growm malawis would be best suited to a 4x2x2 minimum,if not a 5x2x2.

i'm not preaching to anyone,im trying to help you not make a costly mistake.if you spend £50 at least on ocean rock plus £200 on fish (usually £6 minimum each) you will understand what i mean.ginge was trying to sell his malawis for ages with no success and i had to practically give my £300 collection to my lfs for £75 credit as no one else was interested.malawis are a lovely fishbut,you need to read as much as possible about other peoples set ups.some people do keep malawis in small tanks.but,how many are successful?some people put silver sharks in a 180 litre,but,would you

Why would I buy ocean rock, fish get stuck in it and die?
£6 each for fish, not me, I buy from breeders not shops, average price £2.
I feel sorry for you that you had to seel your fish for that amount, thats not a nice thing to have to do, if I had seen the ad and you had been willing to ship them, maybe I would have been interested for my tanks in the shed!!

 

[Miss Dib Dabs]

30 sounds an awful lot. That's approx 46usg. I run a 100usg Malawi tank and I don't have 30 in it. Granted I do have a family group of synos in there but even so I wouldn't want that many malawis crammed in. I also over filtrate by a fair amount. Malawis tend to breed quite readily so population will rise over time and it is a bit worrying, not just for the fish, but for you too, that eventually the eco system will crash and disease will take hold. I really hope the system doesn't crash.
P.
Editurely the price of the fish should have little to do with the suffering you will inevitably put them through? Whether I pay nothing to over £50 for a fish doesn't mean I'll treat them any better or worse for it. I want them all to live a good full life with as little stress as I can inflict upon them.

 

[aberdeen aquarist]

30 sounds an awful lot. That's approx 46usg. I run a 100usg Malawi tank and I don't have 30 in it. Granted I do have a family group of synos in there but even so I wouldn't want that many malawis crammed in. I also over filtrate by a fair amount. Malawis tend to breed quite readily so population will rise over time and it is a bit worrying, not just for the fish, but for you too, that eventually the eco system will crash and disease will take hold. I really hope the system doesn't crash.
P.
Editurely the price of the fish should have little to do with the suffering you will inevitably put them through? Whether I pay nothing to over £50 for a fish doesn't mean I'll treat them any better or worse for it. I want them all to live a good full life with as little stress as I can inflict upon them.

See now this is the difference between forums.

There are 2 schools of thought about keeping these fish, to overstock or understock. Personally I have had more problems with understocking a tank of mbuna, and your tank is understocked when it comes to mbuna, but if it works for you, then keep doing it.

The price of fish doesn't matter when it comes to keeping them healthy, I was just saying I didn't need to pay the amount that was stated.

And just so you know, the exisitng tank I mentioned isn't mine, it belongs to a respected member/mod of another forum I frequent. It has been running for over a year now without any problems, so I'd say it was pretty well established wouldn't you?

I am planning on something similar later this year, but it'll have to wait until I move the 40 pirhana I have in the tank I'm going to use

 

[Miss Dib Dabs]

Lol well each to their own of course. But with the catfish adding to the bioload (and they aren't small by any means) and some of the Malawis getting close to their potential size with plenty of breeding happening I wouldn't dream of adding any more. There's little aggression in the tank between any of the species, possibly because of the high percentage being female, but they all have their own favourite places and territories for the males without issues or brawling. It works and they are happy. So I am happy. They colour up very early as babes and grow rapidly. And they all have distinct personalities, even from an early age. I wouldn't want to lose that just to create a mass of moving colour.
And no, no price should matter when it comes to their welfare. And I agree you don't need to pay masses if you look in the right places or have contacts. But not everyone does.
P.

 

[mark7616]

I have spent months now learning and researching about these fish and i came to a conclusion that for the majority of people overstocking is the best bet for them. As long as there is adequate filtration overstocking seems the safest approach to keeping these fish as it disperses aggression not saying that you take up all the swimming space with fish i have spoken with alot of people and been to alot of peoples houses and all keep there tnks overstocked over filtered and weekly water changes with no problem.

 

[Ginge]

30 sounds an awful lot. That's approx 46usg. I run a 100usg Malawi tank and I don't have 30 in it. Granted I do have a family group of synos in there but even so I wouldn't want that many malawis crammed in. I also over filtrate by a fair amount. Malawis tend to breed quite readily so population will rise over time and it is a bit worrying, not just for the fish, but for you too, that eventually the eco system will crash and disease will take hold. I really hope the system doesn't crash.
P.
Editurely the price of the fish should have little to do with the suffering you will inevitably put them through? Whether I pay nothing to over £50 for a fish doesn't mean I'll treat them any better or worse for it. I want them all to live a good full life with as little stress as I can inflict upon them.

