Neon tetra white spot's

[Dee90]

Hi there.
Im new to this aquarium life.
I just wanted to no how i can stop my neon tetra fish from catching the white spot disease......
Can anyone please help me!!!

 

[fluttermoth]

Hi there, Dee, welcome to the forum

Do your neons have white spot now, or are you just worried about it for the future?

Would you mind giving us some details of your set up, so we can spot any potential problems? The size of the tank, how long it's been running, how many and what kinds of fish you have, and the results of any water tests you've done would all help

 

[fozziebear]

http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/paracheirodon-innesi/ some important information about your fish that you should read there.

and as far as whitespot (the propper name is ich)

Ich is so widespread that many experts feel that it is present in the environment of most aquariums, especially in larger holding tanks, rearing ponds of breeders, collectors, and wholesalers. In fact, just about every aquarium fish will come into contact with this protozoan at several times in its life. Because it is so widespread, most fish have developed a good immune response against the disease to allow them to fight off the protozoan infection before it ever causes any symptoms. Captive fish that develop ich usually get the disease when their immune systems are not functioning as well as they should be because of stress. We know that stress lowers the immune response and when fish are stressed that is when ich is most prevalent.

There are many causes of stress in a fish's life, many of which can be made worse or better by the owner. Water temperature, water quality, tank inhabitants, improper diet, and a variety of other factors all contribute to stress, but one of the most severe causes of stress occurs during shipping and handling of a new fish. Whether coming from the wild or farm-raised, the handling and shipping of the fish from their origin to a wholesaler, then to a retailer, and finally to your home is extremely stressful. With the widespread prevalence of ich, it is no wonder that many newly purchased fish are affected.

 

[King puff]

I would read up about the ich life cycle. Basically, an ich parasite or trophozoite bursts from a cyst found on the skin, gills, and fins of a fish. The trophont forms a protective shell called a tromont where it multiplies inside. These will lay about your aquarium until they burst. When there are laying around, it is a good time to vacuum your gravel. do this every day. When the tromont bursts, it releases thousands of new tomites that will swim around to look for a fish host. the Tomites will infect a new host and the cycle will start again.

Salt is what she should be using. In fact, I would not recommend using it at all. Good ways to treat ich are NOT medicines. The best way and most safe way is doing it naturally. Raise the temp to 83-84 for two weeks. Do frequent water changes and vacuum the gravel VERY well during the water changes to make sure your getting all the tromonts out of your tank.

 

[NickAu]

Ich is so widespread that many experts feel that it is present in the environment of most aquariums,

I actually doubt that unless it can live in some sort of suspended animation.

If you have ICH its because it was introduced to the tank.

 

[fozziebear]

It can be introduced on shop bought fish i agree, but what that article and other more in depth articles are saying is that it is in a form of suspended animation in any aquaria, it is just waiting for the right circumstances to start it's lifecycle.

 

[Byron]

It can be introduced on shop bought fish i agree, but what that article and other more in depth articles are saying is that it is in a form of suspended animation in any aquaria, it is just waiting for the right circumstances to start it's lifecycle.

I can't see the reference to "that article" earlier in this thread...is there an article somewhere about ich?

I agree with the many authorities that ich is indeed present in many home aquaria. There can be no other explanation for a situation where nothing is added to an established aquarium for months, even years, but a sudden stress event (such as a heater failure, chilling the tank) results in an outbreak of ich. Obviously it had to be there, unobserved.

The explanation I understand is that just one or two tomants need to survive to maintain the parasite's presence. As tomites first attack fish in the gills, we won't see them. An occasional flash of one fish may indicate this, or be something else. The "immunity" the fish build up is also involved, in the form of some thickening of the protective slime layer. All of this makes sense, when one considers that wild fish never die off in great numbers from ich, and it is not an aquarium-confined parasite though within the confines of any aquarium it will be more evident than in the habitat.

Bob Fenner on wetwebmedia writes:

Ich is almost always present in freshwater systems and is parasitic on most if not all freshwater fishes. All that it takes to become pathogenic (actively infectious, disease-causing) is a strong strain of ich (e.g. an import from a newly added specimen), a not-so healthy, poorly-resistant host and/or a poor environment for the fishes. Re the last: Note that all diseases are to degrees environmentally linked. If the fishes are initially in good health, put into a suitable, stable home, the chance of outbreak is small.​

Stress is the direct cause of about 95% of all fish disease. Obviously the pathogen must be present/introduced, but in 95% of the time the fish will manage to avoid contamination by some means. It is only when they are stressed that this fails, which is why every single factor that can cause stress must be avoided as much as possible.

