New 220L tank set-up questions

Is there something I can do to the water to make it harder?

When I test the water in the goldfish tank with the same strips I used today for the tap water, the GH reading is always at the maximum colour end of the strip, at 180mg/L (although I never know what it really is, because it could be even higher). The straight tap water today, with exactly the same type of strip, read 0 GH, or barely over 0. KH is always either 0 or 40mg/L or somewhere in between.

When I first went to my local aquarium to set up the little 20L aquarium, they gave me water conditioner crystals & water conditioner drops. Could the crystals be making the soft water hard?

The water conditioner crystals are "Show Master" and are packed locally. The pack doesn't say what they actually are, and simply says they "assist in adjusting clean tap water to make the water condition as natural as possible for fish and plants". It says it doesn't remove chlorine, should be used every time water is added or changed, and "assists in preventing sickness and disease".

A bit of a Google lead me to a handful of conversations, some of them saying this kind of water crystal is used to raise GH.


I don't know the product mentioned, but it seems likely it is doing things. That begs the question, just what is it doing. This may not be beneficial to the fish, but could be detrimental.

The safe way to increase hardness is by using a substrate composed of calcareous mineral. Calcium and magnesium are the minerals involved, and I have used dolomite and aragonite, which contain both. This is OK when the GH and pH can be high without worries, as with livebearers (my mollies thrived for years with dolomite) but any soft water preferring fish will have issues (like the cories mentioned below) depending upon how hard it gets. This method lasts for years, as the substrate very slowly dissolves calcium and magnesium into the water. I don't know how long exactly, but I did this for I guess 5-6 years with no lessening in the effectiveness.

You can also use chemicals/substances specifically intended to increase GH, KH and pH. It is critical to have all three covered. I've never done this, as it is very expensive long-term, the substrate method worked for a couple tanks for that period, and I have since stayed with fish suited to my tap water.

I can say that this is a significant concern, when you start adjusting parameters. You need to do regular (weekly) water changes of 50% or so. But there may occur times when you need multiple major water changes; at the first sign of a problem, a major water change is usually helpful, and there can be situations where you need multiple such changes. Having to pre-mix water is not that easy.

It really is a better option, especially as this is a relatively new adventure (tropical aquarium), to select fish that will thrive in your tap water. Later, another tank may be the time to start experimenting. And there are so many extraordinary soft water species. Many members on here who are burdened with fairly hard water will lament the fact. I know I would; my fishroom of 8 planted tanks full of wild-caught fish from SA and a few from SE Asia would only be wishful thinking if I had to fuss with water adjustment.

I'm really, really hoping that there's a way I can have some livebearers. I do also want some little catfish, and was hoping to get one dwarf gourami (I read that they aren't super social with other gourami), and maybe some danios or tetras if there was room after all the other, more-wanted fish, but only if there was room.

If you go with hard water and livebearers, forget the gourami and tetras (though there are a few tetra species that will work, like the Pristella). Danios, maybe, depending upon where the GH ends up being. One of the commoner cories would work, like the Corydoras aeneus or C. paleatus in a shoal of 7-12. Livebearers are not small fish; swordtails reach 4-6 inches, with 4-5 usual in tanks, and are active swimmers. Mollies can attain 3 inches (males) and 5-6 inches (females).

Having male and female means hundreds of fry to deal with;not all will get eaten. Most keep only males for this reason. If both genders, then a ratio of more females to male of each species to spread out the aggression of males toward females (drive to spawn).

The pet store where I bought the new 220L aquarium from gave me "API Quick Start" and "API Stress Coat +".

The QuickStart is some sort of bacterial supplement that helps speed up the cycling. I am not saying I would use it...that is another story. But once the tank is cycled, this should not be continued.

StressCoat is something I personally would not use. It is basically a water conditioner, but it contains aloe vera, and studies now suggest this substance can cause damage to fish gills with prolonged use. I would recommend a conditioner that has as little "extras" as possible. API's Tap Water Conditioner is the one I now use. It is so concentrated you use very little.

