Need help!

[Natmanjoh]

Hello all. I need help. I used to have a fish tank over 10 years ago and am perplexed about what is going on with my tank. I may have not been in the hobby for a while but I thought we set our tank up for success, not a failure. My wife and I wanted to get a fish tank for our two boys, so we opted to get a 36 Gallon tank we saw at PetSmart. Our goal was to use this tank to 'get' back into the hobby before investing in a much bigger tank for the family room. We planned for the 36 Gallon tank to be mainly a Tiger Barb tank after seeing that our boys liked them the most at the store.

We brought the tank home, washed it out. Did not use cleaners or anything. Washed out all the items that would go into the tank as well, including the substrate. Set the tank up and filled it up with water. We used Tetra EasyBalance to make the tap water safe. We added some fish food to jump-start the cycling process and let the tank sit for a few weeks. Water tested great on all tests, so we went out to get some fish for it. We bought 3 Tiger barbs and 1 golden algae eater from PetSmart and introduced them to the tank by letting them sit in their bags for 10-20 min. Put about a cup of the tank water in their bags and let them sit another 10-15 min. Then used our net to put them in the tank while pouring a bit from each of the bags into the tank.

Barbs were super active the first day and night. We feed them lightly with plans to gradually increase their food as time went on so the tank would properly cycle. After two fo the original 3 died, we went to Petco and bought 4 more barbs for the tank (Petsmart was sold out at this point). It is now day 8/9, and we have 4 barbs left, with 1 most likely on its last legs. I am unsure what is going on. We have done so many water tests, including a water change, and still are unsure what is going on. According to all of our tests, everything water quality wise should be fine. Here are the most recent results from our tests after the most recent barb death:

Hard to tell in the pics, but alkalinity is 'moderate' with PH at 7.2. Ammonia is 0-0.5.

Here are some pics of the deceased:

The only symptoms that we could see that were 'common' was that they seemed to 'float' and/or drift up and down and 'lay' on the fake plants in the tank. One of the fish that I witnessed dying was swimming just fine, then turned upside down and freaked out, darting back and forth, then ended up on its side at the top of the water and swimming sideways in circles until it died. Others have died sinking to the bottom of the tank. The barbs seem to be hanging out behind the filter/heater, and some of them hang out swimming with their mouths at the top of the water and gills moving quickly.

I thought it might be an oxygen thing, so I removed some water to give more space between the waterline and the filter to introduce more bubbles into the tank. Some of the barbs have fast-moving mouths/gills, while others are not having this issue. One of the barbs just swims suspended in one place and only occasionally moves. Two of the smaller barbs got stuck to the filter intake. One of those two died shortly after getting it off the filter.

We had gotten a golden algae fish as well that also died. It had a green stomach upon death.

Here is a picture of the barb that stays suspended in one spot:

Here is a picture of the barb that died on its side floating and the other barb hanging out by the filter.

If anyone has some advice, please let me know. My wife is getting ready to throw in the towel on aquariums in general. Personally, I do not like seeing this many fish die on my watch. I just do not know what we are doing wrong. Maybe it was a 'bad batch' from the big box stores? Oh, we also used Melafix from Tetra today thinking it may be a bacterial infection or something. Anyway, I hope someone has some advice for us. I am tired of having fish funerals with my boys when this was supposed to be an exciting experience.

 

[YewBush]

My scissortail rasboras had similar symptoms when they all died of columnaris. They started to breathe quickly and act lethargic, and then died within 24 hours of showing symptoms. Do you see any white spots on the fish?

 

[Feisty Fishies]

Hi..Sorry to hear about your barbs. It is stressful to lose fish and not know why.
Your PH looked like it is right in the range that is good for barbs, but these little guys are extremely sensitive to water chemistry and I would be curious to know if the PH is the same at the pet store.
and there should be some signs of nitrate when you test, this would be the end result of the nitrogen cycle. If there is no nitrate detected the nitrite / ammonia is not being processed and the buildup may be too much for sensitive barbs , even if there is not that many fish you are introducing.
I know it is not very scientific, but there are some fish that just do not do well with the water chemistry in my area. I don’t keep tetras, guppies, barbs anymore (although I’ve had my Silver Dollars for Iquite some time and they are doing well... I understand they are in the same family as tetras). My Oscars, cories, plecos seem to do really well . I also rescued some clown loaches from somebody who was moving with the intention of rehoming them, but they have done so well I may keep them.
It does not help that most of these fish for sale don’t have the best breeding and may not be as resilient as they should be.
I would wait until you see some nitrate show up on your test and the ammonia and nitrite zero, and maybe see if there is a difference in PH or other chemistry from where they are coming from.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

I'm so sorry, I know how horrible it is when something like this happens! Setting up a brand new tank is rough. Cycling is on the one hand, simple, but on the other, can be pretty complex. Give your wife a hug from this online stranger and tell her that this is the rough stage, you can get through this and have a lovely tank in the end!

