'New' Nannostomus species

Innesfan

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Pictures of what appears to be a newly imported and likely new Nannostomus species are circulating. It's being temporarily called N. cf trifasciatus much the same way that the species we now know as N. mortenthaleri and N. rubrocaudatus were called N. cf. marginatus prior to being described. You too can own some at $45 a piece, minimum. Perhaps a shoal of 20? As discussed elsewhere in a thread about N. marginatus, that species is in all probability a 'species group' destined to be split up. Same is true of N. trifasciatus and this new member of that 'species group.'

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The commercial success of the "new" red pencils has created new interest, but a lot of these new forms are apparently quite an expensive trek to get to. As a friend pointed out, logging destroys the habitats that created and sustain these fish, but logging roads allow them to be "discovered".

They aren't logging the easy to get to zones anymore - they tend to be done.

It was the same risky pattern in Africa. Logging roads got us to habitats, and when the trees were gone, secondary scrub forests ate those roads up and closed them. I saw a few recently vacated road already covered by creeper vines. The very economics that give access cause extinctions. Go figure.

Neat little fish though.
 
The commercial success of the "new" red pencils has created new interest...
What's your opinion about those 'new' red forms, "red cenepa," "amaya" etc, etc? Variants of N. rubrocaudatus or one or more new species? I'm not sure. I also wonder if there's funny business going on and they are either not exporting females or are sending over females of N. rubrocaudatus. The latter is a willing spawner and I suspect these 'new' forms would be too and prices would drop precipitously if they sent over real pairs of these big ticket Nannostomus.
 
What's your opinion about those 'new' red forms, "red cenepa," "amaya" etc, etc? Variants of N. rubrocaudatus or one or more new species? I'm not sure. I also wonder if there's funny business going on and they are either not exporting females or are sending over females of N. rubrocaudatus. The latter is a willing spawner and I suspect these 'new' forms would be too and prices would drop precipitously if they sent over real pairs of these big ticket Nannostomus.
I actually don't like them - but the one you pictured looks nice if it shoals; though $45 is a bit rich for 20. I do have a group of epesi but they were 1/2 that price ;)
 
I've never seen a wild form fish I didn't like. If I put on my critical goggles and you show me a man made fish, there's usually something 'off' in them that I react to. Oversized fins, things like that. If I know it's a hybrid, linebred or petrie dish fish, then prejudice kicks in and I can surely find reasons not to like it. But when a new variation or species of fish comes in from the natural world around us, I like it. I may never want to keep it, or I may find it doesn't fit with my interests, but it's still cool.

The new pencils? I find huge chunks of colour less interesting than patterns, but I like red and blue on fish. They sure have red. I just found (I think) my $8 cad mortenthaleri, and that's a splash of red fish. I'd rather have found an old school gold marginatum, as the complexity of their markings is nice. But I like all the 'new' red pencils, even if when I was a teacher I never used a red pencil (green makes a piece of homework look like a garden), and if I could afford the new ones, I'd go for them all.

I hope we don't get what's happened because of many linebred fish appealing to the market, and have the more subtle fish vanish from the trade. Around here, marginatum is rare to gone from the hobby, and only beckfordi and occasionally trifasciata and eques show up once in a blue moon. I'd hate the see the 'smack you in the face with their colour' red pencils replace them entirely in the trade, as it is a very fickle market.
 
only beckfordi and occasionally trifasciata and eques
Interesting, I have been trying on and off for years to find eques in the UK and never succeeded. Beckfordi are everywhere. Many years ago I did end up with a few trifasciata when I bought a group of marginatus from a chain store which made me assume they were wild caught. In fairness the tank was just labelled "pencilfish" and I took the lot :)
 
Interesting, I have been trying on and off for years to find eques in the UK and never succeeded. Beckfordi are everywhere. Many years ago I did end up with a few trifasciata when I bought a group of marginatus from a chain store which made me assume they were wild caught. In fairness the tank was just labelled "pencilfish" and I took the lot :)

Your N trifasciatus were wild caught. That species is among the most difficult to induce to spawn in the genus and they have never been farmed. And they've been in the hobby for over a century. (Seriously Fish claiming that most imports are farmed is entirely incorrect.) N. beckfordi is farmed extensively in Asia, and Czech breeders have developed 'super red' strains of that species. N. harrisoni and N. eques have been farmed from time to time but that has not endured. The rest of the species that we see are all wild caught.

It surprises me that the more recent and very colorful species, N. mortenthaleri and N. rubrocaudatus have not been farmed since they command high prices and are willing spawners. I suspect the same would be true for the even newer solid red variants/species--"cenepa," "amaya" etc-- but as I said earlier, I'm not sure we've ever seen females.
 
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I peeked at the wholesale list for the mortenthaleri. I'll pay about $8 if they arrive, but they listed at half that, Canadian. That's about 9 cents American (okay, a couple of bucks), with what's happening to our resource based economy. So either the list is wrong and the fish will be a red beckfordi (do I trust mainstream wholesalers) or the fish is being farmed now.
We shall see, if we shall see. Looking for fish from a region far from the main river of the hobby calls for patience.
 
I peeked at the wholesale list for the mortenthaleri. I'll pay about $8 if they arrive, but they listed at half that, Canadian. That's about 9 cents American (okay, a couple of bucks), with what's happening to our resource based economy. So either the list is wrong and the fish will be a red beckfordi (do I trust mainstream wholesalers) or the fish is being farmed now.
We shall see, if we shall see. Looking for fish from a region far from the main river of the hobby calls for patience.
The retail price is a *lot* more; but as i noted i will not buy them again. I do the like the fish pictured at the top of this page and if it was $9 cents a fish i would order 100.
 
Tastes differ. I have never seen mortenthaleri below $15-20, so we will see what transpires. I wish I lived in the same city as the seller, because I'd like to see them before I pay for them.

50/50 they'll be red beckfordii.
 
Tastes differ. I have never seen mortenthaleri below $15-20, so we will see what transpires. I wish I lived in the same city as the seller, because I'd like to see them before I pay for them.

50/50 they'll be red beckfordii.

I hope they are N. mortenthaleri and that you are getting a deal. And that both sexes are there. I too have not seen them for below $15 here in the States. Eager to hear the outcome. Fingers crossed.
 
Tastes differ. I have never seen mortenthaleri below $15-20, so we will see what transpires. I wish I lived in the same city as the seller, because I'd like to see them before I pay for them.

50/50 they'll be red beckfordii.
Yea taste differ but i do have a group of 15 or so in a 65 and i just don't like them ;) As for how much i paid for them truth be told i have no clue it was 2 years ago and i'd have to dig out the purchase - hum found it - it was only 12 @ $12 a fish so i guess prices have gone up.
 
There's hope. The first time I saw ember tetras (they were amandae tetras back then) then were a pretty solid price as a new wild import. Now look at them. They everywhere, and inexpensive. Maybe that's the future for red pencils. Maybe it's the present.
 
It's called convergent evolution, and it's a very cool thing to look at.

The sizes of those fish are radically different. I'm uncertain nature's behind the red beckfordi - I believe that's a linebred.
 

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