And that point brings me to a general comment on additives. Everything that goes in the water enters the fish's bloodstream and gets circulated to the internal organs. While some of these additives are worse than others, we should always keep additives to the absolute minimum. There is no reason to add more than needed, or use products that are not absolutely essential. The relationship of fish to their aquatic environment is much more interactive that the relationship of most all terrestrial animals to air.
 
Can I ask which country you are in - I notice that you spell the word colour rather than color.

The reason I ask is because if you are in the UK, water companies often give hardness as mg/l Ca or mg/l CaO rather than mg/l CaCO3. If you water comany does use one of these units your water isn't quite as soft as we think.

Could I suggest you look at your water company's website again and check the exact hardness and alkalinity unit - mg/l Ca or mg/l CaO or mg/l CaCO3.
 
Can I ask which country you are in - I notice that you spell the word colour rather than color.

The reason I ask is because if you are in the UK, water companies often give hardness as mg/l Ca or mg/l CaO rather than mg/l CaCO3. If you water comany does use one of these units your water isn't quite as soft as we think.

Could I suggest you look at your water company's website again and check the exact hardness and alkalinity unit - mg/l Ca or mg/l CaO or mg/l CaCO3.

Hi Essjay.

I'm in Melbourne, Australia. I've just done a quick search of the website of the water company that serves my part of Melbourne (South East Water), and it seems they measure hardness as mg/L CaCO3. They also keep mentioning that it's very soft by international standards.

I'm not sure what year the document below was produced, but it's by my water company & shows their hardness in a few different international units. (The mention of CaCO3 was on another page.)
965a1431b1470c5c82de92d8c0d966b8.jpg


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Is there something I can do to the water to make it harder?

When I test the water in the goldfish tank with the same strips I used today for the tap water, the GH reading is always at the maximum colour end of the strip, at 180mg/L (although I never know what it really is, because it could be even higher). The straight tap water today, with exactly the same type of strip, read 0 GH, or barely over 0. KH is always either 0 or 40mg/L or somewhere in between.

When I first went to my local aquarium to set up the little 20L aquarium, they gave me water conditioner crystals & water conditioner drops. Could the crystals be making the soft water hard?

The water conditioner crystals are "Show Master" and are packed locally. The pack doesn't say what they actually are, and simply says they "assist in adjusting clean tap water to make the water condition as natural as possible for fish and plants". It says it doesn't remove chlorine, should be used every time water is added or changed, and "assists in preventing sickness and disease".

A bit of a Google lead me to a handful of conversations, some of them saying this kind of water crystal is used to raise GH.


I don't know the product mentioned, but it seems likely it is doing things. That begs the question, just what is it doing. This may not be beneficial to the fish, but could be detrimental.

The safe way to increase hardness is by using a substrate composed of calcareous mineral. Calcium and magnesium are the minerals involved, and I have used dolomite and aragonite, which contain both. This is OK when the GH and pH can be high without worries, as with livebearers (my mollies thrived for years with dolomite) but any soft water preferring fish will have issues (like the cories mentioned below) depending upon how hard it gets. This method lasts for years, as the substrate very slowly dissolves calcium and magnesium into the water. I don't know how long exactly, but I did this for I guess 5-6 years with no lessening in the effectiveness.

You can also use chemicals/substances specifically intended to increase GH, KH and pH. It is critical to have all three covered. I've never done this, as it is very expensive long-term, the substrate method worked for a couple tanks for that period, and I have since stayed with fish suited to my tap water.

I can say that this is a significant concern, when you start adjusting parameters. You need to do regular (weekly) water changes of 50% or so. But there may occur times when you need multiple major water changes; at the first sign of a problem, a major water change is usually helpful, and there can be situations where you need multiple such changes. Having to pre-mix water is not that easy.

It really is a better option, especially as this is a relatively new adventure (tropical aquarium), to select fish that will thrive in your tap water. Later, another tank may be the time to start experimenting. And there are so many extraordinary soft water species. Many members on here who are burdened with fairly hard water will lament the fact. I know I would; my fishroom of 8 planted tanks full of wild-caught fish from SA and a few from SE Asia would only be wishful thinking if I had to fuss with water adjustment.

