Need help with Dwarf Gouramis please!!

[Siss1494]

I have a large community tank, water parameters are good, just did a partial water change a couple days ago, and most of the fish have been happy, healthy, and active for months.
I added 2 black mollys about a week ago, I only quarantined them three days (apparently not long enough) and yesterday I noticed spots. I recognized it as ich which I’ve felt with before. I separated him because all the other fish are fine. I gave the Molly the recommended dose of ich treatment. I decided to go ahead and treat my tank to hopefully avoid a breakout even though the other fish were doing fine. That was a few hours ago and now 3 out of 4 of my dwarf gouramis are sitting at the top of the water and barley even reacted when I put my hand up to the glass (very out of the ordinary for these guys). I even fed them and they didn’t move and usually as soon as I pick up the food they start hunting for it. I have absolutely NO idea what happened or what to do!! I don’t know if maybe gouramis don’t treact we’ll to the treatment or if something else is going on. If it is the treatment I’m not sure what to do since the tank needs to be treated. I used the tablets that are sold at Walmart in a yellow box. Please, if anyone has advice it would be greatly appreciated!! All my other fish are behaving normally (killifish, mollies, platty, pleco, and danios). Nothing else in my tank has changed recently except removing the carbon filter and adding the recommended amount of ich treatment.

 

[Colin_T]

Pictures and video of the molly and gouramis so we can positively identify the white spot and check the gouramis for diseases?

Did you work out how much water is in the tank before treating it, or just go off the tank holding x amount of gallons?
If you didn't work out the exact amount of water, you might have overdosed the tank and poisoned the fish.
If this is the case, do a big (50-75% water change to dilute the chemicals in the water.

You can treat white spot by raising the water temperature to 30C (86F) and keeping it there for 2 weeks, or at least 1 week after all the white spots have gone. No chemicals needed, just raise the temp.

If you use heat or chemicals to treat white spot or anything else, you should increase aeration/ surface turbulence to maximise the oxygen levels in the water.

Remove carbon from the filter before treating with chemicals or it will adsorb the medication and stop it working. You do not need to remove the carbon if you use salt.

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To work out the volume of water in the tank:
measure length x width x height in cm.
divide by 1000.
= volume in litres.

When you measure the height, measure from the top of the substrate to the top of the water level.

If you have big rocks or driftwood in the tank, remove these before measuring the height of the water level so you get a more accurate water volume.

You can use a permanent marker to draw a line on the tank at the water level and put down how many litres are in the tank at that level.

There is a calculator/ converter in the "FishForum.net Calculator" under "Useful Links" at the bottom of this page that will let you convert litres to gallons if you need it.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Hi, can you give us numbers for the water parameters please? What treatment did you use for the ich?
Personally I would do a large water change. It's very likely that the gourami are reacting to either the medication, or something else about the water conditions (remember that there are a lot of things we cannot test for), and in both scenarios, fresh clean water is the best first aid step to take! Then let us know how they're doing, upload some photos of all the fish etc, and someone more knowlegeable about disease, like @Colin_T will hopefully be able to help further, see whether you need to use heat to finish off the ich rather than the med, or if something else might be going on.

 

[DoubleDutch]

Any pics of the fish ? What med are you using.

 

[Siss1494]

 

[Siss1494]

sorry, those are the clearest I could get. I went based off how many gallons my tank is so I may have overdosed a little but my tank is full up to my filters and I don’t have any large decorations, just fake bamboo and a couple other fake plants but I will do a partial just in case. The white spot on the Molly is already gone and he is looking and acting normal today along with all my other fish aside from the gouramis. I had one of my poor guys pass away last night. I just checked my parameters again and my nitrites have spiked so I added live bacteria. The spike happened overnight and other parameters are fine. I did remove the carbon filter before treating and I will definitely use salt if I encounter this again but I didn’t have any on hand at the time, the closest place to get it is an hour away and I thought the ich treatment would be better than waiting.

 

[Siss1494]

Well I was wrong, my Molly still has a spot on the top of his head and the ends of his fins look white, I’ll get a picture as soon as I can. I just finished about a 40% water change but now the ich meds will be diluted and I’m worried the Molly has it. I can’t get aquarium salt for a few days and my heaters don’t adjust, they keep the tank 77 to 78 degrees. I have no idea what to do right now. I’ve never ran into anything this serious. Now my nitrite is just under 5.0 which has never happened in 4 years of having this tank. I added live bacteria but only about a third of what is recommended because I read that it would help lower the nitrite. Not sure if that’s a good call but the only other thing I have on hand is stress guard that says it reduces stress and ammonia toxicity and promotes healing but I haven’t added any because I don’t know if it would help or make things worse. Plus, after the water change I added carbon back in my filters to help get the medicine out and I’m sure that would filter out anything I add right now

 

[Siss1494]

 

[Siss1494]

Nitrate - 0
Nitrite - 5 (before water change, will check again soon)
Hardness - right between soft and hard
Alkalinity - 120
PH- 6.8

 

[Slaphppy7]

Nitrate - 0
Nitrite - 5 (before water change, will check again soon)
Hardness - right between soft and hard
Alkalinity - 120
PH- 6.8

What kind of test kit do you have?