I agree with @Feisty Fishies that the fact you're not getting nitrate readings is likely the problem... the tank isn't cycled yet, so you've accidentally added fish too soon. This is a hugely common mistake that most everyone in the hobby has been through, so please don't be too hard on yourselves. Try and treat it as a learning experience and an opportunity to teach your boys perseverance. The fact that the fish were fine the first day, then started struggling day two also suggests that it's an ammonia problem - the tank hadn't cycled, the fish produced waste over that first 24 hours, not enough bacteria to process the waste, ammonia spike. The symptoms line up with an ammonia spike too, I'm sorry. I don't trust the dip strip test results, they're not terribly reliable I'm afraid.

Don't add any more fish, we need to get the tank cycled first before adding more. For now, don't clean the filter or anything, but do large water changes... 50-75% of the total volume of the tank, ensuring that you temperature match the new water to the same as the tank temp, and use water conditioner to treat the new water before adding it to the tank.

I don't like to rely on those dip strip types of testing kits, especially when setting up a new tank and trying to start a cycle. Accurate numbers for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH are crucial, especially when you're just beginning a cycle and starting to add fish. I would get a liquid test kit - these are much more accurate than dip strips, and with some learning you'll be able to tell when the water is ready for fish. You did a lot of things right, believe me - I can see you were doing your best to set it up right, stocking lightly at first, acclimating the fish, your heart is in the right place! - you've just been misguided about cycling, so the tank wasn't really ready to handle the bioload of even that small number of fish.

Trying to start a cycle with fish food is common, but it's also pretty imprecise, which can be a disaster as you've experienced. When the water is just sitting for weeks, even with some fish food in there, it doesn't mean it's actively cycling I'm afraid! The water tests "perfect", but there are no fish in there producing waste, the fish food can produce too much or not enough ammonia, and the cycle can easily stall if you don't know the numbers and aren't water changing when needed.

I'd suggest two options really. First, see whether you can return or rehome the fish you have left, then go back to the beginning of cycling, but using a liquid test kit and with some help from people here, and using bottled ammonia so you can follow the guide we have here. That will let you get precise test results and get your tank ready for a full stock, but you couldn't do that method with fish in the tank. It means a few weeks of an empty tank, but doesn't risk fish and means you can fully stock your tank once it's cycled, since you will have grown enough nitrifying bacteria to handle the bioload you plan to have.

The other option is to keep the fish you have now, and attempt to do a fish-in cycle. This is much riskier for the fish, and you might lose the others, I'm sorry. It would mean large daily water changes and frequent testing - again, I'd get a liquid test kit like the API master test kit that many of us use, and you'd have to test often, doing large water changes anytime ammonia or nitrites are above zero, or nitrates get to 20ppm or above. It would also mean that even once it's cycled, you'd have to stock very slowly, a few fish at a time weeks apart, monitoring the water conditions and doing water changes as needed while the bacteria colonies grow to handle the gradually increasing bioload.

Again, I'm so sorry you're having such a rough start! But know that you're not alone and that this is fixable with some work! For now, large water changes with temperature matched, declorinated water is the best chance to save the remaining fish until you decide which method you'd like to go with. That cycling article I linked explains so much about cycling, it really is a great resource written by a very experienced fishkeeper.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Oh, sorry, forgot something - resist the urge to add medications and things. Another common mistake! But the last thing the fish or the water need now is random chemicals added to it. Medications cause stress and affect water quality, so while they have their place, only use them when you know what you're treating for, otherwise, they're likely to do more harm than good. This isn't a disease or illness, it's a cycling problem, and water changes are the best medicine for that. Do some water changes to reduce the ammonia/nitrites and dilute out the Melafix.

You could try using some bottled bacteria starter, like Tetra Safestart, in the hopes of boosting your cycle by introducing the necessary bacteria types. I've never personally used those, but have heard of others finding them helpful for cycling. But other chemicals like Melafix or other meds, avoid. Fresh clean water and some time to cycle is the solution.

 

[Natmanjoh]

I appreciate everyone’s responses. Based on what was said; what we saw in the tank; and our conversation with the fish store reps. I believe the first batch of fish we got was due to ammonia spikes like some suggested due to the cycling not being completed.

The second batch of fish was due to a bacterial disease introduced from the store. The store we got the fish from told us that the stock they received all died. We are now going to use our spare tank as the introductory tank for any new fish that we want to get prior to introducing them to our main tank.

The stores were sold out of the liquid testers so we will order one on Amazon. In the interim my wife got some in tank stickie tests that change color as the water changes. She got one for PH and one for ammonia.

I think the melofix worked because the next day after using it the fish were much more active and acting normal. They are now currently schooling together, super active (especially at food time), and we have lost no more fish. Hopefully the tank is completely cycled now??

 

[Slaphppy7]

The tank will not be cycled until you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrItes, and some nitrAtes.

The API liquid test kit is a must-have, and will give you accurate readings for the above 3 parameters: https://apifishcare.com/product/freshwater-master-test-kit

Get some Seachem Prime for your conditioner, if you haven't already.