I'm really, really hoping that there's a way I can have some livebearers. I do also want some little catfish, and was hoping to get one dwarf gourami (I read that they aren't super social with other gourami), and maybe some danios or tetras if there was room after all the other, more-wanted fish, but only if there was room.

If you go with hard water and livebearers, forget the gourami and tetras (though there are a few tetra species that will work, like the Pristella). Danios, maybe, depending upon where the GH ends up being. One of the commoner cories would work, like the Corydoras aeneus or C. paleatus in a shoal of 7-12. Livebearers are not small fish; swordtails reach 4-6 inches, with 4-5 usual in tanks, and are active swimmers. Mollies can attain 3 inches (males) and 5-6 inches (females).

Having male and female means hundreds of fry to deal with;not all will get eaten. Most keep only males for this reason. If both genders, then a ratio of more females to male of each species to spread out the aggression of males toward females (drive to spawn).

The pet store where I bought the new 220L aquarium from gave me "API Quick Start" and "API Stress Coat +".

The QuickStart is some sort of bacterial supplement that helps speed up the cycling. I am not saying I would use it...that is another story. But once the tank is cycled, this should not be continued.

StressCoat is something I personally would not use. It is basically a water conditioner, but it contains aloe vera, and studies now suggest this substance can cause damage to fish gills with prolonged use. I would recommend a conditioner that has as little "extras" as possible. API's Tap Water Conditioner is the one I now use. It is so concentrated you use very little.

And that point brings me to a general comment on additives. Everything that goes in the water enters the fish's bloodstream and gets circulated to the internal organs. While some of these additives are worse than others, we should always keep additives to the absolute minimum. There is no reason to add more than needed, or use products that are not absolutely essential. The relationship of fish to their aquatic environment is much more interactive that the relationship of most all terrestrial animals to air.
Byron, you're so amazing. I'll reply on detail tomorrow. Today has been a crazy day, and now it's 2am & I really better get to sleep. I have lots of questions to ask, if you don't mind.

:)

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Byron, you're so amazing. I'll reply on detail tomorrow. Today has been a crazy day, and now it's 2am & I really better get to sleep. I have lots of questions to ask, if you don't mind.

:)

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Not a problem, and thank you. There are a number of very experienced aquarists on this forum so I'm in good company.

That water report is one of the most informative I've seen, even mentioned aquarium issues. Your water is very soft, no question, though mine is even lower.:fish:
 
Not a problem, and thank you. There are a number of very experienced aquarists on this forum so I'm in good company.

That water report is one of the most informative I've seen, even mentioned aquarium issues. Your water is very soft, no question, though mine is even lower.:fish:
You should see the behemoth water quality reports they put on their website each year! It's many pages long, with data for all kinds of things they test at lots of locations fortnightly.

I just stumbled across another thing their webpage will do: when you put your address in, it presents a summary of various water quality tests over the past year. Here's mine (at least I think it's mine, rather than the average for the whole of Melbourne):

81a83276ef7cfe39ad87263e63c3bc91.jpg


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Not a problem, and thank you. There are a number of very experienced aquarists on this forum so I'm in good company.

That water report is one of the most informative I've seen, even mentioned aquarium issues. Your water is very soft, no question, though mine is even lower.:fish:

The safe way to increase hardness is by using a substrate composed of calcareous mineral. Calcium and magnesium are the minerals involved, and I have used dolomite and aragonite, which contain both. This is OK when the GH and pH can be high without worries, as with livebearers (my mollies thrived for years with dolomite) but any soft water preferring fish will have issues (like the cories mentioned below) depending upon how hard it gets.