See now this is the difference between forums.

There are 2 schools of thought about keeping these fish, to overstock or understock. Personally I have had more problems with understocking a tank of mbuna, and your tank is understocked when it comes to mbuna, but if it works for you, then keep doing it.

The price of fish doesn't matter when it comes to keeping them healthy, I was just saying I didn't need to pay the amount that was stated.








And just so you know, the exisitng tank I mentioned isn't mine, it belongs to a respected member/mod of another forum I frequent. It has been running for over a year now without any problems, so I'd say it was pretty well established wouldn't you?

I am planning on something similar later this year, but it'll have to wait until I move the 40 pirhana I have in the tank I'm going to use

I agree on you that understocking couses more problems in a tank but surley you must say 30african cichlids in a 46usg tank it taking it too far. i have 13 in my 55g i think and it looks pretty well stocked.

BTW what pirhanas do you keep? That tank their in mut be giant.

 

[aberdeen aquarist]

Sorry to disappoint, it was meant as a joke hence the
I don't see the point in keeping any animal that could cause you serious harm!

 

[Ginge]

Sorry to disappoint, it was meant as a joke hence the
I don't see the point in keeping any animal that could cause you serious harm!

LOL it could be done but you would need like a room sized tank.

 

[Myatt72]

over stocking is best,. just added a tetratec 1200 filer too so no worries on water quality! fish are various sizes from few adults to yunger fish, most are smaller malawis too.

 

[mamafish68]

over stocking is best,. just added a tetratec 1200 filer too so no worries on water quality! fish are various sizes from few adults to yunger fish, most are smaller malawis too.

NO it's not best, it just maybe what works for you at the time. I cant wait until 2 years from now what your tank will be like. ...

 

[Ginge]

over stocking is best,. just added a tetratec 1200 filer too so no worries on water quality! fish are various sizes from few adults to yunger fish, most are smaller malawis too.

NO it's not best, it just maybe what works for you at the time. I cant wait until 2 years from now what your tank will be like. ...

True. And overstocking is the general advice given but as Mammafish says your tanks lined up for a bloodbath. Might as well say now.

 

[brewyn]

theres over stocking, and then theres OVER STOCKING, my hummble opinion would be for maximum of 1 cichlid per 2 gallon of water, (mbuna of course) happs grow conciderably larger. I believe it is safer for the fish to be over stocked as apposed to under, as mentioned before, it draws the attention away from one particular fish. it is correct that you need to consider much better filtration and keep to a strict routine with the water changes. In my 104 uk gallon tank I have roughly about 30ish cichlids, I tend to see more aggression from the smaller juveniles rather than the adults, and this seems more like playfull aggression. the tank is run with a fluval FX5, and an eheim pro 2. the one thing I can say is that the more fish you have, the less they seem to develop territories, mine all swim at the front of the tank and dont really bother with the rocks, infact some times I wonder if they really are rock dwellers at all.

This is my tank, and my oppinion, it works fine for me.

PS, I have less than 1 cichlid per 2 gallons, but its still overstocked adequately

 

[Callum]

a thought if understocking chichilds is a problem then can i put 14 in at once it is a 180 litre tank with a Fluval 205 already been used for 3 months on my old tank and a juwel rio 180 filter used for 2 weeks.

 

[brewyn]

I dont know what 180 litres works out at in imperial gallons. if your filters have been constantly running and NOT turned off at any point, then yes they will be fine for filtration, not sure of the flow rate of your filters combined but it needs realistycaly to be 3 times the water quantity of the tank, ie, if yours is 180litres then the filters need to run atleast 540 litres an hour. If your filters have been switched off for more than 12 hours then the bacteria that once existed in them will be rendered useless, and you will need to start a new cycle. Each to there own, and no doubt I will get hammered on this, but I cycled my 150 gallon tank with over 80 happs and mbuna mostly all at once. I never suffered a fatality through doing this, but I did suffer extremely high nitrates and a desperate case of itch. I dealt with the nitrate problem with 15% water changes every other day, and I dealt with the itch using protozin and sterazin TOGETHER.