New Low-End Plan

[maurizio]

Hello all,
given up with skippers, that's my new plan:

240 l, with an aerial part of about 10-12 cm, SG 1.005 @ 25 C, temperature 26-28 C.

6 Parambassis Ranga
1 Toxotes (Jaculatrix/Chatareus/Microlepis?)
a little army (10?) of Caridina Japonica, supplemented by
a bunch of MTS

(In the future, if I (and the tank) can handle them, perhaps a few BBG (would they be compatible?)

Filter, I'll go for the new Eheim 350T.

One third will host some artificial mangrove roots, and a bunch of mangrove seeds I've collected, slowly germinating right now in a jar (question: they've developed algae; would it be a very silly idea to move them into the tank, thus seeding the inevitable algae growth there?).
The rest, mostly open water, some moss (Java or ball), some roots coming out of the water to hang some epiphites to encourage the archer to spit, a couple of aquatic plants to give a bit more shelter (I'd love Nymphoides Aquatica, but it's not really sheltering, I'm afraid; perhaps Vallisneria, on the background).

Comments? Any evident flaw/compatibility problem?

Thanks!

Maurizio

 

[nmonks]

I'd be surprised if archerfish didn't eat small gobies and shrimps.

If you want plants -- and there's no reason not to grow plants in a brackish tank -- you will need to restrict salinity down to the low end, SG 1.002-1.003 at 25 C. That limits your archerfish to Toxotes microlepis, which isn't a bad thing because this species is smaller than the others.

Cheers, Neale

 

[maurizio]

Hi Neal,
and thanks.

Well, my choice was based on reading that archerfish hardly see anything below their eyesight, which is quite limited to upwards... Plus, P. ranga is not THAT small??

To add more uncertainty, I just figured that the two species of fish might not enjoy the same water hardness, with P. ranga preferring almost soft? Should I reconsider?

Also, having plants was more a need to provide the shelter all these fish like, rather than my own wish... But it's true that at least they do help with algae. I read in many places, including the introduction tho planting brackish aquaria here, that banana plant, Cabomba carloina, Ceratophyllum submersum and Myriophyllum aquaticum all should make it well up to 1.005....).

Thanks for your help, much appreciated!

Maurizio

 

[nmonks]

Archerfish will consumer shrimps hidden in the sand by directing their jet into the sand, blowing open the shrimp's hiding places. Or so it's said, anyway. They have excellent all-around vision, and feed readily on things in midwater.

Adult glassfish may be kept in either fresh or slightly brackish water. They're unlikely to be eaten by T. microlepis, but T. microlepis will eat anything that fits into its mouth.

A variety of plants will live at up to SG 1.005 at 25 C, but their growth is less rapid and/or more difficult to ensure above SG 1.002. Since the species of fish you want to keep are happiest at low-end brackish conditions, why make things more difficult?

Cheers, Neale

 

[maurizio]

Cool, then, so much for this community. I'll review once again my plans. Most likely will give up on the archers, the aerial part and all the epiphites I was planning to hang were already giving me headache!

Agreed on 1.002, I thought Toxotes generally did need more.

Maurizio

 

[nmonks]

That's the myth. Of the seven species of Toxotes, four are strictly freshwater and one is freshwater to low end brackish (Toxotes microlepis). Only two are truly brackish water fish.

Agreed on 1.002, I thought Toxotes generally did need more.

 

[maurizio]

Yeah, I was aiming at Chatareus, provided I could find it....

Thanks!

 

[maurizio]

Hi again,
I really want the glassfish, and if I remove the archerfish I will definitively give up with my ideal mangrove dream, but then I can go for some other peaceful, lovely characters:

6 Parambassis ranga
n Dermogenys pusilla
n Brachygobius spp.

Can you recommend the right number for the latter two, considering a 240 l tank?
And yes, I'll go for plants, then, they all need them, and stay at SG 1.002.

I read somewhere that D. pusilla wiped out a population of ghost shrimp (perhaps in a small tank). Would Caridina japonica or gracilirostris be a NO GO?

Thanks!

 

[nmonks]

I can't see adult glassfish being eaten by adult T. microlepis. So long as choose specimens carefully should be fine. Archers normally eat long, thin fish like minnows.

In a 240 litre you could keep 10 or 12 glassfish, a trio of T. microlepis, a few horseface loaches, and a pair of orange chromides. BBGs would be difficult to feed in a big tank, so I'd skip those in favour of knight gobies, crazyfish, or some other 10-15 cm goby species.

Wrestling halfbeaks might be bullied by archers, and are the males are so small they're easily eaten by substantially larger fish.

Knight gobies, crazyfish and archers could eat shrimps in substantial numbers. Glassfish also likely to do so -- they're very predatory. Loaches, as you'd expect, view shrimps as food.

Cheers, Neale

 

[maurizio]

Back to the original glassfish & T. microlepis idea, then, I was thinking of Amano shrimp to help with algae, and mainly because I'd love an invertebrate. Any other you'd recommend (crabs such as Uca spp. or Sesarma) that would survive those tankmates attentions? I'm aware of the need of a sandbank, and ready to go for it (then I'd be back on the track of my mangrove swamp...). SG still at 1.002-1.003.

 

[nmonks]

Nerite snails would be a better choice; not only do they thrive in brackish water, they're also excellent green algae and diatom consumers. Long-arm shrimps will tolerate slightly brackish water without problems, but they can be predatory, so you'd need to select the species with care.

Crabs are best avoided; they simply don't belong in this sort of aquarium.

Cheers, Neale

 

[maurizio]

Hi again,
I'll stick to 6 Parambassis ranga and some 3 Toxotes Microlepis for now. With time I'll see how things go, and go for more.

A few questions concerning plants (I'll stay at SG 1.002-1.003 at 15 C), considering Ceratophyllum sp., Java moss and Egeria densa. I know they need longer acclimation than fishes, so should I start the aquarium as fresh, add the plants and slowly increase to final SG, rather than starting at 1.003 and plunging the plants in there?

I have some mangrove seeds germinating in a small jar, but obviously they've developed algae. Should I consider their chance to be moved in the tank doomed for this reason?

Cheers

Maurizio

 

[nmonks]

I'd set the tank up as freshwater, get the plants established, then raise the salinity over a few weeks.

Mangroves can do perfectly well in freshwater or low-end brackish.

Cheers, Neale

 

[maurizio]

Thanks Neale,

I'd set the tank up as freshwater, get the plants established, then raise the salinity over a few weeks.

I believe it would be acceptable to cycle at the same time?

About my mangrove seeds, what I meant is whether the fact that they have developed algae would make it stupid of me to move them into the tank, now. Sure, I can gently brush the algae off the seeds, but of course I don't want to even SEED algae in my tank...

Maurizio

 

[nmonks]

Algae will get into the tank via spores in the air. So forget about keeping algae out of the aquarium! If you have some fast-growing plants (Indian fern, Hygrophila, Vallisneria for example) and a bunch of nerite snails, algae won't be a problem.

Yes, you can cycle at low salinities without problems. For some reason above SG 1.002/1.003 at 25 C, cycling tends to take longer.

Cheers, Neale

Thanks Neale,

I'd set the tank up as freshwater, get the plants established, then raise the salinity over a few weeks.

I believe it would be acceptable to cycle at the same time?

About my mangrove seeds, what I meant is whether the fact that they have developed algae would make it stupid of me to move them into the tank, now. Sure, I can gently brush the algae off the seeds, but of course I don't want to even SEED algae in my tank...

Maurizio