I’m pretty keen to have livebearers, and can leave out the other fish mentioned if they won’t be compatible. I like the idea of using appropriate substrate, but I wonder how this is done? Do I purchase either dolomite or aragonite as sand? Aragonite sand seems to be more readily available according to a quick google search, but it is repeatedly advertised as being for marine or reef tanks. Does that mean it will contain other things that I want to avoid? Or do I use it in conjunction with otherwise inert sand, and do a lot of testing and adjustments of the ratio until the levels are right for the fish I intend keeping?

I also noticed dolomite lime sold at places that have to do with soil & gardening….

This method lasts for years, as the substrate very slowly dissolves calcium and magnesium into the water. I don't know how long exactly, but I did this for I guess 5-6 years with no lessening in the effectiveness.

Can I ask what happened after the 5-6 years that you kept mollies in dolomite/aragonite? Did something go wrong, or could you have kept going?


You can also use chemicals/substances specifically intended to increase GH, KH and pH. It is critical to have all three covered. I've never done this, as it is very expensive long-term, the substrate method worked for a couple tanks for that period, and I have since stayed with fish suited to my tap water.

I can say that this is a significant concern, when you start adjusting parameters. You need to do regular (weekly) water changes of 50% or so. But there may occur times when you need multiple major water changes; at the first sign of a problem, a major water change is usually helpful, and there can be situations where you need multiple such changes. Having to pre-mix water is not that easy.


Do you mean that doing weekly 50% water changes is always necessary when you use chemicals in the tank? If a calcareous mineral substrate is used, would it (usually) be weekly changes of a lower percentage?


It really is a better option, especially as this is a relatively new adventure (tropical aquarium), to select fish that will thrive in your tap water. Later, another tank may be the time to start experimenting.

I picture this one as my big, ultimate tank, and at this stage I can’t imagine getting more after this one. So I think I’d like to go straight for the fish that I really want in there, from the start. I also want to set up a little quarantine tank at the same time, and any new fish will have to be in there for a couple of weeks before they go into the big tank, but otherwise that will be it for me. (I should record this incase I look back and laugh one day.)

Regarding a quarantine tank, I’ve read the idea of simply keeping the filter for it as a second filter in the main tank most of the time, and wondered whether I could simply move some of the substrate from the big tank to the little tank, plus the filter & a heater, when the QT is required?


Having male and female means hundreds of fry to deal with; not all will get eaten. Most keep only males for this reason. If both genders, then a ratio of more females to male of each species to spread out the aggression of males toward females (drive to spawn).

Ah. So if there are no females at all, there is less aggression amongst multiple males? That’s good. I’m not intending to breed fish, and I think the males of most species are more attractive. I just thought that lots of males together would invite aggression, so thought I’d have to get lots of females per male. All-male is fine.


The QuickStart is some sort of bacterial supplement that helps speed up the cycling. I am not saying I would use it...that is another story. But once the tank is cycled, this should not be continued.

I think I’ll take it back (and the Stress Coat, and the white sand). I noticed some good-looking posts on cycling a tank in this forum. I’ll go back and study those. :)


And that point brings me to a general comment on additives. Everything that goes in the water enters the fish's bloodstream and gets circulated to the internal organs. While some of these additives are worse than others, we should always keep additives to the absolute minimum. There is no reason to add more than needed, or use products that are not absolutely essential. The relationship of fish to their aquatic environment is much more interactive that the relationship of most all terrestrial animals to air.


I really appreciate hearing this. It didn’t seem right when I read about Stress Coat lining the fish’s scales with a synthetic coating, but I hadn’t even thought about how it’s going right through their systems too, of course! Thank you again, Byron.
 
I'm not sure if it's possible but it would be best to have full access to the tank for water changes and such...
and I'm not sure I'd want the fish stuff to share an outlet with a TV. Water changes can get a little messy sometimes. Not to mention if it's water change day and someone is trying to watch tv..the water changer is really going be in the way (and if it were me watching General Hospital I'd beat that person). ha

Hi thrujenseyes.

I finally got a chance to make the new little side table and turn the tank around, moving it a little bit away from the power outlet & tv aerial outlet. I think is is the final resting place for the tank (see first pic below). Ignore where the pictures on the wall are - I'll have to move them away from behind the tank & the light & plant. That's my 7yo son's art work.