I see no reading for ammonia

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Well I was wrong, my Molly still has a spot on the top of his head and the ends of his fins look white

That doesn't sound like ich, so adding the random med might be causing more harm than good. Ich is lots of tiny white dots, makes the fish look as though it's been sprinkled with salt, not one white patch or white-ish fins.
The other thing that has changed is that you said you got the molly recently - so it's very possible the molly bought some kind of illness or parasite with it. Did you get any other fish at the same time? Or just one molly?

I used the tablets that are sold at Walmart in a yellow box. Please, if anyone has advice it would be greatly appreciated!!

That doesn't help those of us who are not in the US - we don't know what Walmart sells or what medication could be sold in a yellow box. What's the name of the brand and medication on the box??
I'm suspecting that you bought some kind of antibiotic, and it's killed off a lot of the bacteria in your cycle, hence the high nitrite readings. You need to continue to do water changes until ammonia and nitrite are both at zero, and do a large water change any time there is ammonia or nitrite on the test results. The fish will die from ammonia and/nor nitrites long before ich or any other disease can kill them off.

 

[Siss1494]

I bought 2 black mollies. The other seems fine. I put the sick one in a quarantine tank and I guess I’ll keep him separate since I don’t really know what’s wrong with him. I did the 50% water change and now one of the gouramis seems to be doing better, he’s swimming around again. The other two are still at the top of the water barley moving and one of them looks like he’s almost dead. It looks like the ich medicine stained him..?? He has a spot on his lower fin that’s unnaturally blue. The medicine is called Jungle Ick Clear Tank Buddies. I really messed up using it! now I just hope I can save the gouramis. I added more aeration in the tank. When do you think I should do another water change? And do you have any other advice for me? By the way, thank you so much for taking the time to help!!

 

[KiwiGal77]

Firstly, don't beat yourself up - you did what you thought was right, and you came here for more advice as soon as you realised something wasn't good. You're doing the best you can for your fish now, and that's the main thing

With nitrites that high, I agree with AdoraBelle that it sounds like the medication has killed off some of your beneficial bacteria and caused your cycle to crash, which has skyrocketted ammonia and therefore nitrite. Personally I would be doing a large (75%) water change now, testing the water twice a day and doing a 75% change any time ammonia or nitrite is above 0. You may need to keep up with 50-75% daily water changes for a week or 2 until your tank re-establishes its bacteria population again. Make sure you're using a good water conditioner when adding in new water.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Was just typing much the same as @KiwiGal77 ! In between looking up the ingredients for the medication. I need @Colin_T 's input regarding the med, since it apparently contains malachite green along with several other things.
Either way, @Siss1494 , please don't beat yourself up or blame yourself! There's a ton to learn in this hobby and the learning curve is very steep, but you clearly care about your fish and want to save them.

I'd recommend the same water change schedule as above, I think the malachite green in the medication (is used as an antibacterial, as well as anti-parasitic) has knocked back your beneficial bacteria, causing ammonia spikes. If you can get hold of and use Seachem Prime as your water conditioner at least while this is going on, it will help keep your fish safe in between the daily water changes, since it's the only water conditioner that binds ammonia and nitrite for 24-48 hours, so even if the ammonia begins to rise before your next water change, it hopefully won't kill the fish. Prime seems expensive, but you only need a few drops so it lasts a long time, and can be a livesaver in these situations.
When you do a water change, make sure to use a declorinator of some kind (Prime if you can get hold of it, but use whatever water conditioner you have for now! and to match the temperature of the new water to the tank temperature before adding it.

We're happy to try to help! If anything changes, if you have more questions, or if you can get some clear photos of the fish and tank (we still have to check for any underlying disease) then don't be afraid to post! The more detail/photos, the better chance that someone can figure out what's been happening in the tank, and if you need any further treatment going forward.

 

[CarissaT]

Are you able to get your hands on zeolite? It looks like carbon but it’s white. If so, put a bag in the filter as the last stage if possible. It will absorb your ammonia and nitrites. Once it gets ‘full’ it will come back if your cycle hasn’t caught up, but with a decent amount of zeolite you will get 3-4 weeks ammonia free. At this point you need to avoid stressing your fish at any cost.