 

[fozziebear]

Sorry byron i am not as organised as yourself when it comes to my postings, i highly agree with your comment above.

some sources for what i put in my post.

Fairfield, T. A Commonsense Guide to Fish Health. Barrons, New York, NY; 2000.

Post, G. Textbook of Fish Health. TFH Publications. Neptune City, NJ; 1987.

Stoskopf, MK. Fish Medicine. W.B. Saunders Co. Philadelphia, PA; 1993.

 

[Byron]

Sorry byron i am not as organised as yourself when it comes to my postings, i highly agree with your comment above.

some sources for what i put in my post.

Fairfield, T. A Commonsense Guide to Fish Health. Barrons, New York, NY; 2000.

Post, G. Textbook of Fish Health. TFH Publications. Neptune City, NJ; 1987.

Stoskopf, MK. Fish Medicine. W.B. Saunders Co. Philadelphia, PA; 1993.

I wasn't questioning the information, I was wondering where the "Article" you mention in post #6 was; the link in post #3 is to the neon tetra profile on SF, not an article on ich. I think most sources are suggesting ich is present in most tanks, we don't need to delve into that.

 

[fozziebear]

it's an article by pet education, courtesy of Drs. Foster and Smith, so not wholly unbiased but a good resource none the less.

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=16+2160&aid=2421

 

[Byron]

it's an article by pet education, courtesy of Drs. Foster and Smith, so not wholly unbiased but a good resource none the less.

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=16+2160&aid=2421

That's a reliable summary. My only disagreement is with the suggested treatments. Malachite green is very dangerous with many fish, such as all characins, most catfish and loaches. Barbs might withstand it best. But it would not be my first choice. Copper is similar; to be effective, both of these substances will seriously harm if not kill sensitive fish like the characins (hatchetfish, pencilfish, tetras) and cories.

Salt and heat is a better treatment. I used to nay-say salt, but Dr. Neale Monks convinced me otherwise, and not surprising he was as he always is, right on. Salt is far less stressful to the afore-mentioned sensitive fish tan any of the other medications.

Heat alone is said to work, if it is raised to 90F/32C for a week. Some fish are fine with this, others would be dead before the week was over. I tend to follow Neale's suggestion to me of raising the temp to around 85F/30C, with 2 g of aquarium salt per liter. This treatment worked with loaches, cories and wild caught characins.

 

[fozziebear]

Very valid points as always Byron, although i would add salt treatment is not practical for planted aquariums, and you are best moving the fish to a quarantine to treat them.

 

[Byron]

Very valid points as always Byron, although i would add salt treatment is not practical for planted aquariums, and you are best moving the fish to a quarantine to treat them.

Salt (at the level Dr. Monks recommended) is far less detrimental to plants than copper or malachine green can be, again depending upon dosage. I did the salt treatment twice in a heavily planted tank with no plant problems, and it got rid of the parasite.

Moving fish with ich is pointless, though I see where you are coming from. But netting fish is the single most stressful thing you can do to a fish, it triggers the "escape-predator" response in a fish and this is severe. Stressing fish even more like this when they are already under stress is not advisable. Best to treat ich in the tank, always; the fish are obviously severely stressed or they would not have come down with ich to begin with.

 

[fozziebear]

Salt can and will destroy planted tanks if you are growing delicate species i know that from my own experiences, it is a lot easier to move the fish than the plants in that situation, you can always transfer them via a large diameter hose syphon if you are worried about netting stress.

 

[Byron]

Salt can and will destroy planted tanks if you are growing delicate species i know that from my own experiences, it is a lot easier to move the fish than the plants in that situation, you can always transfer them via a large diameter hose syphon if you are worried about netting stress.

Any method of moving the fish is severe stress, so that is not an option if one cares about the fish, as it could well tip them over the balance. Plants can more easily be removed if that is really necessary, but many can recover if they are set back. Salt did not mess with my plants, though they are probably hardier, whatever that may mean.

I have used furanizole for columnaris once and that really devastated the plants, but the fish were cured and that is still more important.