The second & third pictures are only there to sate your curiosity about the other side of the room. It's terribly messy right now, but here it is anyway.

:)
084eda776c3914c21b1bbf8a6ab1465b.jpg
21be75459a9872a7f9b82c7056d3fd14.jpg
3381bc6e1171ce95637405db79d539c5.jpg
 
I’m pretty keen to have livebearers, and can leave out the other fish mentioned if they won’t be compatible. I like the idea of using appropriate substrate, but I wonder how this is done? Do I purchase either dolomite or aragonite as sand? Aragonite sand seems to be more readily available according to a quick google search, but it is repeatedly advertised as being for marine or reef tanks. Does that mean it will contain other things that I want to avoid? Or do I use it in conjunction with otherwise inert sand, and do a lot of testing and adjustments of the ratio until the levels are right for the fish I intend keeping?

I also noticed dolomite lime sold at places that have to do with soil & gardening….

You want the sand (or gravel) that is composed of the minerals dolomite or aragonite. I doin't see dolomite easily available around here any longer, but aragonite is probably better anyway. Dolomite is white, and back in the 1980's when I had this there wasn't anything else and I didn't understand the problems of a white substrate. I would use aragonite today, and I have some.

You do not want marine substrate, this may well have salt (sodium chloride) in it. Plain aragonite sand, or rift lake cichlid sand would work. Sand if cories are intended, but then we come to the problem of hardening the water which cories do not like. You could mix aragonite sand and regular sand (use play sand, it is not rough) but you need to control the hardness if you intend any fish aside from those requiring harder water. You really are making life difficult. ;)

Can I ask what happened after the 5-6 years that you kept mollies in dolomite/aragonite? Did something go wrong, or could you have kept going?

That was back in the 1980's. I moved cities, and couldn't take my tanks, so I sold/gave the fish and tanks away. Once I got permanently settled in 1995 I started up again, and knowing more then about water I decided with my very soft (near-zero) water which then was also quite acidic (around pH 5) it would make life much easier to avoid hard water fish, and I have ever since.

Do you mean that doing weekly 50% water changes is always necessary when you use chemicals in the tank? If a calcareous mineral substrate is used, would it (usually) be weekly changes of a lower percentage?

Water Changes should be substantial regularly. I change about 60-65% of each tank every week without fail, and have for years. This is the single most important aspect of keeping fish, water changes. Believe me, it is very convenient to be able to run water straight from the faucet into the tank, just squirting in the conditioner when it starts. I have a 70g and 90g tank, and until last year I had a 115g as well, and water changes without this convenience would be very cumbersome. Before you ask, I sold the 115g because it was 20 years old and I was worried about the tank exploding and I'm not good with resealing tanks. I now have a new 29g and 40g in its place.

Regarding a quarantine tank, I’ve read the idea of simply keeping the filter for it as a second filter in the main tank most of the time, and wondered whether I could simply move some of the substrate from the big tank to the little tank, plus the filter & a heater, when the QT is required?

This is one method. I keep a planted 20g tank running permanently that I use for new fish. It often sits empty of fish for months, but it is also handy if I retrieve fry from the canister filters (which I seem to do every cleaning) or for emergency fish separation (it's been a few years since I had this, but it can happen). I do not use this as a hospital tank for sick fish (also very rare with me, only once I've done this), just a QT for new acquisitions.
 
I've had the goldfish (Goldie) for a few weeks now. The 20L tank with pebbles, light & filter was second hand from a friend's daughter.
Before you get an earful from someone that may not be very nice about it...maybe want to rehome Goldie as that's a pretty tiny little tank, better suited for a beta or maybe some fun little shrimp.
I can spy it back there in the kitchen (cute).

a brief & bad experience when my sister unexpectedly gave us a weird shallow pot with two goldfish for Christmas (announcing "garden furniture"..?).
what?! hahaha yeah, very odd and kinda funny! ....well, not for the fish I'm sure.

I think is is the final resting place for the tank (see first pic below).
Love It! I think it's perfect!

hat's my 7yo son's art work.
It's very nice, looks like you may have an artist!
Cute kitty too!

The second & third pictures are only there to sate your curiosity about the other side of the room. It's terribly messy right now, but here it is anyway.
Ah ha, I see why you could't put anything over there...it's a totally different room and you couldn't enjoy the tv or the tank if it were over there from this family room.

And Byron is right...what a cool water information chart!
How nice and convenient!
I'm on a private well, which changes and fluctuates so constant testing is necessary.
I would have absolutely done what he did and stuck with fish that are cozy in my own waters parameters but when I got my fish I'd only tested my tap...not thinking about the source water being my well.
And since my Well water is very acidic and has a zero buffering capacity....even when my ph rises to normal to hi from the "conditioners" our tap is treated with, it will eventually fall back down.

So...to keep my endlers happy I use aragonite (as suggested).
 
Before you get an earful from someone that may not be very nice about it...maybe want to rehome Goldie as that's a pretty tiny little tank, better suited for a beta or maybe some fun little shrimp.
I can spy it back there in the kitchen (cute).

Yes, I didn't realise that the 20L is too small until lovely people on here pointed it out. I need to take Goldie back to where I got him/her from. I would really love to put a beta in there instead. I need to figure out what's best for the beta before I pop him in there too... I bought a little heater for that tank before my son got all excited about goldfish, but I'm sure there must be a few things I could do before getting a beta to make it as nice as possible for him.


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Woops! I pressed 'send' too soon.


what?! hahaha yeah, very odd and kinda funny! ....well, not for the fish I'm sure.

No, they didn't have a very nice (or long) life. It spins me out, now: I know soooooo many people who day the same thing I always said, that I wouldn't get fish because I had them once and they just died. I had absolutely no idea that you couldn't just put them in normal tap water! I don't understand why it isn't common knowledge that you can't do that, and why it isn't illegal to sell animals without absolutely providing the basic advice about their requirements.

Cute kitty too!

It's turning into an an animal farm, here. We have our older cat, Jay Jay, a new kitten Tilly (she's in the photo), our beautiful labrador Bella, and tomorrow we're getting a golden retriever puppy that we'll be raising until she's 12-16 months old. I think I'm going to have to name any new fish too... maybe.

I would have absolutely done what he did and stuck with fish that are cozy in my own waters parameters but when I got my fish I'd only tested my tap...not thinking about the source water being my well.

Oh. I'm torn. In my head I know that I should simply take the advice of the experts... I know this.... but I really, really want to have livebearers. If it's a matter of some extra work for me, but they'll still have as healthy a life as long as I do the right things, I really want to try for them.

It's purely for the look of them; the colours & shapes. I feel shallow saying that, but the main interaction with the fish is visual (beyond the responsibility & care, and the relationship that exists because of that).

So...to keep my endlers happy I use aragonite (as suggested).

I had to that Google 'endlers' = guppies. :)

So, did you get pure aragonite in sand or gravel form and use it as substrate? Or do you use it some other way?

Thanks so much, Jen!

(My name's Jacqui, btw)

:)

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I've found someone with a pond so can take Goldie, rather than taking him/her back to the store I bought him from. Chances are they'd just sell him to someone else with an inappropriate tank.

So.... do I need to get him out of the tank asap, or would he be happy enough in there for a little while? Or should I attempt to measure him to work that out?

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*who, not 'so'.

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You want the sand (or gravel) that is composed of the minerals dolomite or aragonite. I doin't see dolomite easily available around here any longer, but aragonite is probably better anyway. Dolomite is white, and back in the 1980's when I had this there wasn't anything else and I didn't understand the problems of a white substrate. I would use aragonite today, and I have some.

You do not want marine substrate, this may well have salt (sodium chloride) in it. Plain aragonite sand, or rift lake cichlid sand would work. Sand if cories are intended, but then we come to the problem of hardening the water which cories do not like. You could mix aragonite sand and regular sand (use play sand, it is not rough) but you need to control the hardness if you intend any fish aside from those requiring harder water. You really are making life difficult. ;)



That was back in the 1980's. I moved cities, and couldn't take my tanks, so I sold/gave the fish and tanks away. Once I got permanently settled in 1995 I started up again, and knowing more then about water I decided with my very soft (near-zero) water which then was also quite acidic (around pH 5) it would make life much easier to avoid hard water fish, and I have ever since.



Water Changes should be substantial regularly. I change about 60-65% of each tank every week without fail, and have for years. This is the single most important aspect of keeping fish, water changes. Believe me, it is very convenient to be able to run water straight from the faucet into the tank, just squirting in the conditioner when it starts. I have a 70g and 90g tank, and until last year I had a 115g as well, and water changes without this convenience would be very cumbersome. Before you ask, I sold the 115g because it was 20 years old and I was worried about the tank exploding and I'm not good with resealing tanks. I now have a new 29g and 40g in its place.



This is one method. I keep a planted 20g tank running permanently that I use for new fish. It often sits empty of fish for months, but it is also handy if I retrieve fry from the canister filters (which I seem to do every cleaning) or for emergency fish separation (it's been a few years since I had this, but it can happen). I do not use this as a hospital tank for sick fish (also very rare with me, only once I've done this), just a QT for new acquisitions.

Thanks again Byron.

I went back to the pet store where I bought my 220L today, with a sample of the sand that came with the tank. It's Pisces Coral Sand, 'Premium Natural CaCO3'. The packaging says it's:

CaCO3: 99.8%
SiO2: 0.07%
MgO: 0.05%
Al2o3: 0.05%
So4: 0.03%
FE2o3: 40ppm

The pet store said they use this sand for their guppies to combat Melbourne's soft water. I think I was given about 10kg, and today I bought a second bag of 10kg. I haven't opened it yet.

I also looked for dolomite sand/gravel or aragonite sand/gravel in a few different types of stores without any luck, other than finding a wet marine substrate with lots of live thingies in it. The hardware chain mentioned a line they used to carry, which I could look up, but I think I might be good with the CaCO3 coral sand? I'm thinking that I'll set it up slowly and test the KH, GH, pH, ammonia, nitrite & nitrate at intervals to see how it goes.

I also had an interesting chat with one of the staff members at the aquarium that sold me the goldfish for my 20L tank. I asked him about water hardness and he kept talking about pH. We went around in circles, as he insisted that calling water 'hard' or 'soft' exclusively referred to the pH level, and that the pH level was all that mattered. He had me very confused, to the point that I had to Google 'what does hard water mean' as soon as I left the store, to reassure myself that it was to do with the minerals in the water. I know that I don't have a grasp yet of the interplay between all the different water measurements, but I get the impression that it isn't helpful to just bundle them all up together all call them the one thing.

I also asked him about my 20L tank being too small for a goldfish. He sort-of agreed, saying it depended on the type of goldfish and how old it was, suggesting that a 20L would be okay for a year or two. I didn't ask "then what?". He said I could 'trade in' our goldfish for something else. I don't like the idea of sending him back there, just to be resold to another person with too small a tank, so instead I've found a friend with two goldfish in a pond who said she'll take him. I'm happier about that. Eventually I'll get a beta for that tank instead.

Regarding a quarantine tank, does it need to be a certain minimum size? Unless I buy each fish one at a time, taking months to buy all the fish, I may have multiple fish in there for a couple of weeks at a time. Does that mean it needs to be pretty big too? I had in mind that I'd only get a little tank for the QT.

I'm sorry if I gave you the wrong impression, asking what happened to your livebearer tank after 5 years. I wondered if you meant that using aragonite etc substrate was only a temporary measure & would run into trouble over time. I think I might have offended you by asking what happened. I didn't mean anything suspicious! I'm just trying to learn as much as I can, from a starting point of pretty much zero. Sorry if it came across the wrong way!

Jacqui
:)



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